DOC 2000 and GRUB

DOC 2000 and GRUB

[Mateo Anderson]

Hi

I have some problems booting Linux form DOC 2000 using GRUB.

I am using the PC104+ (with Zfx86 processor) and I made a
custom Linux on the hard drive, with libs and 
binares required for my project.

I want to transfers this to DOC 2000 (48Mb). I followed
instructions how to build a mtd driver. The Linux boots
fine from the HD and finds my DOC, where I created one
ext2 partition and copied all the files there.

Now I want to boot the system from the DOC without any
HD. First I used LILO, but I just could not get it to work.
I used the laterst version of LILO, the patched version from
M-sys, the patched version from mtd, ...

All I got was, "L" then "LI" and finally "L 40 40 40 ...".

Because I found many messages on this list, that GRUB works
fine I decided to try with it.
Yesterday I buil GRUB 0.92 with the patches found in the MTD.

I booted the system from the HD, loaded the GRUB firmware into
the DOC and rebooted the system.

It found the DOC2000 and I got the grub> prompt (The HD was
not connected!!!).

But when I connected the HD, I got (something like):
DOC 2000 at ....
Jumping to Grub

and then hangs.
If I disconect the HD, I get the grub> prompt.

Questions:
1) How to boot Linux from HD?
   - DO I remove the DOC, boot Linux and then insert DOC?
   - Can I boot the LInux to grub> prompt, and then connect
     the disk? (Dangerous!!)
2) I said I already copied everything on DOC. How can
   I boot that kernel? I tried with 
   grub> kernel (dc0,0)/myKernel root=/dev/nftla1
   GRUB display message something about invalid disk (or something
   like that).
3) Anything else I could try?

Oh, I did not use the latest version from the CVS, but a CVS 
snapshot with the date 07.28.2002.

Thank you and best regards,
Mateo

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Re: DOC 2000 and GRUB

[MAL]

I have exactly the same scenario, (same DOC size and everything).

When I boot with the firmware loaded and a HDD attached, it displays 
Jumping to Grub for about 15 seconds, then finally displays the grub>
prompt. Have you tried waiting?

However, once i've got to the grub> prompt, it doesn't recognise the dc
device.

Did you run aclocal, automake and autoconf as specified in the
README_DiskOnChip in patched grub?  I overlooked it first time, (but it
still worked as far as booting grub, just couldn't find the dc0 device),
so i'm about to try it again.

If you want to boot linux from the HDD again, remove the DOC address
selection jumper for your mainboard, boot, and put it back while the
system is at it's bootloader.

MAL


On Fri, 2002-09-06 at 07:01, Mateo Anderson wrote:
> Hi
> 
> I have some problems booting Linux form DOC 2000 using GRUB.
> 
> I am using the PC104+ (with Zfx86 processor) and I made a
> custom Linux on the hard drive, with libs and 
> binares required for my project.
> 
> I want to transfers this to DOC 2000 (48Mb). I followed
> instructions how to build a mtd driver. The Linux boots
> fine from the HD and finds my DOC, where I created one
> ext2 partition and copied all the files there.
> 
> Now I want to boot the system from the DOC without any
> HD. First I used LILO, but I just could not get it to work.
> I used the laterst version of LILO, the patched version from
> M-sys, the patched version from mtd, ...
> 
> All I got was, "L" then "LI" and finally "L 40 40 40 ...".
> 
> Because I found many messages on this list, that GRUB works
> fine I decided to try with it.
> Yesterday I buil GRUB 0.92 with the patches found in the MTD.
> 
> I booted the system from the HD, loaded the GRUB firmware into
> the DOC and rebooted the system.
> 
> It found the DOC2000 and I got the grub> prompt (The HD was
> not connected!!!).
> 
> But when I connected the HD, I got (something like):
> DOC 2000 at ....
> Jumping to Grub
> 
> and then hangs.
> If I disconect the HD, I get the grub> prompt.
> 
> Questions:
> 1) How to boot Linux from HD?
>    - DO I remove the DOC, boot Linux and then insert DOC?
>    - Can I boot the LInux to grub> prompt, and then connect
>      the disk? (Dangerous!!)
> 2) I said I already copied everything on DOC. How can
>    I boot that kernel? I tried with 
>    grub> kernel (dc0,0)/myKernel root=/dev/nftla1
>    GRUB display message something about invalid disk (or something
>    like that).
> 3) Anything else I could try?
> 
> Oh, I did not use the latest version from the CVS, but a CVS 
> snapshot with the date 07.28.2002.
> 
> Thank you and best regards,
> Mateo
> 
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> http://lists.infradead.org/mailman/listinfo/linux-mtd/

