public inbox for linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org
 help / color / mirror / Atom feed
From: Jesse Pollard <jesse@cats-chateau.net>
To: Alan Cox <alan@lxorguk.ukuu.org.uk>, Andries.Brouwer@cwi.nl
Cc: alan@lxorguk.ukuu.org.uk, linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org
Subject: Re: [PATCH] Prevent OOM from killing init
Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 10:48:52 -0600	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <01032411110700.03927@tabby> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <E14gWSN-0005CQ-00@the-village.bc.nu>
In-Reply-To: <E14gWSN-0005CQ-00@the-village.bc.nu>

On Fri, 23 Mar 2001, Alan Cox wrote:
>> infinite storage. After all, earlier Unix flavours did not need
>> an OOM killer either, and my editor was not killed under Unix V6
>> on 64k when I started some other process.
>
>You were lucky. Its quite possible for V6 to kill processes when you run out
>of swap

Not lucky. I've used V6 - It would not start a process if the resources
werent available (no overcommit). It was also a swap based system and
not a page based system (PDP-11/45 1123+... supported both, but UNIX
only used swapping because it was easy to swap a 64Kbyte process).

>> The old Unix guarantee that a program only crashes because of
>> its own behaviour is lost. That is very sad.
>
>No such guarantee ever existed. There are systems that had stuff like per
>user memory quotas but those were mostly much more mainframe oriented

Only the swapping based systems gave this guarantee. Even AT&T System V
release 2 was swap based (M68020 systems).

>> 200 MB then the rest of that memory is not wasted. But it can
>> only be used for things that can be freed when needed, like
>> inode and buffer cache.
>
>No. You cannot free the inode and buffer cache arbitarily. You only have a
>probability - that puts you back at square 1.
>
>> But inefficient or not, I much prefer a system with guarantees,
>> something that is reliable by default, above something that
>> works well if you are lucky and fails at unpredictable moments.
>
>malloc is merely an accounting exercise (actually its mostly mmap 
>accounting). ptrace is the only quirk. Nobody feels its very important because
>nobody has implemented it.

Small correction - It was implemented, just not included in the standard
kernel.

Check mailing lists around March-April of 2000. The patch was generated
by Eduardo Horvath <eeh@turbolinux.com> for  2.3.99-pre3 and allowed the
administrator to:

"Available virtual memory is calculated as the sum of all swap space as
 well as free and reclaimable RAM, essentially the same value as used
 before.  The kernel will now operate in 4 different modes depending on the
 value of sysctl_overcommit_memory:
 
 1       Do accounting but do not prevent any allocations (old behavior)
 
 0       Do accounting but only prevent individual allocations that exceed
                total VM (old behavior)
 
 -1      Do accounting and prevent a user from making the amount of
                reserved memory exceed the total virtual memory.
 
 -2      Same as above but also for root.
 
 The default is set to -1 to allow root to essentially do whatever it
 wants.  But then if someone's broken root you're in trouble anyway.
 
 If the kernel itself requires memory it can allocate as much as it wants
 and can bring the system into an unsafe state (reserved > total).
 
 Memory segments that are not COW, ZFOD or otherwise swap backed do not
 require reservation."

It was a limited implementation, but worked quite well in testing.

-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Jesse I Pollard, II
Email: jesse@cats-chateau.net

Any opinions expressed are solely my own.

