[RFC] wireless-regdb: Add A band in IL

[RFC] wireless-regdb: Add A band in IL

[Emmanuel Grumbach]

A band in allowed in IL, according to official document issued by the Ministry
of Communications: http://www.moc.gov.il/sip_storage/FILES/1/1061.pdf.

5150 - 5250 200mW e.i.r.p. OUTDOOR forbidden
5250 - 5350 200mW e.i.r.p. OUTDOOR forbidden DFS mandatory

40Mhz is allowed in A band for every WiFi-Alliance certified equipment.

***************************************************************
Not to be merged for the moment
***************************************************************

CC: Michael Green <Michael.Green@atheros.com>
CC: David Quan <David.Quan@atheros.com>
Signed-off-by: Emmanuel Grumbach <emmanuel.grumbach@intel.com>
---
 db.txt |    2 ++
 1 files changed, 2 insertions(+), 0 deletions(-)

diff --git a/db.txt b/db.txt
index e63a43e..d49c397 100644
--- a/db.txt
+++ b/db.txt
@@ -319,6 +319,8 @@ country IE:
 
 country IL:
 	(2402 - 2482 @ 40), (N/A, 20)
+	(5150 - 5250 @ 40). (N/A, 200 mW), NO-OUTDOOR
+	(5250 - 5350 @ 40). (N/A, 200 mW), NO-OUTDOOR, DFS
 
 country IN:
 	(2402 - 2482 @ 40), (N/A, 20)
-- 
1.6.4.2

---------------------------------------------------------------------
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Re: [RFC] wireless-regdb: Add A band in IL

[Luis R. Rodriguez]

On Tue, May 25, 2010 at 11:49 PM, Emmanuel Grumbach
<emmanuel.grumbach@intel.com> wrote:
> A band in allowed in IL, according to official document issued by the Ministry
> of Communications: http://www.moc.gov.il/sip_storage/FILES/1/1061.pdf.
>
> 5150 - 5250 200mW e.i.r.p. OUTDOOR forbidden
> 5250 - 5350 200mW e.i.r.p. OUTDOOR forbidden DFS mandatory
>
> 40Mhz is allowed in A band for every WiFi-Alliance certified equipment.
>
> ***************************************************************
> Not to be merged for the moment
> ***************************************************************
>
> CC: Michael Green <Michael.Green@atheros.com>
> CC: David Quan <David.Quan@atheros.com>
> Signed-off-by: Emmanuel Grumbach <emmanuel.grumbach@intel.com>
> ---
>  db.txt |    2 ++
>  1 files changed, 2 insertions(+), 0 deletions(-)
>
> diff --git a/db.txt b/db.txt
> index e63a43e..d49c397 100644
> --- a/db.txt
> +++ b/db.txt
> @@ -319,6 +319,8 @@ country IE:
>
>  country IL:
>        (2402 - 2482 @ 40), (N/A, 20)
> +       (5150 - 5250 @ 40). (N/A, 200 mW), NO-OUTDOOR
> +       (5250 - 5350 @ 40). (N/A, 200 mW), NO-OUTDOOR, DFS

I believe the one standing issue here is you are enabling HT40 on 5
GHz, how about enabling 2.4 GHz first, and then through a separate
patch and time/review we review the HT40 stuff, unless you are in no
rush to get 2.4 GHz enabled.

  Luis

RE: [RFC] wireless-regdb: Add A band in IL

[Grumbach, Emmanuel]

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Re: [RFC] wireless-regdb: Add A band in IL

[Luis R. Rodriguez]

On Wed, May 26, 2010 at 10:32 AM, Grumbach, Emmanuel
<emmanuel.grumbach@intel.com> wrote:
>>>  country IL:
>>>        (2402 - 2482 @ 40), (N/A, 20)
>>> +       (5150 - 5250 @ 40). (N/A, 200 mW), NO-OUTDOOR
>>> +       (5250 - 5350 @ 40). (N/A, 200 mW), NO-OUTDOOR, DFS
>>
>>I believe the one standing issue here is you are enabling HT40 on 5
>>GHz, how about enabling 2.4 GHz first, and then through a separate
>>patch and time/review we review the HT40 stuff, unless you are in no
>>rush to get 2.4 GHz enabled.
>>
>
> I am not following... HT40 on 2.4 GHz is already enabled...
> What should I enable in 2.4 GHz ?

