Re: PowerMac G4 and pcmcia flash cards

Re: PowerMac G4 and pcmcia flash cards

[Dan Bethe]

	Hi there Tim.  I'm not sure I entirely follow you on the marketing
issue of these cards or ports.  Are you saying that Apple wants to
fracture the PCMCIA standard in general because they're able to make
the Airport cards far cheaper than the typical IEEE 802.11 vendor, and
so people would overwhelmingly purchase Apple's cards for general
wireless purposes rather than from the typical vendor?
	I guess I didn't quite get the meaning of "gray market"  :)  Is that
it?
	But other than that, Airport is equal to IEEE 802.11, right?  Can we
just buy a IEEE 802.11 card and have it work with Airport cards and
bases?
	Thanks for the info.

> It smells tantalizingly like PCMCIA because it's very close, but it
> is deliberately broken so that it's not compatible with the regular
> PCMCIA pinout.  This allows Apple to sell AirPort cards for $100 USD
> without creating a gray market supply of cheap IEEE 802.11 cards,
> which would undercut everyone else in the world who is selling the
> same thing for $150-200.  When big companies cut special high volume
> deals, ugly things happen.  :)


=====
"Don't expect your own messiah; this neverworld which you desire is
only in your mind." -- http://www.dreamtheater.net/songb4.htm#IV5

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Re: PowerMac G4 and pcmcia flash cards

[David A. Gatwood]

On Wed, 23 Feb 2000, Dan Bethe wrote:

>
> 	Hi there Tim.  I'm not sure I entirely follow you on the marketing
> issue of these cards or ports.  Are you saying that Apple wants to
> fracture the PCMCIA standard in general because they're able to make
> the Airport cards far cheaper than the typical IEEE 802.11 vendor, and
> so people would overwhelmingly purchase Apple's cards for general
> wireless purposes rather than from the typical vendor?
> 	I guess I didn't quite get the meaning of "gray market"  :)  Is that
> it?

Pretty much.  Grey market is most commonly used for things like video gear
where people buy camcorders in other countries and sell them in the U.S.
at less than the normal U.S. price.  It's legal, but somewhat unethical.
The term can also apply to the resale of OEM products without the product
with which they were bundled originally, IIRC.  I think that's the
definition being used here.


> 	But other than that, Airport is equal to IEEE 802.11, right?

I believe so, yes, assuming that's the wireless ethernet spec #.

So, anybody want to build a pin-rearranger?  ;-)


David


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Re: PowerMac G4 and pcmcia flash cards

[Ryan Boder]

>
>
> So, anybody want to build a pin-rearranger?  ;-)
>
> David
>
>

Yes, I would like to build a pin rearranger. I am a cs student and rather new
to linux, but I have time and motivation to do it. Can any of you more
experienced developers tell me what to do to get started and maybe where to get
pinouts of the airport card and the standard pcmcia pinout? Any help or
direction would be greatly apprecieated.

Ryan


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Re: PowerMac G4 and pcmcia flash cards

[Timothy A. Seufert]

At 12:56 PM -0800 2/23/00, Dan Bethe wrote:
>	Hi there Tim.  I'm not sure I entirely follow you on the marketing
>issue of these cards or ports.  Are you saying that Apple wants to
>fracture the PCMCIA standard in general

No, they're not trying to fracture it at all.  If they wanted to
fracture the standard they'd be advertising the AirPort sockets as a
great way to put peripheral <whatever> in a Mac or PowerBook.
Instead they're treating it as a one-trick wonder: as far as Apple is
concerned, it's a slot for Apple-made AirPort cards and nothing else.
Note that they don't say PCMCIA or PC Card or CardBus anywhere in
their marketing material about AirPort cards.

(It probably isn't even a full PCMCIA implementation either.)

>  because they're able to make
>the Airport cards far cheaper than the typical IEEE 802.11 vendor,

They're able to buy them real cheap (this is an OEM deal), and
allowed to pass the savings on to Apple customers, *if* they do
something to make sure their cards aren't interchangeable with others.

>  and
>so people would overwhelmingly purchase Apple's cards for general
>wireless purposes rather than from the typical vendor?

Well, let's put it this way:  AirPort cards are $100 and base
stations $300, everybody else is charging $150-200 and I think $500+
for the same things.