Re: DOC 2000 and GRUB

[Henrik Nordström]

On 6 Sep 2002, MAL wrote:

> If you want to boot linux from the HDD again, remove the DOC address
> selection jumper for your mainboard, boot, and put it back while the
> system is at it's bootloader.

Or use the patch recently posted on this list to make it possible to abort 
the loading of the grub firmware from the DoC.

Note: The jumer trick does not work on the mb I have. If a DoC is 
installed in the socket without a address selection jumper then the system 
hangs dead during POST.

Regards
Henrik

Re: DOC 2000 and GRUB

[Russ Dill]

> I booted the system from the HD, loaded the GRUB firmware into
> the DOC and rebooted the system.
> 
> It found the DOC2000 and I got the grub> prompt (The HD was
> not connected!!!).
> 
> But when I connected the HD, I got (something like):
> DOC 2000 at ....
> Jumping to Grub
> 
> and then hangs.
> If I disconect the HD, I get the grub> prompt.
> 
> Questions:
> 1) How to boot Linux from HD?
>    - DO I remove the DOC, boot Linux and then insert DOC?
>    - Can I boot the LInux to grub> prompt, and then connect
>      the disk? (Dangerous!!)
> 2) I said I already copied everything on DOC. How can
>    I boot that kernel? I tried with 
>    grub> kernel (dc0,0)/myKernel root=/dev/nftla1
>    GRUB display message something about invalid disk (or something
>    like that).
> 3) Anything else I could try?
> 

k, the grub firmware takes up a specific amount of space, if you just
load the grub firmware without thinking about this, you'll likely
overwrite important parts of your nftl partition. So you need to figure
out how many sectors your firmware takes up, nftl_format just past that,
erase the now unused sectors, and then load your firmware

Re: DOC 2000 and GRUB

[Henrik Nordstrom]

Russ Dill wrote:

> k, the grub firmware takes up a specific amount of space, if you just
> load the grub firmware without thinking about this, you'll likely
> overwrite important parts of your nftl partition. So you need to figure
> out how many sectors your firmware takes up, nftl_format just past that,
> erase the now unused sectors, and then load your firmware

Or wait until the new NFTL format is understood, and use the M-Sys DFORMAT 5.x 
program format the flash and install GRUB (plus reserve additional binary 
boot partition space if needed for future upgrades of GRUB)

Personally I am not very comfortable with using ntfl_format when even the 
documentation to ntfl_format says you really should be using the DFORMAT tool 
for formatting the flash.

Regards
Henrik

Re: DOC 2000 and GRUB

[David Woodhouse]

hno@marasystems.com said:
>  Or wait until the new NFTL format is understood, and use the M-Sys
> DFORMAT 5.x  program format the flash and install GRUB (plus reserve
> additional binary  boot partition space if needed for future upgrades
> of GRUB) 

Doesn't the current CVS code work with the new format?

--
dwmw2

Re: DOC 2000 and GRUB

[Mark Meade]

David Woodhouse wrote:
> hno@marasystems.com said:
> >  Or wait until the new NFTL format is understood, and use the M-Sys
> > DFORMAT 5.x  program format the flash and install GRUB (plus reserve
> > additional binary  boot partition space if needed for future upgrades
> > of GRUB)
>
> Doesn't the current CVS code work with the new format?

It seems to, on a DoC Millennium, anyway. 