Sorry I meant 5 GHz.

  Luis

RE: [RFC] wireless-regdb: Add A band in IL

[Grumbach, Emmanuel]

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Re: [RFC] wireless-regdb: Add A band in IL

[Luis R. Rodriguez]

On Wed, May 26, 2010 at 10:51 AM, Grumbach, Emmanuel
<emmanuel.grumbach@intel.com> wrote:
>>On Wed, May 26, 2010 at 10:32 AM, Grumbach, Emmanuel
>><emmanuel.grumbach@intel.com> wrote:
>>>>>  country IL:
>>>>>        (2402 - 2482 @ 40), (N/A, 20)
>>>>> +       (5150 - 5250 @ 40). (N/A, 200 mW), NO-OUTDOOR
>>>>> +       (5250 - 5350 @ 40). (N/A, 200 mW), NO-OUTDOOR, DFS
>>>>
>>>>I believe the one standing issue here is you are enabling HT40 on 5
>>>>GHz, how about enabling 2.4 GHz first, and then through a separate
>>>>patch and time/review we review the HT40 stuff, unless you are in no
>>>>rush to get 2.4 GHz enabled.
>>>>
>>>
>>> I am not following... HT40 on 2.4 GHz is already enabled...
>>> What should I enable in 2.4 GHz ?
>>
>>Sorry I meant 5 GHz.
>
> Actually 40GHz is less a problem in 5GHz than in 2.4GHz since in 2.4GHz
> I need to have a "Coexistence mechanism", which is not required in 5GHz.
> This Coexistence mechanism is apparently implemented by one OEM under the
> name "Clear Channel Assessment (CCA)".
>
> In short, I don't think there is any special issue with 40MHz in 5GHz, but
> I may miss something here... In any case, I have no problem with sending
> a patch that allows 5GHz in 20MHz for the moment.
> I can also have a look at the EEPROM in our NICs which is supposed to have
> all the needed limitations. Details to follow tomorrow.

OK thanks for the clarification Emmanuel, please give Michael some
time to review.

  Luis

Re: [RFC] wireless-regdb: Add A band in IL

[Emmanuel Grumbach]

> <emmanuel.grumbach@intel.com> wrote:
> >>On Wed, May 26, 2010 at 10:32 AM, Grumbach, Emmanuel
> >><emmanuel.grumbach@intel.com> wrote:
> >>>>>  country IL:
> >>>>>        (2402 - 2482 @ 40), (N/A, 20)
> >>>>> +       (5150 - 5250 @ 40). (N/A, 200 mW), NO-OUTDOOR
> >>>>> +       (5250 - 5350 @ 40). (N/A, 200 mW), NO-OUTDOOR, DFS
> >>>>
> >>>>I believe the one standing issue here is you are enabling HT40 on 5
> >>>>GHz, how about enabling 2.4 GHz first, and then through a separate
> >>>>patch and time/review we review the HT40 stuff, unless you are in no
> >>>>rush to get 2.4 GHz enabled.
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>> I am not following... HT40 on 2.4 GHz is already enabled...
> >>> What should I enable in 2.4 GHz ?
> >>
> >>Sorry I meant 5 GHz.
> >
> > Actually 40GHz is less a problem in 5GHz than in 2.4GHz since in 2.4GHz
> > I need to have a "Coexistence mechanism", which is not required in 5GHz.
> > This Coexistence mechanism is apparently implemented by one OEM under the
> > name "Clear Channel Assessment (CCA)".
> >
> > In short, I don't think there is any special issue with 40MHz in 5GHz, but
> > I may miss something here... In any case, I have no problem with sending
> > a patch that allows 5GHz in 20MHz for the moment.
> > I can also have a look at the EEPROM in our NICs which is supposed to have
> > all the needed limitations. Details to follow tomorrow.
>
> OK thanks for the clarification Emmanuel, please give Michael some
> time to review.
>