>	I guess I didn't quite get the meaning of "gray market"  :)  Is that
>it?

What David Gatwood said.

>	But other than that, Airport is equal to IEEE 802.11, right?  Can we
>just buy a IEEE 802.11 card and have it work with Airport cards and
>bases?

Yes.  The AirPort stuff is all IEEE 802.11 compliant; 802.11
specifies how the radios talk to each other, not the fine details of
how the computers talk to the radios.

   Tim Seufert

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Re: PowerMac G4 and pcmcia flash cards

[Dan Bethe]

	Ok thanks for the info, guys  :)  Maybe you know this one...
	I don't know yet if we can buy something OTHER than airport, that is
compatible with airport.  Or if we have to have macs and airport bases
in order to use an airport lan.
	Do you know what the feasability is of Linux support of Apple's
Airport bases and Airport cards?

=====
"Don't expect your own messiah; this neverworld which you desire is
only in your mind." -- http://www.dreamtheater.net/songb4.htm#IV5

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Re: PowerMac G4 and pcmcia flash cards

[Nelson Abramson]

Dan Bethe wrote:

>         I don't know yet if we can buy something OTHER than airport, that is
> compatible with airport.  Or if we have to have macs and airport bases
> in order to use an airport lan.

The airport is compatible with (atleast) the Lucent 3mbit/s wireless network.
Lucent sells pc cards that will fit in powerbooks (and non-apple
portables) that will work w/ the airport, but only at speeds up to 3mbit/s.
I imagine that other products are also compatible..

>         Do you know what the feasability is of Linux support of Apple's
> Airport bases and Airport cards?

I imagine fairly possible...I would guess that with the release of mosX and the
bsd device drivers for the airport, porting them to *nix would be pretty easy
(hopefully)....

HTH
--Nelson Abramson

--
Shouldn't people be arrested and persecuted for engaging in their
constitutional rights?  http://www.opendvd.org


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Re: PowerMac G4 and pcmcia flash cards

[Brad Boyer]

Nelson Abramson wrote:
> >         Do you know what the feasability is of Linux support of Apple's
> > Airport bases and Airport cards?
>
> I imagine fairly possible...I would guess that with the release of mosX and the
> bsd device drivers for the airport, porting them to *nix would be pretty easy
> (hopefully)....

Well, since Lucent released Linux drivers for the WaveLan cards, I suspect it
is much simpler than waiting for Apple to write drivers for Darwin.  Apple
made an OEM deal with Lucent, so Airport cards have all the same guts as the
original Lucent cards.  In fact, if you rip apart an Airport base station, you
will find a genuine Lucent card in a PCMCIA slot.  There was a web site with
pictures of all the parts from a base station.

	Brad Boyer
	flar@pants.nu

P.S.: The wavelan drivers can be found at http://www.wavelan.com/support/software/
but they claim that they only work with x86 laptops.  The source is there, so it
should be possible to fix for ppc.


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Re: PowerMac G4 and pcmcia flash cards

[Daniel Jacobowitz]

On Thu, Feb 24, 2000 at 01:01:59PM -0800, Brad Boyer wrote:
>
> Nelson Abramson wrote:
> > >         Do you know what the feasability is of Linux support of Apple's
> > > Airport bases and Airport cards?
> >
> > I imagine fairly possible...I would guess that with the release of mosX and the
> > bsd device drivers for the airport, porting them to *nix would be pretty easy
> > (hopefully)....
>
> Well, since Lucent released Linux drivers for the WaveLan cards, I suspect it
> is much simpler than waiting for Apple to write drivers for Darwin.  Apple
> made an OEM deal with Lucent, so Airport cards have all the same guts as the
> original Lucent cards.  In fact, if you rip apart an Airport base station, you
> will find a genuine Lucent card in a PCMCIA slot.  There was a web site with
> pictures of all the parts from a base station.
>
> 	Brad Boyer
> 	flar@pants.nu
>
> P.S.: The wavelan drivers can be found at http://www.wavelan.com/support/software/
> but they claim that they only work with x86 laptops.  The source is there, so it
> should be possible to fix for ppc.

No, actually.   There are two wavelan drivers; the one there relies on
a non-free (read: binary only) library.  There's a similar one, which I
believe Lucent funded in part, available from the contrib/ directory on
the PCMCIA ftp site - wvlan_cs as opposed to wavelan2_cs.

