Re: mac80211 interprets missing TX_ACK flag as tx fail

Re: mac80211 interprets missing TX_ACK flag as tx fail

[Ivo van Doorn]

On Friday 15 August 2008, Mikko Virkkil=E4 wrote:
> I'm moving the conversation over from rt2400-devel to linux-wireless.
> The last message (as of this writing) from the earlier conversation a=
t
> rt2400-devel can be found at http://tinyurl.com/6p9n7g with some more
> details.
>=20
> So to summarize the situation:=20
>=20
> - the rt73usb driver (in rt2x00) doesn't set IEEE80211_TX_STAT_ACK
>   because "frames which are uploaded to the hardware are not guarente=
ed
>   to be acked".

rt2500usb suffers from the same issue.

> - The mac80211 layer will set the IEEE80211_RADIOTAP_F_TX_FAIL if the=
=20
>   IEEE80211_TX_STAT_ACK flag is missing.=20
> - hostapd will interpret the IEEE80211_RADIOTAP_F_TX_FAIL as a failur=
e
>   to send
>=20
> This all results in hostapd reporting "MGMT (TX callback) fail" and
> making rt73usb not work in AP mode.=20
>=20
> I'm hoping that some decision can be reached on how to fix this so th=
at
> AP mode will work with the rt73.=20
>=20
> Just off the top of my head, one way of fixing this would be to make
> IEEE80211_TX_CTL_NO_ACK also work the other way around: Now it is use=
d
> to tell the lower level not to wait for an ACK. Perhaps it could also=
 be
> used by the lower level to tell higher levels that no ACK is ever goi=
ng
> to come e.g. because the hardware is incapable of supplying TX ACKs. =
The
> mac80211 layer would be changed to check for IEEE80211_TX_CTL_NO_ACK.=
 If
> the flag was set it would skip setting IEEE80211_RADIOTAP_F_TX_FAIL e=
ven
> when the IEEE80211_TX_STAT_ACK is missing.

Actually this isn't the complete picture, what you might need is a new =
flag
IEEE80211_TX_CTL_UNKNOWN which then informs mac80211 that the
frame has an unknown status, and that is something that could be passed=
 on to
userspace through radiotap later.

This is better then setting a global "supports ACK reporting" flag, bec=
ause in case
of rt61 one every x frames also has an unknown status because the txdon=
e interrupt
isn't happening for that frame. So that means you definately need a per=
-frame flag
to tell if the frame was acked, not-acked or if the status was unknown.

Ivo
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Re: mac80211 interprets missing TX_ACK flag as tx fail

[Mikko Virkkilä]

On Fri, 2008-08-15 at 19:58 +0200, Ivo van Doorn wrote:
> On Friday 15 August 2008, Mikko Virkkil=C3=A4 wrote:
> > I'm moving the conversation over from rt2400-devel to linux-wireles=
s.
> > The last message (as of this writing) from the earlier conversation=
 at
> > rt2400-devel can be found at http://tinyurl.com/6p9n7g with some mo=
re
> > details.
> >=20
> > So to summarize the situation:=20
> >=20
> > - the rt73usb driver (in rt2x00) doesn't set IEEE80211_TX_STAT_ACK
> >   because "frames which are uploaded to the hardware are not guaren=
teed
> >   to be acked".
>=20
> rt2500usb suffers from the same issue.
>=20
> > - The mac80211 layer will set the IEEE80211_RADIOTAP_F_TX_FAIL if t=
he=20
> >   IEEE80211_TX_STAT_ACK flag is missing.=20
> > - hostapd will interpret the IEEE80211_RADIOTAP_F_TX_FAIL as a fail=
ure
> >   to send
> >=20
> > This all results in hostapd reporting "MGMT (TX callback) fail" and
> > making rt73usb not work in AP mode.=20
> >=20
> > I'm hoping that some decision can be reached on how to fix this so =
that
> > AP mode will work with the rt73.=20
> >=20
> > Just off the top of my head, one way of fixing this would be to mak=
e
> > IEEE80211_TX_CTL_NO_ACK also work the other way around: Now it is u=
sed
> > to tell the lower level not to wait for an ACK. Perhaps it could al=
so be
> > used by the lower level to tell higher levels that no ACK is ever g=
oing
> > to come e.g. because the hardware is incapable of supplying TX ACKs=
=2E The
> > mac80211 layer would be changed to check for IEEE80211_TX_CTL_NO_AC=
K. If
> > the flag was set it would skip setting IEEE80211_RADIOTAP_F_TX_FAIL=
 even
> > when the IEEE80211_TX_STAT_ACK is missing.
>=20
> Actually this isn't the complete picture, what you might need is a ne=
w flag
> IEEE80211_TX_CTL_UNKNOWN which then informs mac80211 that the
> frame has an unknown status, and that is something that could be pass=
ed on to
> userspace through radiotap later.
>=20
> This is better then setting a global "supports ACK reporting" flag, b=
ecause in case
> of rt61 one every x frames also has an unknown status because the txd=
one interrupt
> isn't happening for that frame. So that means you definately need a p=
er-frame flag
> to tell if the frame was acked, not-acked or if the status was unknow=
n.
>=20
> Ivo