How much time ? :-)

] wireless-regdb: Add A band in IL

[Michael Green]

Hi All,

I agree it's okay to enable HT40 in 5GHz for Israel. 

I suggest the 2010 doc from Emmanuel be reference in the dbase so implementers are aware of the conditions by MOC for enabling HT20/HT40 in both bands during regulatory conformance of the product in Israel.



Michael Green
Atheros Communications, Inc.
mgreen@atheros.com
Desk:   +1-781-400-1491
Mobile: +1-508-380-4921

-----Original Message-----
From: Emmanuel Grumbach [mailto:egrumbach@gmail.com] 
Sent: Wednesday, June 02, 2010 3:47 PM
To: Luis R. Rodriguez
Cc: Grumbach, Emmanuel; linville@tuxdriver.com; linux-wireless@vger.kernel.org; Michael Green; David Quan
Subject: Re: [RFC] wireless-regdb: Add A band in IL

> <emmanuel.grumbach@intel.com> wrote:
> >>On Wed, May 26, 2010 at 10:32 AM, Grumbach, Emmanuel
> >><emmanuel.grumbach@intel.com> wrote:
> >>>>>  country IL:
> >>>>>        (2402 - 2482 @ 40), (N/A, 20)
> >>>>> +       (5150 - 5250 @ 40). (N/A, 200 mW), NO-OUTDOOR
> >>>>> +       (5250 - 5350 @ 40). (N/A, 200 mW), NO-OUTDOOR, DFS
> >>>>
> >>>>I believe the one standing issue here is you are enabling HT40 on 5
> >>>>GHz, how about enabling 2.4 GHz first, and then through a separate
> >>>>patch and time/review we review the HT40 stuff, unless you are in no
> >>>>rush to get 2.4 GHz enabled.
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>> I am not following... HT40 on 2.4 GHz is already enabled...
> >>> What should I enable in 2.4 GHz ?
> >>
> >>Sorry I meant 5 GHz.
> >
> > Actually 40GHz is less a problem in 5GHz than in 2.4GHz since in 2.4GHz
> > I need to have a "Coexistence mechanism", which is not required in 5GHz.
> > This Coexistence mechanism is apparently implemented by one OEM under the
> > name "Clear Channel Assessment (CCA)".
> >
> > In short, I don't think there is any special issue with 40MHz in 5GHz, but
> > I may miss something here... In any case, I have no problem with sending
> > a patch that allows 5GHz in 20MHz for the moment.
> > I can also have a look at the EEPROM in our NICs which is supposed to have
> > all the needed limitations. Details to follow tomorrow.
>
> OK thanks for the clarification Emmanuel, please give Michael some
> time to review.
>


How much time ? :-)

Re: [RFC] wireless-regdb: Add A band in IL

[Luis R. Rodriguez]

