Few enhancement ideas

Few enhancement ideas

[Amit Kucheria]

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Hi,

Being our first post to this list, I would like to introduce ourselves
as part of the team behind the Nokia 770 (www.nokia.com/770). We have
been preoccupied with the product launch, but now we will be able to
participate, starting with the Ottawa Linux Symposium.

Team contributions
==================
The Nokia 770 Linux team has made many contributions to the Linux-OMAP
port, some of the PM-specific ones being:

- Dynamic tick patch by Tony Lindgren
(http://www.muru.com/linux/dyntick/): Initially for
the OMAP architecture followed by the recent x86 port
- Clock framework for the OMAP architecture - Thanks to Tuukka Tikkanen
- PM-enabling various drivers in the mach-omap tree

The Product
===========
Nokia 770 is powered by an OMAP1710 on a custom board. The device will
ship with a 1500mAh battery which will give a continuous browsing
use-time (WLAN or Bluetooth) of 3hrs. The device needed to be
instant-ON, so we have used run-time power management. This gives us an
official 'standby-time' of 7 days. All the drivers make extensive use of
the clock framework and release clocks when peripheral is not in use.

Interests
=========
Here are a few ideas that we are planning to investigate in order to
address shortcomings in the current PM model with respect to system-wide
PM:

- Regulator framework: similar to clock framework HAL
- Generic framework for system-wide constraints: to handle constraints
outside bus control
- PM framework: Enhance PM framework to allow flexible policy control.
Like DPM?
- User space API: Requires study

Are these ideas of interest to the PM community or Nokia-specific?

Contacts
========
We will be in Ottawa 16.07.05 - 24.07.05. It would be nice to meet
others on this list to discuss these ideas further.

Have a good day.

Regards,
Amit
-- 
Amit Kucheria <amit.kucheria@nokia.com>
Nokia

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Re: Few enhancement ideas

[Jordan Crouse]

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> - PM framework: Enhance PM framework to allow flexible policy control.
> Like DPM?
> 
> Are these ideas of interest to the PM community or Nokia-specific?
 
No, this is very much interesting to many of us.  We were having some lively
debates, and then it kind of died out.  I suppose that the PM gurus will
discuss this at OLS and give us a report.

-- 
Jordan Crouse
Senior Linux Engineer
AMD - Personal Connectivity Solutions Group
<www.amd.com/embeddedprocessors>


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Re: Few enhancement ideas

[david-b]

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> The Product
> ===========
> Nokia 770 is powered by an OMAP1710 on a custom board. The device will
> ship with a 1500mAh battery which will give a continuous browsing
> use-time (WLAN or Bluetooth) of 3hrs. The device needed to be
> instant-ON, so we have used run-time power management. This gives us an
> official 'standby-time' of 7 days. All the drivers make extensive use of
> the clock framework and release clocks when peripheral is not in use.

... and all that running Linux!  The last rumor I heard was that
it might base on the 2.6.12 kernel. I look forward to seeing one
of these, so I'll know for sure!

For those unfamiliar with OMAP, http://linux.omap.com is a place
to start ... there's a Linux-OMAP mailing list and patches (such
as 2.6.13-rc1-omap1) in a GIT repository, many of which have made
their way into kernel.org releases.  It's a family of ARM SOC
processors that's very power-efficient.


> Interests
> =========
> Here are a few ideas that we are planning to investigate in order to
> address shortcomings in the current PM model with respect to system-wide
> PM:
>
> - Regulator framework: similar to clock framework HAL

Perhaps you could elaborate in a separate email thread?

> - Generic framework for system-wide constraints: to handle constraints
> outside bus control
> - PM framework: Enhance PM framework to allow flexible policy control.
> Like DPM?
> - User space API: Requires study
>
> Are these ideas of interest to the PM community or Nokia-specific?

General interest!

I'll be very glad to see a more cross-pollination from that part
of the embedded Linux world.  Laptops get plenty of attention,
but there's more to Linux than that.  :)

- Dave


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Re: Few enhancement ideas

[Leo L. Schwab]

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On Wed, Jul 13, 2005 at 08:52:55PM +0300, Amit Kucheria wrote:
> The Nokia 770 Linux team has made many contributions to the Linux-OMAP
> port, some of the PM-specific ones being:
> 
> - Dynamic tick patch by Tony Lindgren
> (http://www.muru.com/linux/dyntick/): Initially for
> the OMAP architecture followed by the recent x86 port
> - Clock framework for the OMAP architecture - Thanks to Tuukka Tikkanen
>   ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> - PM-enabling various drivers in the mach-omap tree
> 
	My thanks to you and Tuukka Tikkanen as well.  I took the ARM clock
API framework you developed for the OMAP, hacked it to shreds and got it
working on the Freescale i.MX1.