  parent reply	other threads:[~2001-03-24 17:12 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 153+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2001-03-23 18:29 [PATCH] Prevent OOM from killing init Andries.Brouwer
2001-03-23 18:38 ` Alan Cox
2001-03-24  0:46   ` Tim Wright
2001-03-24 16:48   ` Jesse Pollard [this message]
2001-03-25 16:12     ` Szabolcs Szakacsits
2001-03-25 16:39     ` Jonathan Morton
2001-03-23 18:43 ` nick
2001-03-23 19:01   ` Martin Dalecki
2001-03-23 19:23     ` nick
2001-03-23 22:12     ` Alan Cox
2001-03-23 23:23       ` Stephen E. Clark
2001-03-24 10:40         ` Gérard Roudier
2001-03-23 21:14 ` Jonathan Morton
2001-03-25 14:56   ` Marco Colombo
     [not found] <Pine.LNX.4.30.0103251549100.13864-100000@fs131-224.f-secure.com>
     [not found] ` <l03130315b6e242006a4b@[192.168.239.101]>
2001-03-25 15:47   ` Jonathan Morton
  -- strict thread matches above, loose matches on Subject: below --
2001-03-24 23:41 Benoit Garnier
2001-03-25  5:45 ` Stephen Satchell
2001-03-25  6:58   ` Stephen Clouse
2001-03-25 14:37   ` Martin Dalecki
2001-03-25 14:32 ` Martin Dalecki
2001-03-24 10:18 Andries.Brouwer
2001-03-24  2:30 Andreas Franck
2001-03-24  1:38 Jonathan Morton
2001-03-24  1:11 Andries.Brouwer
2001-03-23 23:15 Andries.Brouwer
2001-03-23 23:17 ` Martin Dalecki
2001-03-24  0:13 ` Jonathan Morton
2001-03-24  6:58   ` Rik van Riel
2001-03-24 12:38   ` Jonathan Morton
2001-03-24 13:12   ` Jonathan Morton
2001-03-24  1:59 ` Paul Jakma
2001-03-23 19:33 Stephen Satchell
2001-03-23  9:48 Only 10 MB/sec with via 82c686b - FIXED Alan Cox
2001-03-23 17:00 ` [PATCH] Prevent OOM from killing init SodaPop
2001-03-23 18:42   ` Martin Dalecki
2001-03-23 20:25     ` SodaPop
2001-03-23 20:33       ` Martin Dalecki
2001-03-23 19:19   ` Jonathan Morton
2001-03-23  9:28 Heusden, Folkert van
2001-03-23  0:09 Mikael Pettersson
2001-03-23  0:27 ` Andrew Morton
2001-03-23 12:29   ` Mikael Pettersson
2001-03-23 16:24 ` Horst von Brand
2001-03-23 16:49   ` Guest section DW
2001-03-23 17:04     ` Alan Cox
2001-03-22 23:35 Mikael Pettersson
2001-03-22 23:43 ` Alan Cox
2001-03-27  7:58   ` Helge Hafting
     [not found] <4605B269DB001E4299157DD1569079D2809930@EXCHANGE03.plaza.ds.adp.com>
2001-03-22 16:29 ` Rik van Riel
2001-03-22 18:32   ` Christian Bodmer
2001-03-23 15:08     ` Horst von Brand
2001-03-24  7:48       ` Doug Ledford
2001-03-24 10:21         ` Mike Galbraith
2001-03-24 18:19           ` Doug Ledford
2001-03-24 22:47             ` Mike Galbraith
2001-03-24 23:35             ` Jonathan Morton
2001-03-25 18:35               ` Jonathan Morton
2001-03-26  4:40                 ` Horst von Brand
2001-03-26  8:36                 ` Mike Galbraith
2001-03-26 10:01                 ` Jonathan Morton
2001-03-26 14:48                   ` Rik van Riel
2001-03-25 19:07               ` Mike Galbraith
2001-03-24 20:04           ` Jonathan Morton
2001-03-24 20:59           ` Jonathan Morton
2001-03-24 22:11             ` Rik van Riel
2001-03-24 23:36             ` Jonathan Morton
2001-03-25 14:30             ` Martin Dalecki
2001-03-25 14:13           ` Martin Dalecki
2001-03-24 12:42         ` Jonathan Morton
2001-03-24 15:06           ` Mike Galbraith
2001-03-25 14:10         ` Martin Dalecki
2001-03-22 11:08 Heusden, Folkert van
2001-03-21 23:41 Leif Sawyer
2001-03-22  0:32 ` Kevin Buhr
2001-03-21 22:54 Patrick O'Rourke
2001-03-21 23:11 ` Eli Carter
2001-03-21 23:40   ` Patrick O'Rourke
2001-03-21 23:48 ` Rik van Riel
2001-03-22  8:14   ` Eric W. Biederman
2001-03-22  9:24     ` Rik van Riel
2001-03-22 19:29     ` Philipp Rumpf
2001-03-22 11:47   ` Guest section DW
2001-03-22 15:01     ` Rik van Riel
2001-03-22 19:04       ` Guest section DW
2001-03-22 16:41     ` Eric W. Biederman
2001-03-22 20:28     ` Stephen Clouse
2001-03-22 21:01       ` Ingo Oeser
2001-03-22 21:23       ` Alan Cox
2001-03-22 22:00         ` Guest section DW
2001-03-22 22:12           ` Ed Tomlinson