>From what I understand the IEEE80211_TX_CTL_NO_ACK which is in the
flags of the ieee80211_tx_info struct, could be set from the driver for
each frame just as currently (not) done with the IEEE80211_TX_STAT_ACK
flag.=20

- Mikko
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Re: mac80211 interprets missing TX_ACK flag as tx fail

[Ivo van Doorn]

On Friday 15 August 2008, Mikko Virkkil=C3=A4 wrote:
> On Fri, 2008-08-15 at 19:58 +0200, Ivo van Doorn wrote:
> > On Friday 15 August 2008, Mikko Virkkil=C3=A4 wrote:
> > > I'm moving the conversation over from rt2400-devel to linux-wirel=
ess.
> > > The last message (as of this writing) from the earlier conversati=
on at
> > > rt2400-devel can be found at http://tinyurl.com/6p9n7g with some =
more
> > > details.
> > >=20
> > > So to summarize the situation:=20
> > >=20
> > > - the rt73usb driver (in rt2x00) doesn't set IEEE80211_TX_STAT_AC=
K
> > >   because "frames which are uploaded to the hardware are not guar=
enteed
> > >   to be acked".
> >=20
> > rt2500usb suffers from the same issue.
> >=20
> > > - The mac80211 layer will set the IEEE80211_RADIOTAP_F_TX_FAIL if=
 the=20
> > >   IEEE80211_TX_STAT_ACK flag is missing.=20
> > > - hostapd will interpret the IEEE80211_RADIOTAP_F_TX_FAIL as a fa=
ilure
> > >   to send
> > >=20
> > > This all results in hostapd reporting "MGMT (TX callback) fail" a=
nd
> > > making rt73usb not work in AP mode.=20
> > >=20
> > > I'm hoping that some decision can be reached on how to fix this s=
o that
> > > AP mode will work with the rt73.=20
> > >=20
> > > Just off the top of my head, one way of fixing this would be to m=
ake
> > > IEEE80211_TX_CTL_NO_ACK also work the other way around: Now it is=
 used
> > > to tell the lower level not to wait for an ACK. Perhaps it could =
also be
> > > used by the lower level to tell higher levels that no ACK is ever=
 going
> > > to come e.g. because the hardware is incapable of supplying TX AC=
Ks. The
> > > mac80211 layer would be changed to check for IEEE80211_TX_CTL_NO_=
ACK. If
> > > the flag was set it would skip setting IEEE80211_RADIOTAP_F_TX_FA=
IL even
> > > when the IEEE80211_TX_STAT_ACK is missing.
> >=20
> > Actually this isn't the complete picture, what you might need is a =
new flag
> > IEEE80211_TX_CTL_UNKNOWN which then informs mac80211 that the
> > frame has an unknown status, and that is something that could be pa=
ssed on to
> > userspace through radiotap later.
> >=20
> > This is better then setting a global "supports ACK reporting" flag,=
 because in case
> > of rt61 one every x frames also has an unknown status because the t=
xdone interrupt
> > isn't happening for that frame. So that means you definately need a=
 per-frame flag
> > to tell if the frame was acked, not-acked or if the status was unkn=
own.
> >=20
> > Ivo
>=20
> >From what I understand the IEEE80211_TX_CTL_NO_ACK which is in the
> flags of the ieee80211_tx_info struct, could be set from the driver f=
or
> each frame just as currently (not) done with the IEEE80211_TX_STAT_AC=
K
> flag.=20

Yes, but my comment was regarding your proposal regarding the
"driver is incapable of supplying TX Acks to upper layer" which would
suggest it would be a global setting instead of a per-frame setting.
And my point was that you want this to be a per-frame setting similar
to IEEE80211_TX_CTL_NO_ACK

Ivo
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