On Wed, Jun 2, 2010 at 12:46 PM, Emmanuel Grumbach <egrumbach@gmail.com> wrote:
>> <emmanuel.grumbach@intel.com> wrote:
>> >>On Wed, May 26, 2010 at 10:32 AM, Grumbach, Emmanuel
>> >><emmanuel.grumbach@intel.com> wrote:
>> >>>>>  country IL:
>> >>>>>        (2402 - 2482 @ 40), (N/A, 20)
>> >>>>> +       (5150 - 5250 @ 40). (N/A, 200 mW), NO-OUTDOOR
>> >>>>> +       (5250 - 5350 @ 40). (N/A, 200 mW), NO-OUTDOOR, DFS
>> >>>>
>> >>>>I believe the one standing issue here is you are enabling HT40 on 5
>> >>>>GHz, how about enabling 2.4 GHz first, and then through a separate
>> >>>>patch and time/review we review the HT40 stuff, unless you are in no
>> >>>>rush to get 2.4 GHz enabled.
>> >>>>
>> >>>
>> >>> I am not following... HT40 on 2.4 GHz is already enabled...
>> >>> What should I enable in 2.4 GHz ?
>> >>
>> >>Sorry I meant 5 GHz.
>> >
>> > Actually 40GHz is less a problem in 5GHz than in 2.4GHz since in 2.4GHz
>> > I need to have a "Coexistence mechanism", which is not required in 5GHz.
>> > This Coexistence mechanism is apparently implemented by one OEM under the
>> > name "Clear Channel Assessment (CCA)".
>> >
>> > In short, I don't think there is any special issue with 40MHz in 5GHz, but
>> > I may miss something here... In any case, I have no problem with sending
>> > a patch that allows 5GHz in 20MHz for the moment.
>> > I can also have a look at the EEPROM in our NICs which is supposed to have
>> > all the needed limitations. Details to follow tomorrow.
>>
>> OK thanks for the clarification Emmanuel, please give Michael some
>> time to review.
>>
>
>
> How much time ? :-)

Seems he just finished and sent his notes to the list.

  Luis

Re: [RFC] wireless-regdb: Add A band in IL

[John W. Linville]

On Wed, May 26, 2010 at 09:49:29AM +0300, Emmanuel Grumbach wrote:
> A band in allowed in IL, according to official document issued by the Ministry
> of Communications: http://www.moc.gov.il/sip_storage/FILES/1/1061.pdf.
> 
> 5150 - 5250 200mW e.i.r.p. OUTDOOR forbidden
> 5250 - 5350 200mW e.i.r.p. OUTDOOR forbidden DFS mandatory
> 
> 40Mhz is allowed in A band for every WiFi-Alliance certified equipment.
> 
> ***************************************************************
> Not to be merged for the moment
> ***************************************************************
> 
> CC: Michael Green <Michael.Green@atheros.com>
> CC: David Quan <David.Quan@atheros.com>
> Signed-off-by: Emmanuel Grumbach <emmanuel.grumbach@intel.com>
> ---
>  db.txt |    2 ++
>  1 files changed, 2 insertions(+), 0 deletions(-)
> 
> diff --git a/db.txt b/db.txt
> index e63a43e..d49c397 100644
> --- a/db.txt
> +++ b/db.txt
> @@ -319,6 +319,8 @@ country IE:
>  
>  country IL:
>  	(2402 - 2482 @ 40), (N/A, 20)
> +	(5150 - 5250 @ 40). (N/A, 200 mW), NO-OUTDOOR
> +	(5250 - 5350 @ 40). (N/A, 200 mW), NO-OUTDOOR, DFS
>  
>  country IN:
>  	(2402 - 2482 @ 40), (N/A, 20)

Is this issue now settled?

John
-- 
John W. Linville		Someday the world will need a hero, and you
linville@tuxdriver.com			might be all we have.  Be ready.

Re: [RFC] wireless-regdb: Add A band in IL

[Emmanuel Grumbach]