Dan

/--------------------------------\  /--------------------------------\
|       Daniel Jacobowitz        |__|        SCS Class of 2002       |
|   Debian GNU/Linux Developer    __    Carnegie Mellon University   |
|         dan@debian.org         |  |       dmj+@andrew.cmu.edu      |
\--------------------------------/  \--------------------------------/

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PowerMac G4 and pcmcia flash cards

[Ryan Boder]

Hi,

need to write a little boot prom and I would like to use my G4 to put it
on a flash card. I have tried using pcmcia card services by David Hinds
and it won't even install. This is no surprise since he claims in the
HOWTO that Macs are not supproted yet. How you guys been using pcmcia
devices and does anyone know if I can do it on my G4?

Ryan


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Re: PowerMac G4 and pcmcia flash cards

[Timothy A. Seufert]

[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 875 bytes --]

At 9:10 PM -0500 2/22/00, Ryan Boder wrote:
>Hi,
>
>need to write a little boot prom and I would like to use my G4 to put it
>on a flash card. I have tried using pcmcia card services by David Hinds
>and it won't even install.

Do you mean a binary installation?  Or were you trying to recompile?

>  This is no surprise since he claims in the
>HOWTO that Macs are not supproted yet.

It's not supported by him, but pcmcia-cs 3.0.14 should work on 2.2.x
kernels, especially if patched with the attached patchfile before
compiling.

>  How you guys been using pcmcia
>devices and does anyone know if I can do it on my G4?

Well, you're going to face a pretty fundamental barrier in that the
G4 does not have any PCMCIA sockets.  Despite appareances, the
internal AirPort socket on the AGP models is not PCMCIA.  It will not
work at all with anything other than an AirPort card.

[-- Attachment #2: pcmcia-cs-3.0.14.ppc.patch --]
[-- Type: application/mac-binhex40, Size: 7808 bytes --]

[-- Attachment #3: Type: text/plain, Size: 15 bytes --]


   Tim Seufert

Re: PowerMac G4 and pcmcia flash cards

[Benjamin Herrenschmidt]

On Tue, Feb 22, 2000, Timothy A. Seufert <tas@mindspring.com> wrote:

>Well, you're going to face a pretty fundamental barrier in that the
>G4 does not have any PCMCIA sockets.  Despite appareances, the
>internal AirPort socket on the AGP models is not PCMCIA.  It will not
>work at all with anything other than an AirPort card.

Actually, it smells a lot like a PCMCIA (not CardBus). It looks like a
kind of bastard of a PCMCIA and an IDE bus, and it's possible that some
PCMCIA card be made to work on it. I don't have enough infos for this yet
however.


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Re: PowerMac G4 and pcmcia flash cards

[Timothy A. Seufert]

At 10:38 AM +0100 2/23/00, Benjamin Herrenschmidt wrote:
>On Tue, Feb 22, 2000, Timothy A. Seufert <tas@mindspring.com> wrote:
>
>>Well, you're going to face a pretty fundamental barrier in that the
>>G4 does not have any PCMCIA sockets.  Despite appareances, the
>>internal AirPort socket on the AGP models is not PCMCIA.  It will not
>>work at all with anything other than an AirPort card.
>
>Actually, it smells a lot like a PCMCIA (not CardBus). It looks like a
>kind of bastard of a PCMCIA and an IDE bus, and it's possible that some
>PCMCIA card be made to work on it. I don't have enough infos for this yet
>however.

It smells tantalizingly like PCMCIA because it's very close, but it
is deliberately broken so that it's not compatible with the regular
PCMCIA pinout.  This allows Apple to sell AirPort cards for $100 USD
without creating a gray market supply of cheap IEEE 802.11 cards,
which would undercut everyone else in the world who is selling the
same thing for $150-200.  When big companies cut special high volume
deals, ugly things happen.  :)

   Tim Seufert

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Re: PowerMac G4 and pcmcia flash cards

[Andreas Tobler]

[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 866 bytes --]

Hi,

Ryan Boder wrote:
>
> Hi,
>
> need to write a little boot prom and I would like to use my G4 to put it
> on a flash card. I have tried using pcmcia card services by David Hinds
> and it won't even install. This is no surprise since he claims in the
> HOWTO that Macs are not supproted yet. How you guys been using pcmcia
> devices and does anyone know if I can do it on my G4?