After slightly modifying the Grub stage 2 code (bdev_diskonchip.c), I was 
able to get Grub to boot from a freshly 5.x dformatted DoC. 

This is the old "UnitSizeFactor" issue - this Millennium says the 
UnitSizeFactor is 0x00, which is assumed to mean the same thing as 0xFF.

I haven't tried any DoC 2000's that have a UnitSizeFactor that is not 0 or 
FF, but it looks like this should work as well, with the appropriate changes 
to bdev_diskonchip.c.

I'm guessing that many problems are caused by having the nftl module loaded 
during a fdisk, nftl_format, and/or doc_loadbios.

Following Henrik's advice to use DFORMAT to install GRUB, plus being *very* 
careful to make sure nftl is not loaded at inopportune times, seems to help.

Re: DOC 2000 and GRUB

[Henrik Nordstrom]

Mark Meade wrote:

> After slightly modifying the Grub stage 2 code (bdev_diskonchip.c), I was
> able to get Grub to boot from a freshly 5.x dformatted DoC.
>
> This is the old "UnitSizeFactor" issue - this Millennium says the
> UnitSizeFactor is 0x00, which is assumed to mean the same thing as 0xFF.
>
> I haven't tried any DoC 2000's that have a UnitSizeFactor that is not 0 or
> FF, but it looks like this should work as well, with the appropriate
> changes to bdev_diskonchip.c.

I tried to patch my GRUB to read 0x00 as 0xFF some days ago, but it failed 
miserably.. but I only changed the ifs around the message. Maybe there is 
other things that need to be changed?

(Un)fortunately I do not have a DoC system at the moment (had to deliver all 
we had to customers) so further testing will have to wait some time until we 
have more systems available.

Regards
Henrik

Re: DOC 2000 and GRUB

[Mark Meade]

Henrik Nordstrom wrote:
> I tried to patch my GRUB to read 0x00 as 0xFF some days ago, but it failed
> miserably.. but I only changed the ifs around the message. Maybe there is
> other things that need to be changed?

I don't think so -- all I did was accept UnitSizeFactors of both 0x0 and 
0xff.  No other changes were needed to make it work on a Millennium.

It's my understanding that there are some DoC 2000's that may have values 
other than 0x0 or 0xff.  In this case, we might need to move some of David's 
changes from nftlmount.c into Grub's bdev_diskonchip.c.

Re: DOC 2000 and GRUB

[Henrik Nordstrom]

Mark Meade wrote:
> Henrik Nordstrom wrote:
> > I tried to patch my GRUB to read 0x00 as 0xFF some days ago, but it
> > failed miserably.. but I only changed the ifs around the message. Maybe
> > there is other things that need to be changed?
>
> I don't think so -- all I did was accept UnitSizeFactors of both 0x0 and
> 0xff.  No other changes were needed to make it work on a Millennium.
>
> It's my understanding that there are some DoC 2000's that may have values
> other than 0x0 or 0xff.  In this case, we might need to move some of
> David's changes from nftlmount.c into Grub's bdev_diskonchip.c.

The one I tried on has 0x00.

Regards
Henrik

Re: DOC 2000 and GRUB

[Henrik Nordstrom]

David Woodhouse wrote:
> hno@marasystems.com said:
> >  Or wait until the new NFTL format is understood, and use the M-Sys
> > DFORMAT 5.x  program format the flash and install GRUB (plus reserve
> > additional binary  boot partition space if needed for future upgrades
> > of GRUB)
>
> Doesn't the current CVS code work with the new format?

Not the GRUB patch, not unless it has been updated in the last few days at 
least.

Regards
Henrik

Re: DOC 2000 and GRUB

[Mateo Anderson]

Hi MAL

>I have exactly the same scenario, (same DOC size and everything).
>
>When I boot with the firmware loaded and a HDD attached, it displays 
>Jumping to Grub for about 15 seconds, then finally displays the grub>
>prompt. Have you tried waiting?

Yes, I did (I took a shower in the mean time, but nothing ).