Emmanuel Grumbach
egrumbach@gmail.com


On Fri, Jun 18, 2010 at 21:42, John W. Linville <linville@tuxdriver.com> wrote:
>
> On Wed, May 26, 2010 at 09:49:29AM +0300, Emmanuel Grumbach wrote:
> > A band in allowed in IL, according to official document issued by the Ministry
> > of Communications: http://www.moc.gov.il/sip_storage/FILES/1/1061.pdf.
> >
> > 5150 - 5250 200mW e.i.r.p. OUTDOOR forbidden
> > 5250 - 5350 200mW e.i.r.p. OUTDOOR forbidden DFS mandatory
> >
> > 40Mhz is allowed in A band for every WiFi-Alliance certified equipment.
> >
> > ***************************************************************
> > Not to be merged for the moment
> > ***************************************************************
> >
> > CC: Michael Green <Michael.Green@atheros.com>
> > CC: David Quan <David.Quan@atheros.com>
> > Signed-off-by: Emmanuel Grumbach <emmanuel.grumbach@intel.com>
> > ---
> >  db.txt |    2 ++
> >  1 files changed, 2 insertions(+), 0 deletions(-)
> >
> > diff --git a/db.txt b/db.txt
> > index e63a43e..d49c397 100644
> > --- a/db.txt
> > +++ b/db.txt
> > @@ -319,6 +319,8 @@ country IE:
> >
> >  country IL:
> >       (2402 - 2482 @ 40), (N/A, 20)
> > +     (5150 - 5250 @ 40). (N/A, 200 mW), NO-OUTDOOR
> > +     (5250 - 5350 @ 40). (N/A, 200 mW), NO-OUTDOOR, DFS
> >
> >  country IN:
> >       (2402 - 2482 @ 40), (N/A, 20)
>
> Is this issue now settled?

Yes, I think that Michael Green agreed for this patch. Once he will
reply to make sure, we will be able to move on to a real patch.

wireless-regdb: Add A band in IL - And general point regarding tx power limits in the dbase

[Michael Green]

Here are my comments on the proposed patch...

country IL:
> >       (2402 - 2482 @ 40), (N/A, 20)
> > +     (5150 - 5250 @ 40). (N/A, 200 mW), NO-OUTDOOR
> > +     (5250 - 5350 @ 40). (N/A, 200 mW), NO-OUTDOOR, DFS


a) I agree with channels above and enabling HT40 per above.

b) I think all entries in the dbase should be in dBm (not mW).   dBm vs. mW are absolutely equivalent. No reason to retain "mW" unit from the source docs.  I think this was agreed by all before, but wanted to reiterate. 

c) I don't understand why "Indoor/Outdoor" is stated in the table for any/all countries.   5150-5250 is globally allocated for indoor use.  So I am not reviewing/commenting on the indoor/outdoor comments in the dbase.


d) Reminder...Israel and most other countries state max tx power limit in 'EIRP' (ie takes into account actual antenna gain of the end device).  Therefore, the entire dbase must be clearly flagged so developers know the tx power limits in this dbase only apply when devices have 0dB (or negative) gain antennas.  

In other words, the software (or the hw/sw developer) must somehow reduce tx powers below the values in the dbase, dB-for-dB, when antenna+cable has positive gain.

The exception is FCC target power, where FCC (and the dBase) quotes "conducted power" rather than EIRP.

Issue d) is not a concern for manufacturers/developers who produce products that limit regulatory tx powers in the hw (factory set/limited). In that case they take into account actual antenna gains during original conformance testing and program in compliant tx powers into hw (and don't rely at all on the tx powers in the dbase).

But developers who don't have tx powers limited in hw, who actually use the tx power in the dbase, must take into account antenna gain as explained above, else the product may not comply with tx limits for most countries.  

Fine if you want to discuss point d) separately since it's a global issue (not limited to this particular IL patch).

tks,

Michael Green
Atheros Communications, Inc.
mgreen@atheros.com
Desk:   +1-781-400-1491
Mobile: +1-508-380-4921


-----Original Message-----
From: Emmanuel Grumbach [mailto:egrumbach@gmail.com] 
Sent: Sunday, June 20, 2010 1:41 AM
To: John W. Linville
Cc: Emmanuel Grumbach; linux-wireless@vger.kernel.org; Michael Green; David Quan
Subject: Re: [RFC] wireless-regdb: Add A band in IL

