From: Wols Lists <antlists@youngman.org.uk>
To: "Ravi (Tom) Hale" <ravi@hale.ee>, linux-raid@vger.kernel.org
Subject: Re: Fault tolerance with badblocks
Date: Sat, 6 May 2017 14:00:53 +0100 [thread overview]
Message-ID: <590DC905.60207@youngman.org.uk> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <bd917050-cf73-6922-bb20-c5ccf02ba51c@hale.ee>
On 06/05/17 12:21, Ravi (Tom) Hale wrote:
>> Bear in mind also, that any *within* *spec* drive can have an "accident"
>> > every 10TB and still be considered perfectly okay. Which means that if
>> > you do what you are supposed to do (rewrite the block) you're risking
>> > the drive remapping the block - and getting closer to the drive bricking
>> > itself. But if you trap the error yourself and add it to the badblocks
>> > list, you are risking throwing away perfectly decent blocks that just
>> > hiccuped.
> For hiccups, having a bad-read-count for each suspected-bad block could
> be sensible. If that number goes above <small-threshold> it's very
> likely that the block is indeed bad and should be avoided in future.
Except you have the second law of thermodynamics in play - "what man
proposes, nature opposes". This could well screw up big time.
DRAM memory needs to be refreshed by a read-write cycle every few
nanoseconds. Hard drives are the same, actually, except that the
interval is measured in years, not nanoseconds. Fill your brand new hard
drive with data, then hammer it gently over a few years. Especially if a
block's neighbours are repeatedly rewritten but this particular block is
never touched, it is likely to become unreadable.
So it will fail your test - reads will repeatedly fail - but if the
firmware was given a look-in (by rewriting it) it wouldn't be remapped.
And as Nix said, once a drive starts getting a load of errors, chances
are something is catastrophically wrong and things are going to get
exponentially worse.
Cheers,
Wol
next prev parent reply other threads:[~2017-05-06 13:00 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 69+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
2017-05-04 10:04 Fault tolerance in RAID0 with badblocks Ravi (Tom) Hale
2017-05-04 13:44 ` Wols Lists
2017-05-05 4:03 ` Fault tolerance " Ravi (Tom) Hale
2017-05-05 19:20 ` Anthony Youngman
2017-05-06 11:21 ` Ravi (Tom) Hale
2017-05-06 13:00 ` Wols Lists [this message]
2017-05-08 14:50 ` Nix
2017-05-08 18:00 ` Anthony Youngman
2017-05-09 10:11 ` David Brown
2017-05-09 10:18 ` Nix
2017-05-08 19:02 ` Phil Turmel
2017-05-08 19:52 ` Nix
2017-05-08 20:27 ` Anthony Youngman
2017-05-09 9:53 ` Nix
2017-05-09 11:09 ` David Brown
2017-05-09 11:27 ` Nix
2017-05-09 11:58 ` David Brown
2017-05-09 17:25 ` Chris Murphy
2017-05-09 19:44 ` Wols Lists
2017-05-10 3:53 ` Chris Murphy
2017-05-10 4:49 ` Wols Lists
2017-05-10 17:18 ` Chris Murphy
2017-05-16 3:20 ` NeilBrown
2017-05-10 5:00 ` Dave Stevens
2017-05-10 16:44 ` Edward Kuns
2017-05-10 18:09 ` Chris Murphy
2017-05-09 20:18 ` Nix
2017-05-09 20:52 ` Wols Lists
2017-05-10 8:41 ` David Brown
2017-05-09 21:06 ` A sector-of-mismatch warning patch (was Re: Fault tolerance with badblocks) Nix
2017-05-12 11:14 ` Nix
2017-05-16 3:27 ` NeilBrown
2017-05-16 9:13 ` Nix
2017-05-16 21:11 ` NeilBrown
2017-05-16 21:46 ` Nix
2017-05-18 0:07 ` Shaohua Li
2017-05-19 4:53 ` NeilBrown
2017-05-19 10:31 ` Nix
2017-05-19 16:48 ` Shaohua Li
2017-06-02 12:28 ` Nix
2017-05-19 4:49 ` NeilBrown
2017-05-19 10:32 ` Nix
2017-05-19 16:55 ` Shaohua Li
2017-05-21 22:00 ` NeilBrown
2017-05-09 19:16 ` Fault tolerance with badblocks Phil Turmel
2017-05-09 20:01 ` Nix
2017-05-09 20:57 ` Wols Lists
2017-05-09 21:22 ` Nix
2017-05-09 21:23 ` Phil Turmel
2017-05-09 21:32 ` NeilBrown
2017-05-10 19:03 ` Nix
2017-05-09 16:05 ` Chris Murphy
2017-05-09 17:49 ` Wols Lists
2017-05-10 3:06 ` Chris Murphy
2017-05-08 20:56 ` Phil Turmel
2017-05-09 10:28 ` Nix
2017-05-09 10:50 ` Reindl Harald
2017-05-09 11:15 ` Nix
2017-05-09 11:48 ` Reindl Harald
2017-05-09 16:11 ` Nix
2017-05-09 16:46 ` Reindl Harald
2017-05-09 7:37 ` David Brown
2017-05-09 9:58 ` Nix
2017-05-09 10:28 ` Brad Campbell
2017-05-09 10:40 ` Nix
2017-05-09 12:15 ` Tim Small
2017-05-09 15:30 ` Nix
2017-05-05 20:23 ` Peter Grandi
2017-05-05 22:14 ` Nix
Reply instructions:
You may reply publicly to this message via plain-text email
using any one of the following methods:
* Save the following mbox file, import it into your mail client,
and reply-to-all from there: mbox
Avoid top-posting and favor interleaved quoting:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Posting_style#Interleaved_style
* Reply using the --to, --cc, and --in-reply-to
switches of git-send-email(1):
git send-email \
--in-reply-to=590DC905.60207@youngman.org.uk \
--to=antlists@youngman.org.uk \
--cc=linux-raid@vger.kernel.org \
--cc=ravi@hale.ee \
/path/to/YOUR_REPLY
https://kernel.org/pub/software/scm/git/docs/git-send-email.html
* If your mail client supports setting the In-Reply-To header
via mailto: links, try the mailto: link
Be sure your reply has a Subject: header at the top and a blank line
before the message body.
This is a public inbox, see mirroring instructions
for how to clone and mirror all data and code used for this inbox;
as well as URLs for NNTP newsgroup(s).