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Fri, 20 Mar 2026 07:38:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost ([2603:7000:c00:3a00:365a:60ff:fe62:ff29]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id af79cd13be357-8cfc9089bdfsm176182585a.31.2026.03.20.07.38.05 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Fri, 20 Mar 2026 07:38:05 -0700 (PDT) Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2026 10:38:01 -0400 From: Johannes Weiner To: Jan Kara Cc: Yunzhao Li , linux-mm@kvack.org, Andrew Morton , linux-fsdevel@vger.kernel.org, Jesper Brouer , Suren Baghdasaryan Subject: Re: balance_dirty_pages() causes 40% IO PSI (full) with no drain benefit on 384 GB machine Message-ID: References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 25741100005 X-Stat-Signature: eyuz6odsh39azrs5bfb9mo7cnyymqw5r X-Rspam-User: X-Rspamd-Server: rspam06 X-HE-Tag: 1774017486-149441 X-HE-Meta: U2FsdGVkX18zsx04mfSRT8bDK85D4jH1jCbAkeJDyOz4L2VGaYH//DIz721dEAq4//ugChoweESWwNmogEpvHd/0V4D7x297Jt9slf10ITyMmPkm1MOXNASB3bPAaE5SSeWjMZV3dkr5W1sENOuRwLjrBM0dG+VB9Po+9Pgx4jQkFdfgEnU3FnqPo5rLmS1+8dvNWaE1YMotAZuCeYk7mF+XgUXVwuz0KVjgOb7Xz/oY4oCj8TBBNCgSL6cZraVoxv6JXYopuNui5AmIpsDRACDk0KUwDz/FL/GD4V8yVu1a+fOXJpS/0cSp62GQFlT6x/8/ASeo1v/zx6BmVchD99pG+nglteRWI7AgG5kwA6CbI3d4rIYw0udQiVoQPu1jG8Q7w2M9YMmIjREd89LJVEadMQRpQfmb03kFLMPBq1uzaRxnnobwnCUpM+7Gxwmimd8ilUGOlTVlpZjwllLSScggWbq4VadVePkWCUZg80yaEwq4b22x15Rr+h/GwPXHcI9LkxS6Tkn94GB89w3uERjsRY/WLixwsAi0wVgnsKSxjEspj5YloIaDaiTu9kX2GqGIpyax3mmdCCRYt2JCbudAVX0myFAvJT9YU/0wj1IDHnUY3xo98vk5/mobLR0mZ1r+XXnvmV1xDWS/2P4BgPQd0JlaSRWFpiVZmawHtEiXHAXCaCMTpK7vYI5CtvljvcAdxUwq1IdwTf4hxcotrDnBO9+fHUEne+/nCDDKBexmVB3mptVKlCwV1FNUDoo8NuBwJf7+BTO9oXOUzZECvwtUBKpKxAY9TkSSAniW/zcvr8R2hdLLUeZtf5epBsvpP+YXOc/XtjovRMwAZQ0wvuBOnufF7weWwAxca2WUZ3fN3QNJFR78pCxWVnbVBEfp3PWB/z0AqeRmJrXBZS0X66flIN63fQTXgMYcFFwwW0gKVWBBe6yjPy1+TmB8STTyK25KjY9PKOximsSRBR+ lYdFGM+8 NhfVuLa8HIQ0qHz9cyJSQgK/wCSb5EOtkh/+VXT2om+ufmE7yVB5P1JGya11i0esjCJXuql/FHvj7Dd/UQVZBWBwjJkyK/n3yR/FwXups7K2W9F6SlZXCRL5j2uXYnwJvNrY5gjapIlVGBeNVhtuIFcuBRXbw9U5UrFEmwTsM+FEvHTt2NJ7D6vQyGJIfplcVrHPws5J9cjsXg/eem3GcBXLYQ1WMEL+3JRuRGmvkwMFDFvNEW3X8+HTbgS+NDAwNNSaERx5fw1kwuarMgBalEZMr6ppXYYEsLQB4JkiJZKBO7Vg4NPEHjdPmO3j8nvXlQQQ+Gy2UmmomF7SnVMnzGfNbR9WIvon78vrYasUG7nyBXThF366F0NL7wicu2NJ0yyKO3kkOmgQ7kVdopbGcTA74mrMOp6xa/0ljKWv7qZB1Bsnu/2W3p1jEa0KPUHRBRxI+SZeB+aNqgkE= Sender: owner-linux-mm@kvack.org Precedence: bulk X-Loop: owner-majordomo@kvack.org List-ID: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Hello, On Thu, Mar 19, 2026 at 12:58:51PM +0100, Jan Kara wrote: > On Tue 17-03-26 15:53:51, Yunzhao Li wrote: > > 3. The freerun ceiling gates entry into the proportional > > throttle path. Even moderate sleeping shows up as IO PSI > > (io_schedule_timeout is accounted as IO stall). Dirty > > never hits the hard limit in our case. It sits in the > > proportional zone, but cumulative PSI from many tasks > > sleeping short durations is already 26-40% (full). Should > > the throttle path be skipped when sleeping cannot help > > drain? > > Perhaps bumping PSI when dirty throttling kicks in is not ideal measure > (because it doesn't necessarily mean the storage itself is maxed out, > besides flush worker not being able to saturate the storage there can be > also various block layer controllers arbitrarily throttling background > writeback) but again I'll let PSI guys to chime in here with their > opinions. What PSI is supposed to capture is lost productive time. IOW, it's not about device utilization, it's about whether tasks are being held up. That's the information it intends to collect, and it sounds like it's doing its job. If you get 40% IO full pressure, that means during 40% of wallclock time, the only / all runnable task(s) are waiting on the IO resource. It *is* influenced by suboptimal device utilization, but that's not an accident. That's a real cost experienced by the workload, after all.