>However, once i've got to the grub> prompt, it doesn't recognise the dc
>device.

Well, I do not get the grub> prompt.
I tried typing something in without the prompt and sometimes it
reboots, sometimes it does nothing...

>Did you run aclocal, automake and autoconf as specified in the
>README_DiskOnChip in patched grub?  I overlooked it first time, (but it
>still worked as far as booting grub, just couldn't find the dc0 device),
>so i'm about to try it again.

I read the doc (aclocal && automake --add-missing && autoconf).
At first I had some problems with aclocal, automake and autoconf.
It complained about undefined macros, etc...
I downloaded the latest version of automake in autoconf and 
then it worked.
I compiled GRUB without any errors.

>If you want to boot linux from the HDD again, remove the DOC address
>selection jumper for your mainboard, boot, and put it back while the
>system is at it's bootloader.

This jumper is on the PC104+ board?
(http://www.tri-m.com/products/tri-m_engineering/mz104+.html)
I'll have to read the documentation again.

Thanks for the tip.

One other thing I forgot to mention.
When I ran the fdisk, I could only create one partition,
and the fdisk shows the start and the end as 1!!!
Maybe this has something to do with the problem???

Regards,
Mateo

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Re: DOC 2000 and GRUB

[Mateo Anderson]

Hi Henrick

>> If you want to boot linux from the HDD again, remove the DOC address
>> selection jumper for your mainboard, boot, and put it back while the
>> system is at it's bootloader.
>
>Or use the patch recently posted on this list to make it possible to abort 
>the loading of the grub firmware from the DoC.

I read about this patch in the e-mails from the mtd. (I believe 
there were some arguing about that).

I thought about loading this grub firmware, but the only
problem is, that I cannot boot the system, with the DOC!!

Regards,
Mateo

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Re: DOC 2000 and GRUB

[Henrik Nordström]

On Fri, 6 Sep 2002, Mateo Anderson wrote:

> I read about this patch in the e-mails from the mtd. (I believe 
> there were some arguing about that).
> 
> I thought about loading this grub firmware, but the only
> problem is, that I cannot boot the system, with the DOC!!

Which makes that DoC trash until you find a way to reprogram it safely..

Regards
Henrik

Re: DOC 2000 and GRUB

[Mateo Anderson]

Hi Henrick

>> I thought about loading this grub firmware, but the only
>> problem is, that I cannot boot the system, with the DOC!!
>
>Which makes that DoC trash until you find a way to reprogram it safely..

Would this idea work?

Since I do not have any ISA card to put the DOC into, I would
put the DOC in the separate socket, which would have the pin
that leads to the CS (chip select) pin on the DOC connected
to the switch.
During the BIOS boot I would turn this switch off, so that
(hopefully!) the DOC would not be found (no grub code executed).
After the lilo boot prompt appears (from the HD) I would turn
this to ON and (hopefully) the Linux would find the DOC.

Comments?

Regards,
Mateo

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Re: DOC 2000 and GRUB

[Mateo Anderson]

Hi

Thank you all for replys and all the help.

>After slightly modifying the Grub stage 2 code (bdev_diskonchip.c), 
>I was able to get Grub to boot from a freshly 5.x dformatted DoC. 

Is this modified version comitted in the cvs?

>I haven't tried any DoC 2000's that have a UnitSizeFactor that is 
>not 0 or FF, but it looks like this should work as well, with 
>the appropriate changes to bdev_diskonchip.c.

>I'm guessing that many problems are caused by having the nftl 
>module loaded during a fdisk, nftl_format, and/or doc_loadbios.

Are you referring to kernel modules?
If so, I have these build in (no modules), as suggested by 
DOC and GRUB HOW-TO.

>Following Henrik's advice to use DFORMAT to install GRUB, plus being 
>*very* careful to make sure nftl is not loaded at inopportune times,
>seems to help.

Now I have so much information that I need to sort them out.