Emmanuel Grumbach
egrumbach@gmail.com


On Fri, Jun 18, 2010 at 21:42, John W. Linville <linville@tuxdriver.com> wrote:
>
> On Wed, May 26, 2010 at 09:49:29AM +0300, Emmanuel Grumbach wrote:
> > A band in allowed in IL, according to official document issued by the Ministry
> > of Communications: http://www.moc.gov.il/sip_storage/FILES/1/1061.pdf.
> >
> > 5150 - 5250 200mW e.i.r.p. OUTDOOR forbidden
> > 5250 - 5350 200mW e.i.r.p. OUTDOOR forbidden DFS mandatory
> >
> > 40Mhz is allowed in A band for every WiFi-Alliance certified equipment.
> >
> > ***************************************************************
> > Not to be merged for the moment
> > ***************************************************************
> >
> > CC: Michael Green <Michael.Green@atheros.com>
> > CC: David Quan <David.Quan@atheros.com>
> > Signed-off-by: Emmanuel Grumbach <emmanuel.grumbach@intel.com>
> > ---
> >  db.txt |    2 ++
> >  1 files changed, 2 insertions(+), 0 deletions(-)
> >
> > diff --git a/db.txt b/db.txt
> > index e63a43e..d49c397 100644
> > --- a/db.txt
> > +++ b/db.txt
> > @@ -319,6 +319,8 @@ country IE:
> >
> >  country IL:
> >       (2402 - 2482 @ 40), (N/A, 20)
> > +     (5150 - 5250 @ 40). (N/A, 200 mW), NO-OUTDOOR
> > +     (5250 - 5350 @ 40). (N/A, 200 mW), NO-OUTDOOR, DFS
> >
> >  country IN:
> >       (2402 - 2482 @ 40), (N/A, 20)
>
> Is this issue now settled?

Yes, I think that Michael Green agreed for this patch. Once he will
reply to make sure, we will be able to move on to a real patch.

Re: wireless-regdb: Add A band in IL - And general point regarding tx power limits in the dbase

[John W. Linville]

On Mon, Jun 21, 2010 at 07:51:56AM -0700, Michael Green wrote:
> Here are my comments on the proposed patch...
> 
> country IL:
> > >       (2402 - 2482 @ 40), (N/A, 20)
> > > +     (5150 - 5250 @ 40). (N/A, 200 mW), NO-OUTDOOR
> > > +     (5250 - 5350 @ 40). (N/A, 200 mW), NO-OUTDOOR, DFS

> b) I think all entries in the dbase should be in dBm (not mW).
> dBm vs. mW are absolutely equivalent. No reason to retain "mW"
> unit from the source docs.  I think this was agreed by all before,
> but wanted to reiterate.

I'm not sure I see the fuss.  If anything, using the same units as
the source docs seems less error-prone to me.  Why not stick with
the source units and let the tool do the conversion rather than risk
introducing an error in the manual conversion?

John
-- 
John W. Linville		Someday the world will need a hero, and you
linville@tuxdriver.com			might be all we have.  Be ready.

Re: wireless-regdb: Add A band in IL - And general point regarding tx power limits in the dbase

[Emmanuel Grumbach]

On Mon, Jun 21, 2010 at 17:51, Michael Green <Michael.Green@atheros.com> wrote:
> Here are my comments on the proposed patch...
>
> country IL:
>> >       (2402 - 2482 @ 40), (N/A, 20)
>> > +     (5150 - 5250 @ 40). (N/A, 200 mW), NO-OUTDOOR
>> > +     (5250 - 5350 @ 40). (N/A, 200 mW), NO-OUTDOOR, DFS
>


> b) I think all entries in the dbase should be in dBm (not mW).   dBm vs. mW are absolutely equivalent. No reason to retain "mW" unit from the source docs.  I think this was agreed by all before, but wanted to reiterate.

Can you please help me translation from mW to db ?

