From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.0 (2014-02-07) on aws-us-west-2-korg-lkml-1.web.codeaurora.org Received: from vger.kernel.org (vger.kernel.org [23.128.96.18]) by smtp.lore.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B4843CD6117 for ; Mon, 9 Oct 2023 17:29:51 +0000 (UTC) Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org via listexpand id S1377908AbjJIR3u (ORCPT ); Mon, 9 Oct 2023 13:29:50 -0400 Received: from lindbergh.monkeyblade.net ([23.128.96.19]:47788 "EHLO lindbergh.monkeyblade.net" rhost-flags-OK-OK-OK-OK) by vger.kernel.org with ESMTP id S1376865AbjJIR3t (ORCPT ); Mon, 9 Oct 2023 13:29:49 -0400 Received: from wout3-smtp.messagingengine.com (wout3-smtp.messagingengine.com [64.147.123.19]) by lindbergh.monkeyblade.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 6A2CAB7; Mon, 9 Oct 2023 10:29:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from compute5.internal (compute5.nyi.internal [10.202.2.45]) by mailout.west.internal (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3FF023200ABF; Mon, 9 Oct 2023 13:29:45 -0400 (EDT) Received: from imap50 ([10.202.2.100]) by compute5.internal (MEProxy); Mon, 09 Oct 2023 13:29:46 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=arndb.de; h=cc :cc:content-transfer-encoding:content-type:content-type:date :date:from:from:in-reply-to:in-reply-to:message-id:mime-version :references:reply-to:sender:subject:subject:to:to; s=fm2; t= 1696872584; x=1696958984; bh=mejXcwGQfT0tpAi1CMxM8a6dSz769zVrDpR e3Zv3jeE=; b=D1qWebS2k2U0evCYpdOgzBxFJcBKj9MfLvAJApIs9ldsFhjik2i vCBJIdon8Eqs3+n+PgdL+vqoj6lTAslaHVkX3iw28Kd1TwcU3K4uQSPZy9NLA4Ob bhQONNm98J79XmvvzKtZOMRzGsPrv1+PIEAWgBwvGWcq6M4oBb8XhaRdc89hJ5+7 5c6LCFYBMwvsMU6w7xCE4uvrLl0+Z3pjW2dqjgdD+Wnen5unkF+K/KOYm1vBkwSj +kpbWNW5qeA5rsuRm1+ArQxZy0ambewEHHJurLPzxRXL2wQLusN8CBF5OWOdWO8v J/i1vmRhoLc6mfa7dGPpTM341FYs7ZbpxCQ== DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= messagingengine.com; h=cc:cc:content-transfer-encoding :content-type:content-type:date:date:feedback-id:feedback-id :from:from:in-reply-to:in-reply-to:message-id:mime-version :references:reply-to:sender:subject:subject:to:to:x-me-proxy :x-me-proxy:x-me-sender:x-me-sender:x-sasl-enc; s=fm2; t= 1696872584; x=1696958984; bh=mejXcwGQfT0tpAi1CMxM8a6dSz769zVrDpR e3Zv3jeE=; b=W2zg/we/GTtRla9/22r+oZdLK3P6WruYsuSir3Ov2b2Ksug34mC 5tcc1k+n1N1ATSRKqZiQr1qjS3hcg0p8S+giTt/xIOAUaApGh3UixMnD7ZiQpOSI 3CO150X2VrCq0ndXVCUAXBS9AY+KXakjRFV+3otjy+TwiCdgcuaeoy22suq0R9VZ Q4TNLEfAYaRKBt4BerPe4RYCTaTrXeGvYmkZkapTd/Fguuh254eLY/RD3U/vF8d8 1iTGd50Zh0mR2MMrT/JnoiDeQQZAg7p5qTOQSwNVJTpB6Xd7l4cb0XeGH1oxrNr/ nlnaES6AtNpR8RtJ0McNY+8LrLwFDsNnb7Q== X-ME-Sender: X-ME-Proxy-Cause: gggruggvucftvghtrhhoucdtuddrgedvkedrheefgdduudefucetufdoteggodetrfdotf fvucfrrhhofhhilhgvmecuhfgrshhtofgrihhlpdfqfgfvpdfurfetoffkrfgpnffqhgen uceurghilhhouhhtmecufedttdenucesvcftvggtihhpihgvnhhtshculddquddttddmne cujfgurhepofgfggfkjghffffhvfevufgtgfesthhqredtreerjeenucfhrhhomhepfdet rhhnugcuuegvrhhgmhgrnhhnfdcuoegrrhhnugesrghrnhgusgdruggvqeenucggtffrrg htthgvrhhnpedtffdvueffffehudekgfdvveegvedvhffgffdviefggffhveeihffhveeu ueetueenucffohhmrghinhepghhithhhuhgsrdgtohhmpdeikehkmhhlrgdrohhrghenuc evlhhushhtvghrufhiiigvpedtnecurfgrrhgrmhepmhgrihhlfhhrohhmpegrrhhnuges rghrnhgusgdruggv X-ME-Proxy: Feedback-ID: i56a14606:Fastmail Received: by mailuser.nyi.internal (Postfix, from userid 501) id 4E15C1700089; Mon, 9 Oct 2023 13:29:44 -0400 (EDT) X-Mailer: MessagingEngine.com Webmail Interface User-Agent: Cyrus-JMAP/3.9.0-alpha0-958-g1b1b911df8-fm-20230927.002-g1b1b911d MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <3cb4bb96-1651-4179-9c32-507937282d7d@app.fastmail.com> In-Reply-To: <790BA488-B6F6-41ED-96EF-2089EF1C043B@xhero.org> References: <20231009141908.1767241-1-arnd@kernel.org> <790BA488-B6F6-41ED-96EF-2089EF1C043B@xhero.org> Date: Mon, 09 Oct 2023 