2001-03-22 22:52           ` Alan Cox
2001-03-22 23:27             ` Guest section DW
2001-03-22 23:37               ` Rik van Riel
2001-03-26 19:04                 ` James Antill
2001-03-26 20:05                   ` Rik van Riel
2001-03-22 23:40               ` Alan Cox
2001-03-23 20:09                 ` Szabolcs Szakacsits
2001-03-23 22:21                   ` Alan Cox
2001-03-23 22:37                     ` Szabolcs Szakacsits
2001-03-23 19:57           ` Szabolcs Szakacsits
2001-03-22 22:10         ` Doug Ledford
2001-03-22 22:53           ` Alan Cox
2001-03-22 23:30             ` Doug Ledford
2001-03-22 23:40               ` Alan Cox
2001-03-22 23:43         ` Stephen Clouse
2001-03-23 19:26         ` Szabolcs Szakacsits
2001-03-23 20:41           ` Paul Jakma
2001-03-23 21:58             ` george anzinger
2001-03-24  5:55               ` Rik van Riel
2001-03-23 22:18             ` Szabolcs Szakacsits
2001-03-24  2:08               ` Paul Jakma
2001-03-23  1:31       ` Michael Peddemors
2001-03-23  7:04         ` Rik van Riel
2001-03-23 11:28           ` Guest section DW
2001-03-23 14:50             ` Eric W. Biederman
2001-03-23 17:21               ` Guest section DW
2001-03-23 20:18                 ` Paul Jakma
2001-03-24 20:19                   ` Jesse Pollard
2001-03-23 23:48                 ` Eric W. Biederman
2001-03-23 21:11             ` José Luis Domingo López
2001-03-27 15:05       ` Anthony de Boer - USEnet
2002-03-23  0:33       ` Martin Dalecki
2001-03-22 23:53         ` Rik van Riel
2002-03-23  1:21           ` Martin Dalecki
2001-03-23  0:20         ` Stephen Clouse
2002-03-23  1:30           ` Martin Dalecki
2001-03-23  1:37             ` Rik van Riel
2001-03-23 10:48               ` Martin Dalecki
2001-03-23 14:56                 ` Rik van Riel
2001-03-23 16:43                   ` Guest section DW
2001-03-24  5:57                     ` Rik van Riel
2001-03-25 16:35                       ` Guest section DW
2001-03-23 20:20                   ` Tom Diehl
2001-03-23 23:56                     ` Tim Wright
2001-03-24  0:21                       ` Tom Diehl
2001-03-23 17:26     ` James A. Sutherland
2001-03-23 17:32       ` Alan Cox
2001-03-23 18:58         ` Martin Dalecki
2001-03-23 19:45         ` Jonathan Morton
2001-03-23 23:26           ` Eric W. Biederman
2001-03-25 15:30         ` Martin Dalecki
2001-03-25 20:47         ` Stephen Satchell
2001-03-24  0:03       ` Guest section DW
2001-03-24  7:52       ` Doug Ledford
2001-03-25  0:32       ` Kurt Garloff
2001-03-25 15:02         ` Sandy Harris
2001-03-25 18:07         ` Guest section DW
2001-03-22 14:53   ` Patrick O'Rourke
2001-03-22 19:24   ` Philipp Rumpf
2001-03-22 22:20   ` James A. Sutherland
2001-03-23 17:31   ` Szabolcs Szakacsits
2001-03-24  5:54     ` Rik van Riel
2001-03-24  6:55       ` Juha Saarinen
2001-03-27  8:31       ` Roger Gammans

Reply instructions:

You may reply publicly to this message via plain-text email
using any one of the following methods:

* Save the following mbox file, import it into your mail client,
  and reply-to-all from there: mbox

  Avoid top-posting and favor interleaved quoting:
  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Posting_style#Interleaved_style

* Reply using the --to, --cc, and --in-reply-to
  switches of git-send-email(1):

  git send-email \
    --in-reply-to=01032411110700.03927@tabby \
    --to=jesse@cats-chateau.net \
    --cc=Andries.Brouwer@cwi.nl \
    --cc=alan@lxorguk.ukuu.org.uk \
    --cc=linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org \
    /path/to/YOUR_REPLY

  https://kernel.org/pub/software/scm/git/docs/git-send-email.html

* If your mail client supports setting the In-Reply-To header
  via mailto: links, try the mailto: link
Be sure your reply has a Subject: header at the top and a blank line before the message body.
This is a public inbox, see mirroring instructions
for how to clone and mirror all data and code used for this inbox