	Some clocks on the i.MX1 are always running, so when they're unused,
I elected to spin them down the slowest available speed, saving a bit more
power.  I also keep a copy of the requested target frequency so that when
parent clocks get changed, I can keep the child clocks running as close as
possible to the originally requested speed.  This is useful for stuff like
the I2C bus and audio clocks, and really darned helpful in keeping the
console serial port working correctly.

	When you were implementing the framework, did you have any thoughts
about where the initial clock frequencies "should" come from?  It sounds
like a policy issue, and therefore compiling it into the kernel (as you've
done in your OMAP implementation) is The Wrong Thing.  But it's not at all
clear where else it could go.

	Again, my thanks.  It was tons of help.

					Schwab

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Re: Few enhancement ideas

[Igor Stoppa]

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Hi,

On Wed, 2005-07-13 at 11:38 -0700, ext
db@adsl-69-107-32-110.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net wrote:
> > The Product
> > ===========
> > Nokia 770 is powered by an OMAP1710 on a custom board. 
[snip]
> ... and all that running Linux!  The last rumor I heard was that
> it might base on the 2.6.12 kernel. I look forward to seeing one
> of these, so I'll know for sure!
Yes, we'll bring some with us.

> For those unfamiliar with OMAP, http://linux.omap.com is a place
> to start ... there's a Linux-OMAP mailing list and patches (such
> as 2.6.13-rc1-omap1) in a GIT repository, many of which have made
> their way into kernel.org releases.  It's a family of ARM SOC
> processors that's very power-efficient.
> 
> 
> > Interests
> > =========
> > Here are a few ideas that we are planning to investigate in order to
> > address shortcomings in the current PM model with respect to system-wide
> > PM:
> >
> > - Regulator framework: similar to clock framework HAL
> 
> Perhaps you could elaborate in a separate email thread?
As Amit wrote we've been very busy till now, but we plan to elaborate an articulated proposal

> > - Generic framework for system-wide constraints: to handle constraints
> > outside bus control
> > - PM framework: Enhance PM framework to allow flexible policy control.
> > Like DPM?
> > - User space API: Requires study
> >
> > Are these ideas of interest to the PM community or Nokia-specific?
> 
> General interest!
> 
> I'll be very glad to see a more cross-pollination from that part
> of the embedded Linux world.  Laptops get plenty of attention,
> but there's more to Linux than that.  :)
> 
> - Dave
> 

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Re: Few enhancement ideas

[Igor Stoppa]

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On Thu, 2005-07-14 at 14:56 -0700, ext Leo L. Schwab wrote:
[snip]
> 	When you were implementing the framework, did you have any thoughts
> about where the initial clock frequencies "should" come from?  It sounds
> like a policy issue, and therefore compiling it into the kernel (as you've
> done in your OMAP implementation) is The Wrong Thing.  But it's not at all
> clear where else it could go.
We agree on that: it looks like a policy and the way to provide the
means to configure it is something that should be discussed.

We are still considering a few implementation options.

igor

> 
> 	Again, my thanks.  It was tons of help.
> 
> 					Schwab
> _______________________________________________
> linux-pm mailing list
> linux-pm@lists.osdl.org
> https://lists.osdl.org/mailman/listinfo/linux-pm

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Re: Few enhancement ideas

[Pavel Machek]

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Hi!

> Being our first post to this list, I would like to introduce ourselves
> as part of the team behind the Nokia 770 (www.nokia.com/770). We have
> been preoccupied with the product launch, but now we will be able to
> participate, starting with the Ottawa Linux Symposium.

That's definitely nice machine...

> The Product
> ===========
> Nokia 770 is powered by an OMAP1710 on a custom board. The device will
> ship with a 1500mAh battery which will give a continuous browsing
> use-time (WLAN or Bluetooth) of 3hrs. The device needed to be
> instant-ON, so we have used run-time power management. This gives us
> an

Would not suspend-to-RAM be enough? Or does machine need to continue
loading pages when it is "turned off"?

> Contacts
> ========
> We will be in Ottawa 16.07.05 - 24.07.05. It would be nice to meet
> others on this list to discuss these ideas further.

I would like to meet you, if only to see those beasts.

								Pavel
-- 
teflon -- maybe it is a trademark, but it should not be.

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Re: Few enhancement ideas

[Amit Kucheria]

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On Sun, 2005-07-17 at 04:43 +0200, ext Pavel Machek wrote:


> > Contacts
> > ========
> > We will be in Ottawa 16.07.05 - 24.07.05. It would be nice to meet
> > others on this list to discuss these ideas further.
> 
> I would like to meet you, if only to see those beasts.
> 

Due to airline scheduling and a case of missed flights, we have only
just arrived in Ottawa. Maybe we could meet some time before the OLS?

Regards,
Amit

-- 
Amit Kucheria <amit.kucheria@nokia.com>
Nokia

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