19:29:11 +0200 From: "Arnd Bergmann" To: "Rodolfo Zitellini" , "Arnd Bergmann" Cc: "Jakub Kicinski" , Netdev , "Greg Kroah-Hartman" , linux-wireless@vger.kernel.org, "Johannes Berg" , linux-wpan@vger.kernel.org, "Michael Hennerich" , "Paolo Abeni" , "Eric Dumazet" , "David S . Miller" , linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org, "Doug Brown" Subject: Re: [PATCH 01/10] appletalk: remove localtalk and ppp support Content-Type: text/plain;charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Precedence: bulk List-ID: X-Mailing-List: linux-wireless@vger.kernel.org On Mon, Oct 9, 2023, at 18:49, Rodolfo Zitellini wrote: >> From: Arnd Bergmann >>=20 >> The last localtalk driver is gone now, and ppp support was never fully >> merged, so clean up the appletalk code by removing the obvious dead >> code paths. >>=20 >> Notably, this removes one of the two callers of the old .ndo_do_ioctl= () >> callback that was abused for getting device addresses and is now >> only used in the ieee802154 subsystem, which still uses the same tric= k. >>=20 >> The include/uapi/linux/if_ltalk.h header might still be required >> for building userspace programs, but I made sure that debian code >> search and the netatalk upstream have no references it it, so it >> should be fine to remove. >>=20 >> Signed-off-by: Arnd Bergmann > > Hi! > I=E2=80=99ve been working on a new LocalTalk interface driver for the = last=20 > couple months, do you think it would be possible to at least postpone=20 > the removal of LT a bit? > > It is a driver for an open source device called TashTalk=20 > (https://github.com/lampmerchant/tashtalk), which runs on a PIC micro=20 > that does all the LT interfacing, and communicates back via serial to=20 > the host system. My driver is relatively simple and works very well=20 > with netatalk 2.2 (which is still maintained and still has support for=20 > AppleTalk). The driver is basically complete and trsted and I was=20 > preparing to submit a patch. > > Still having LocalTalk in my view has many advantages for us=20 > enthusiasts that still want to bridge old machines to the current worl= d=20 > without modifications, for example for printing on modern printers,=20 > netbooting, sharing files and even tcp/ip. All this basically works ou= t=20 > of the box via the driver, Linux and available userspace tools=20 > (netatalk, macipgw). > > The old ISA cards supported by COPS were basically unobtanium even 20=20 > years ago, but the solution of using a PIC and a serial port is very=20 > robust and much more furure-proof. We also already have a device that=20 > can interface a modern machine directly via USB to LocalTalk. > > The development of the TashTalk has been also extensively discussed on=20 > thr 68KMLA forum=20 > (https://68kmla.org/bb/index.php?threads/modtashtalk-lt0-driver-for-li= nux.45031/) > > I hope the decision to remove LocalTalk can be reconsidered at least=20 > for the time being so there is a chance to submit a new, modern device=20 > making use of this stack. Nothing is decided, I'm just proposing my patch as a cleanup for now. It would be nice to still drop the ndo_do_ioctl function though, at least in some form. When your driver actually makes it into the kernel, you can find a different method of communicating the address between the socket interface and the device driver. I can see a few ways this could work out: - add a custom callback pointer to struct atalk_iface to get and set the address for phase1 probing instead of going through the ioctl - rewrite the probing logic in aarp.c more widely, and improve the userspace interface in the process by introducing a netlink interface - Move your entire driver into userspace and go to the kernel using tun/tap. This has the added benefit of avoiding a lot of the complexity of the tty line discipline code you have. Arnd