Steps:
1) Boot DOS and use DFORMAT 5.x to format the DOC, with 
   the appropriate space for the GRUB firmware (check the
   size of the stage1 file).
2) Boot to Linux, use the doc_loadbios to load the GRUB 
   firmware (or use DFORMAT - what parameters??).
3) Format the /dev/nftla.
4) Copy everything to the /dev/nftla1.
5) Boot from DOC.

Is this correct?

Regards,
Mateo

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Re: DOC 2000 and GRUB

[Mark Meade]

Mateo Anderson wrote:
> Is this modified version comitted in the cvs?

No, I just started experimenting (with Grub) yesterday.  Things appear to be 
working great on the DoC Millennium, but I haven't done enough testing to be 
confident enough to submit a patch.  

> >I'm guessing that many problems are caused by having the nftl
> >module loaded during a fdisk, nftl_format, and/or doc_loadbios.
>
> Are you referring to kernel modules?
> If so, I have these build in (no modules), as suggested by
> DOC and GRUB HOW-TO.

Yes.  I'm thinking about revising the how-to to suggest using modules for the 
development system, and built-in for the kernel booting from the DoC.  
Alternatively, you could use the built-in stuff all the time, but make sure 
to reboot often:

http://lists.infradead.org/pipermail/linux-mtd/2002-June/005123.html

Wolfgang Denk submitted a patch to address this problem; it sounds like it 
would eliminate the need to reboot:

http://lists.infradead.org/pipermail/linux-mtd/2002-August/005831.html

Being able to use DFORMAT to install GRUB and do the NFTL format eliminates 
the need to use both doc_loadbios and nftl_format, and should make the choice 
of built-in or module irrelevant.  However, Wolfgang's patch still seems to a 
very good idea.

> Steps:
> 1) Boot DOS and use DFORMAT 5.x to format the DOC, with
>    the appropriate space for the GRUB firmware (check the
>    size of the stage1 file).
> 2) Boot to Linux, use the doc_loadbios to load the GRUB
>    firmware (or use DFORMAT - what parameters??).
> 3) Format the /dev/nftla.
> 4) Copy everything to the /dev/nftla1.
> 5) Boot from DOC.
>
> Is this correct?

Close.  I've been doing the following (with some Grub modifications):

1) dformat /win:xxxx /BDKF0:grub_firmware

Use dformat 5.x to install grub, and the NFTL format.  You'll end up with one 
FAT partition on the DoC.  This eliminates the need to use "doc_loadbios" and 
"nftl_format".

2) It's necessary (on my PC) to turn it off, rather than just rebooting.  The 
howto explains why this is required.

3) boot to Linux, fdisk, mke2fs, copy everything to /dev/nftla1

4) boot from DoC

Re: DOC 2000 and GRUB

[Henrik Nordstrom]

Mateo Anderson wrote:

> Steps:
> 1) Boot DOS and use DFORMAT 5.x to format the DOC, with
>    the appropriate space for the GRUB firmware (check the
>    size of the stage1 file).

DFORMAT 5.x automatically allocates the needed space. You only need to care 
about space if you want to reserve additional space in the binary boot flash 
partition to allow for upgrades to a bigger GRUB firmware in the future.

> 2) Boot to Linux, use the doc_loadbios to load the GRUB
>    firmware (or use DFORMAT - what parameters??).

Use DFORMAT. doc_loadbios is for "advanced users" who have read the 
documentation shipped with the M-Sys 5.X tools and knows the current 
limitations of the doc_loadbios command and it's bad interactions with the 
nftl Linux driver..

Note: DFORMAT can also be used to upgrade the boot firmware without destroying 
the NFTL disk flash partition, provided the new boot firmware fits in the 
reserved binary flash partition that is..

> 3) Format the /dev/nftla.

This would be

3) Partition /dev/nftla using Linux fdisk.

The NFTL is already formatted by DFORMAT, and a single DOS partition covering 
the whole flash have been created and formatted.

> 4) Copy everything to the /dev/nftla1.
> 5) Boot from DOC.
>
> Is this correct?

More or less.

Regards
Henrik