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Received: from willy by casper.infradead.org with local (Exim 4.94.2 #2 (Red Hat Linux)) id 1piF1S-00BSqh-9A; Fri, 31 Mar 2023 13:42:30 +0000 Date: Fri, 31 Mar 2023 14:42:30 +0100 From: Matthew Wilcox To: Kyungsan Kim Cc: david@redhat.com, lsf-pc@lists.linux-foundation.org, linux-mm@kvack.org, linux-fsdevel@vger.kernel.org, linux-cxl@vger.kernel.org, a.manzanares@samsung.com, viacheslav.dubeyko@bytedance.com, dan.j.williams@intel.com, seungjun.ha@samsung.com, wj28.lee@samsung.com Subject: Re: RE: FW: [LSF/MM/BPF TOPIC] SMDK inspired MM changes for CXL Message-ID: References: <7c7933df-43da-24e3-2144-0551cde05dcd@redhat.com> <20230331114220.400297-1-ks0204.kim@samsung.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20230331114220.400297-1-ks0204.kim@samsung.com> X-Rspam-User: X-Rspamd-Server: rspam03 X-Stat-Signature: xc97njgjnbkqtdrbn3quo4xsru3c7hw3 X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 7E64918000C X-HE-Tag: 1680270161-104831 X-HE-Meta: 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 2j/Jzp/H nD5ulGhYBkZdiczje4INxPtmzTDKbdM2deKSG9vq4AieaTY6/lLSqAllJ6jPUQxHxsKMAQe81Eav9wuyezLVS/jh1RRgMq2OCH9vwvIuAdVlQRVvH0VXx6PwbdPWDhFHyOfwcetbrPY78gTeOeOCsHcL4DQ== X-Bogosity: Ham, tests=bogofilter, spamicity=0.000000, version=1.2.4 Sender: owner-linux-mm@kvack.org Precedence: bulk X-Loop: owner-majordomo@kvack.org List-ID: On Fri, Mar 31, 2023 at 08:42:20PM +0900, Kyungsan Kim wrote: > Given our experiences/design and industry's viewpoints/inquiries, > I will prepare a few slides in the session to explain > 1. Usecase - user/kernespace memory tiering for near/far placement, memory virtualization between hypervisor/baremetal OS > 2. Issue - movability(movable/unmovable), allocation(explicit/implicit), migration(intented/unintended) > 3. HW - topology(direct, switch, fabric), feature(pluggability,error-handling,etc) I think you'll find everybody else in the room understands these issues rather better than you do. This is hardly the first time that we've talked about CXL, and CXL is not the first time that people have proposed disaggregated memory, nor heterogenous latency/bandwidth systems. All the previous attempts have failed, and I expect this one to fail too. Maybe there's something novel that means this time it really will work, so any slides you do should focus on that. A more profitable discussion might be: 1. Should we have the page allocator return pages from CXL or should CXL memory be allocated another way? 2. Should there be a way for userspace to indicate that it prefers CXL memory when it calls mmap(), or should it always be at the discretion of the kernel? 3. Do we continue with the current ZONE_DEVICE model, or do we come up with something new?