For the basic services I can run he latest 3.1.11 package from David
with minor patching. It works well at least for Modems. A bit more
tweaking on the kernel side and I get CardBus services to run, e.g my
Xircom CBEM56G Modem/ethernet card. This is done on a Wallstreet I.
How about G4? I don't know, I suppose they don't have a PCI-TO-CARDBUS
bridge or even PCMCIA unless you add a card reader.

For the kernel patches, if you need them, they come later since I'm on work.

Andreas

[-- Attachment #2: Unknown Document --]
[-- Type: text/plain, Size: 5614 bytes --]

diff -u --recursive pcmcia-cs-3.1.9/etc/config pcmcia-cs-3.1.9.orig/etc/config
--- pcmcia-cs-3.1.9/etc/config	Tue Jan 25 20:44:19 2000
+++ pcmcia-cs-3.1.9.orig/etc/config	Mon Jan 24 19:01:10 2000
@@ -40,7 +40,7 @@
   class "ftl" module "ftl_cs"

 device "serial_cs"
-  class "serial" module "serial_cs"
+  class "serial" module "misc/serial", "serial_cs"

 device "parport_cs"
   class "parport" module "parport_cs"
diff -u --recursive pcmcia-cs-3.1.9/etc/config.opts pcmcia-cs-3.1.9.orig/etc/config.opts
--- pcmcia-cs-3.1.9/etc/config.opts	Tue Jan 25 20:44:19 2000
+++ pcmcia-cs-3.1.9.orig/etc/config.opts	Mon Jan 24 18:59:31 2000
@@ -1,52 +1,20 @@
 #
 # Local PCMCIA Configuration File
 #
-#----------------------------------------------------------------------
-
 # System resources available for PCMCIA devices
-
-include port 0x100-0x4ff, port 0x800-0x8ff, port 0xc00-0xcff
-include memory 0xc0000-0xfffff
-include memory 0xa0000000-0xa0ffffff, memory 0x60000000-0x60ffffff
-
-# High port numbers do not always work...
-# include port 0x1000-0x17ff
-
-# Extra port range for IBM Token Ring
-include port 0xa00-0xaff
-
+#
+include port 0x0-0xfff
+include memory 0x90000000-0x90ffffff
 # Resources we should not use, even if they appear to be available
-
-# First built-in serial port
-exclude irq 4
-# Second built-in serial port
-#exclude irq 3
-# First built-in parallel port
-exclude irq 7
-
-#----------------------------------------------------------------------
-
+#
+#
 # Examples of options for loadable modules
-
+#
 # To fix sluggish network with IBM ethernet adapter...
 #module "pcnet_cs" opts "mem_speed=600"
-
-# Options for IBM Token Ring adapters
-#module "ibmtr_cs" opts "mmiobase=0xd0000 srambase=0xd4000"
-
-# Options for Raylink/WebGear driver: uncomment only one line...
-# Generic ad-hoc network
-module "ray_cs" opts "pc_debug=1 essid=ADHOC_ESSID hop_dwell=128 beacon_period=256 translate=1"
-# Infrastructure network for older cards
-#module "ray_cs" opts "pc_debug=1 net_type=1 essid=ESSID1"
-# Infrastructure network for WebGear
-#module "ray_cs" opts "pc_debug=1 net_type=1 essid=ESSID1 translate=1 hop_dwell=128 beacon_period=256"
-
-# Options for WaveLAN/IEEE driver (AccessPoint mode)...
-#module "wvlan_cs" opts "station_name=MY_PC"
-# Options for WaveLAN/IEEE driver (ad-hoc mode)...
-#module "wvlan_cs" opts "port_type=3 channel=1 station_name=MY_PC"
-
+#
 # Options for Xircom Netwave driver...
 #module "netwave_cs" opts "domain=0x100 scramble_key=0x0"
-
+#
+# Options for IBM Token Ring adapters
+#module "ibmtr_cs" opts "mmiobase=0xd0000 srambase=0xd4000"
\ No newline at end of file
diff -u --recursive pcmcia-cs-3.1.9/modules/cs.c pcmcia-cs-3.1.9.orig/modules/cs.c
--- pcmcia-cs-3.1.9/modules/cs.c	Tue Jan 25 20:44:19 2000
+++ pcmcia-cs-3.1.9.orig/modules/cs.c	Mon Jan 24 18:57:54 2000
@@ -457,6 +457,10 @@
     /* Blank out the socket state */
     s->state &= SOCKET_PRESENT|SOCKET_SETUP_PENDING;
     init_socket(s);
+#ifdef __powerpc__
+    s->socket.flags |= SS_EJECTION;
+    s->ss_entry(s->sock, SS_SetSocket, &s->socket);
+#endif
     s->irq.AssignedIRQ = s->irq.Config = 0;
     s->functions = 0;
     s->lock_count = 0;
diff -u --recursive pcmcia-cs-3.1.9/modules/i82365.c pcmcia-cs-3.1.9.orig/modules/i82365.c
--- pcmcia-cs-3.1.9/modules/i82365.c	Tue Jan 25 20:44:19 2000
+++ pcmcia-cs-3.1.9.orig/modules/i82365.c	Mon Jan 24 19:18:42 2000
@@ -58,6 +58,12 @@
 #include <asm/system.h>
 #endif