Thanks

RE: wireless-regdb: Add A band in IL - And general point regarding tx power limits in the dbase

[Michael Green]

[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 1039 bytes --]



Michael Green
Atheros Communications, Inc.
mgreen@atheros.com
Desk:   +1-781-400-1491
Mobile: +1-508-380-4921

-----Original Message-----
From: Emmanuel Grumbach [mailto:egrumbach@gmail.com] 
Sent: Monday, June 21, 2010 1:12 PM
To: Michael Green
Cc: John W. Linville; linux-wireless@vger.kernel.org; David Quan
Subject: Re: wireless-regdb: Add A band in IL - And general point regarding tx power limits in the dbase

On Mon, Jun 21, 2010 at 17:51, Michael Green <Michael.Green@atheros.com> wrote:
> Here are my comments on the proposed patch...
>
> country IL:
>> >       (2402 - 2482 @ 40), (N/A, 20)
>> > +     (5150 - 5250 @ 40). (N/A, 200 mW), NO-OUTDOOR
>> > +     (5250 - 5350 @ 40). (N/A, 200 mW), NO-OUTDOOR, DFS
>


> b) I think all entries in the dbase should be in dBm (not mW).   dBm vs. mW are absolutely equivalent. No reason to retain "mW" unit from the source docs.  I think this was agreed by all before, but wanted to reiterate.

Can you please help me translation from mW to db ?

Thanks

[-- Attachment #2: dBm to mW.pdf --]
[-- Type: application/pdf, Size: 33631 bytes --]

Re: wireless-regdb: Add A band in IL - And general point regarding tx power limits in the dbase

[Johannes Berg]

On Mon, 2010-06-21 at 07:51 -0700, Michael Green wrote:

> b) I think all entries in the dbase should be in dBm (not mW).   dBm
> vs. mW are absolutely equivalent. No reason to retain "mW" unit from
> the source docs.  I think this was agreed by all before, but wanted to
> reiterate. 

Why? The tools automatically convert one into the other as required, so
if the source documents state mW it is _much_ easier to retain it for
future review. Hence I think it should be retained. As you say, it's
absolutely equivalent, so there's no reason _not_ to retain it as in the
source.

johannes

Re: wireless-regdb: Add A band in IL - And general point regarding tx power limits in the dbase

[Luis R. Rodriguez]

On Mon, Jun 21, 2010 at 12:15 PM, Johannes Berg
<johannes@sipsolutions.net> wrote:
> On Mon, 2010-06-21 at 07:51 -0700, Michael Green wrote:
>
>> b) I think all entries in the dbase should be in dBm (not mW).   dBm
>> vs. mW are absolutely equivalent. No reason to retain "mW" unit from
>> the source docs.  I think this was agreed by all before, but wanted to
>> reiterate.
>
> Why? The tools automatically convert one into the other as required, so
> if the source documents state mW it is _much_ easier to retain it for
> future review. Hence I think it should be retained. As you say, it's
> absolutely equivalent, so there's no reason _not_ to retain it as in the
> source.

I think the concern is not that but the other way around -- checking
db.txt against some internal docs which already have stuff in dBm. So
how about a simple solution: we write a script which parses db.txt and
gives you all entries in either format?

  Luis

Re: wireless-regdb: Add A band in IL - And general point regarding tx power limits in the dbase

[Holger Schurig]

> Can you please help me translation from mW to db ?

You cannot.

"dB" is without a reference. Is only a relative measurement. You can, however, 
convert "dB" into some factor.

What we were talking about was "dBm". Here we use a reference point of one 
milliwatt. Now you can convert dBm to milliwatt.

Another example of a "made absolute by using a reference" logarithmic scale is 
the gain of antennas. It's usually described in dBi or dBd. The first takes 
the (hypothetical) isotropical antenna, the second an dipol as reference.



For more info, search for "dBm" in http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Decibel

-- 
DH3HS, http://www.holgerschurig.de