Re: ACPI Hibernate and Suspend Strange behavior 2.6.7/-mm1

Re: ACPI Hibernate and Suspend Strange behavior 2.6.7/-mm1

[Len Brown]

On Tue, 2004-07-06 at 10:14, Volker Braun wrote:
> ACPI S3 draws too much power on the T40/T41, this has been confirmed
> by
> various people (so its not just mine). Suspended it lasts about 10h,
> about twice as long as powered up. Supposed to be 1-2 weeks. 
> 
> I guess we should have filed a bug report a long time ago. I'll do
> that
> now.
> 
> If anybody has any tips on how to debug this (debug a suspended
> machine :-) I would like to know.

I think it will take an SDV with an instrumented power supply
to tell us exactly where the power is going.

-Len

Re: ACPI Hibernate and Suspend Strange behavior 2.6.7/-mm1

[Len Brown]

On Sat, 2004-06-26 at 18:32, Sergio Vergata wrote:

> I have an IBM t40P. 
> Starting testing since i got my Laptop, Now starting with 2.6.7 and
> -mm1 i Switched from APM to ACPI  and use SwSusp.
>
> Now i trying to get the system working reliable with ACPI, suspending
> to RAM will not work as ist should it switch of Display Fan HDD this
> ist what i see 
> and hear, but it will not suspend DVDRom an for sure it leave the CPU 
> powered. I see that cpu i on because the system heats itself up. The
> time for 
> the suspended system is round about 10 hours after that the system
> powers of 
> and the battery is empty.

This does sound broken.  My centrino laptop draws well under 1W
when suspended to RAM, so on my 72Wh battery it should last
at least the better part of a week.

It would be interesting to know how long windows can STR
on your laptop.

> Problem number 2 is the problem that of suspending to ram will not
> reawake the interrupts of nvram and the acpi interrupts IRQ 9. 

Perhaps you can test the latest -mm tree plus
the patches from comment #21 adn #28 here:
http://bugzilla.kernel.org/show_bug.cgi?id=2643

thanks,
-Len

Re: ACPI Hibernate and Suspend Strange behavior 2.6.7/-mm1

[Volker Braun]

ACPI S3 draws too much power on the T40/T41, this has been confirmed by
various people (so its not just mine). Suspended it lasts about 10h,
about twice as long as powered up. Supposed to be 1-2 weeks. 

I guess we should have filed a bug report a long time ago. I'll do that
now.

If anybody has any tips on how to debug this (debug a suspended machine
:-) I would like to know.

Best,
Volker

Re: ACPI Hibernate and Suspend Strange behavior 2.6.7/-mm1

[John Goerzen]

On 2004-07-06, Volker Braun <volker.braun@physik.hu-berlin.de> wrote:
> ACPI S3 draws too much power on the T40/T41, this has been confirmed by
> various people (so its not just mine). Suspended it lasts about 10h,
> about twice as long as powered up. Supposed to be 1-2 weeks. 

I'm glad I'm not the only one that is suspecting that.  I just tried
switching my T40p from APM to ACPI.  I got suspending to RAM working in
ACPI, but noticed that when I got it back out of my laptop bag later, it
was physically warm to the touch.  It also had consumed more battery
power than it would have when suspended with APM.  And, if I would shine
a bright light on the screen, I could make out text on it.  In other
words, the backlight was off but it was still displaying stuff.

-- John

Re: ACPI Hibernate and Suspend Strange behavior 2.6.7/-mm1

[David Weinehall]

On Wed, Jul 14, 2004 at 08:16:55PM +0000, John Goerzen wrote:
> On 2004-07-06, Volker Braun <volker.braun@physik.hu-berlin.de> wrote:
> > ACPI S3 draws too much power on the T40/T41, this has been confirmed by
> > various people (so its not just mine). Suspended it lasts about 10h,
> > about twice as long as powered up. Supposed to be 1-2 weeks. 
> 
> I'm glad I'm not the only one that is suspecting that.  I just tried
> switching my T40p from APM to ACPI.  I got suspending to RAM working in
> ACPI, but noticed that when I got it back out of my laptop bag later, it
> was physically warm to the touch.  It also had consumed more battery
> power than it would have when suspended with APM.  And, if I would shine
> a bright light on the screen, I could make out text on it.  In other
> words, the backlight was off but it was still displaying stuff.

Does poweroff work for you?  At least my T40 has problems shutting off
properly when using 2.6 + ACPI.  A bit annoying; I have to keep the
powerkey pressed for a few seconds for it to turn off.


Regards: David Weinehall
-- 
 /) David Weinehall <tao@acc.umu.se> /) Northern lights wander      (\
//  Maintainer of the v2.0 kernel   //  Dance across the winter sky //
\)  http://www.acc.umu.se/~tao/    (/   Full colour fire           (/

Re: ACPI Hibernate and Suspend Strange behavior 2.6.7/-mm1

[John Goerzen]

On Wed, Jul 14, 2004 at 10:27:00PM +0200, David Weinehall wrote:
> On Wed, Jul 14, 2004 at 08:16:55PM +0000, John Goerzen wrote:
> > I'm glad I'm not the only one that is suspecting that.  I just tried
> > switching my T40p from APM to ACPI.  I got suspending to RAM working in
> > ACPI, but noticed that when I got it back out of my laptop bag later, it
> > was physically warm to the touch.  It also had consumed more battery
> > power than it would have when suspended with APM.  And, if I would shine
> > a bright light on the screen, I could make out text on it.  In other
> > words, the backlight was off but it was still displaying stuff.
> 
> Does poweroff work for you?  At least my T40 has problems shutting off
> properly when using 2.6 + ACPI.  A bit annoying; I have to keep the
> powerkey pressed for a few seconds for it to turn off.