+#ifdef __powerpc__
+#include <asm/prom.h>
+#include <asm/adb.h>
+#include <asm/pmu.h>
+#endif /* __powerpc__ */
+
 #include <pcmcia/version.h>
 #include <pcmcia/cs_types.h>
 #include <pcmcia/ss.h>
@@ -238,6 +244,12 @@
     u_char		cache, pmcs;
     u_int		cb_phys;
     char		*cb_virt;
+
+#ifdef __powerpc__
+    int			pmu_socket;
+    struct 		adb_request	pmu_req;
+#endif /* __powerpc__ */
+
 #endif
     union {
 	cirrus_state_t		cirrus;
@@ -1543,6 +1555,32 @@
 	}
 #endif
     }
+#ifdef __powerpc__
+    /* work out the mapping to PMU socket number */
+    {
+	struct device_node *np;
+	for (i = 0; i < ns; ++i) {
+	    s[i].pmu_socket = 0;
+	    s[i].pmu_req.complete = 1;
+	}
+	for (np = find_type_devices("pccard"); np != NULL; np = np->next) {
+	    int *reg = (int *) get_property(np, "reg", NULL);
+	    int *ps = (int *) get_property(np, "AAPL,pmu-socket-number", NULL);
+	    int bus, devfn;
+	    if (reg == NULL || ps == NULL)
+		continue;
+	    bus = (reg[0] >> 16) & 0xff;
+	    devfn = (reg[0] >> 8) & 0xff;
+	    for (i = 0; i < ns; ++i) {
+		if (s[i].bus == bus && s[i].devfn == devfn) {
+		    s[i].pmu_socket = *ps;
+		    DEBUG(2, ("socket %d is pmu socket %d\n", i, *ps));
+		    break;
+		}
+	    }
+	}
+    }
+#endif

 } /* add_pcic */

@@ -2156,6 +2194,16 @@
     }
     i365_set(s, I365_CSCINT, reg);
     i365_get(s, I365_CSC);
+
+
+#ifdef __powerpc__
+    if (state->flags & SS_EJECTION) {
+	if (s->pmu_socket != 0 && s->pmu_req.complete)
+	    pmu_request(&s->pmu_req, NULL, 2, PMU_PCEJECT, s->pmu_socket);
+	state->flags &= ~SS_EJECTION;
+    }
+#endif
+
 #ifdef CONFIG_PCI
     if (s->flags & IS_CARDBUS) {
 	if (s->cs_irq || (pci_csc && s->cap.pci_irq))
@@ -2357,6 +2405,15 @@
     DEBUG(1, "yenta: GetSocket(%d) = flags %#3.3x, Vcc %d, Vpp %d, "
 	  "io_irq %d, csc_mask %#2.2x\n", s-socket, state->flags,
 	  state->Vcc, state->Vpp, state->io_irq, state->csc_mask);
+
+#ifdef __powerpc__
+    if (state->flags & SS_EJECTION) {
+	if (s->pmu_socket != 0 && s->pmu_req.complete)
+	    pmu_request(&s->pmu_req, NULL, 2, PMU_PCEJECT, s->pmu_socket);
+	state->flags &= ~SS_EJECTION;
+    }
+#endif
+
     return 0;
 } /* cb_get_socket */