The only way I ever turn the machine off is by running the halt command,
and that is working fine for me.  I haven't tried the power key.

-- John

Re: ACPI Hibernate and Suspend Strange behavior 2.6.7/-mm1

[David Weinehall]

On Wed, Jul 14, 2004 at 03:45:27PM -0500, John Goerzen wrote:
> On Wed, Jul 14, 2004 at 10:27:00PM +0200, David Weinehall wrote:
> > On Wed, Jul 14, 2004 at 08:16:55PM +0000, John Goerzen wrote:
> > > I'm glad I'm not the only one that is suspecting that.  I just tried
> > > switching my T40p from APM to ACPI.  I got suspending to RAM working in
> > > ACPI, but noticed that when I got it back out of my laptop bag later, it
> > > was physically warm to the touch.  It also had consumed more battery
> > > power than it would have when suspended with APM.  And, if I would shine
> > > a bright light on the screen, I could make out text on it.  In other
> > > words, the backlight was off but it was still displaying stuff.
> > 
> > Does poweroff work for you?  At least my T40 has problems shutting off
> > properly when using 2.6 + ACPI.  A bit annoying; I have to keep the
> > powerkey pressed for a few seconds for it to turn off.
> 
> The only way I ever turn the machine off is by running the halt command,
> and that is working fine for me.  I haven't tried the power key.

I meant using the halt command (or rather shutdown -h now, since I've
learned not to expect halt to perform a proper shutdown sequence on
other Unixen).  I must have something strange going on with my
installation then, since it doesn't work for me...  Debugging time!


Regards: David Weinehall
-- 
 /) David Weinehall <tao@acc.umu.se> /) Northern lights wander      (\
//  Maintainer of the v2.0 kernel   //  Dance across the winter sky //
\)  http://www.acc.umu.se/~tao/    (/   Full colour fire           (/

Re: ACPI Hibernate and Suspend Strange behavior 2.6.7/-mm1

[David Weinehall]

On Thu, Jul 15, 2004 at 08:00:17AM +0200, David Weinehall wrote:
> On Wed, Jul 14, 2004 at 03:45:27PM -0500, John Goerzen wrote:
> > On Wed, Jul 14, 2004 at 10:27:00PM +0200, David Weinehall wrote:
> > > On Wed, Jul 14, 2004 at 08:16:55PM +0000, John Goerzen wrote:
> > > > I'm glad I'm not the only one that is suspecting that.  I just tried
> > > > switching my T40p from APM to ACPI.  I got suspending to RAM working in
> > > > ACPI, but noticed that when I got it back out of my laptop bag later, it
> > > > was physically warm to the touch.  It also had consumed more battery
> > > > power than it would have when suspended with APM.  And, if I would shine
> > > > a bright light on the screen, I could make out text on it.  In other
> > > > words, the backlight was off but it was still displaying stuff.
> > > 
> > > Does poweroff work for you?  At least my T40 has problems shutting off
> > > properly when using 2.6 + ACPI.  A bit annoying; I have to keep the
> > > powerkey pressed for a few seconds for it to turn off.
> > 
> > The only way I ever turn the machine off is by running the halt command,
> > and that is working fine for me.  I haven't tried the power key.
> 
> I meant using the halt command (or rather shutdown -h now, since I've
> learned not to expect halt to perform a proper shutdown sequence on
> other Unixen).  I must have something strange going on with my
> installation then, since it doesn't work for me...  Debugging time!

Disabling APIC did fix the problem.  ehci_hcd still blocks suspend,
but adding rmmod ehci_hcd .... modprobe ehci_hcd to the sleep and lid
events at least works around the issue.


Regards: David Weinehall
-- 
 /) David Weinehall <tao@acc.umu.se> /) Northern lights wander      (\
//  Maintainer of the v2.0 kernel   //  Dance across the winter sky //
\)  http://www.acc.umu.se/~tao/    (/   Full colour fire           (/

Re: ACPI Hibernate and Suspend Strange behavior 2.6.7/-mm1

[Volker Braun]

On Wed, 14 Jul 2004 20:16:55 +0000, John Goerzen wrote:
> And, if I would shine
> a bright light on the screen, I could make out text on it.  In other
> words, the backlight was off but it was still displaying stuff.

I cannot reproduce that (T41), but maybe I'm looking at the wrong angle or
your eyes are better. In any case I understand that this image is very
faint.

I'm not sure whether this is actually part of the problem. The
liquid crystals might just keep their current orientation, or there might
be some residual charge in the driver circuit. Do you want to take your
display apart and check with a voltmeter? I dont't :-)

Best,
Volker

Re: ACPI Hibernate and Suspend Strange behavior 2.6.7/-mm1

[Pavel Machek]

Hi!

> > And, if I would shine
> > a bright light on the screen, I could make out text on it.  In other
> > words, the backlight was off but it was still displaying stuff.
> 
> I cannot reproduce that (T41), but maybe I'm looking at the wrong angle or
> your eyes are better. In any case I understand that this image is very
> faint.
> 
> I'm not sure whether this is actually part of the problem. The
> liquid crystals might just keep their current orientation, or there might
> be some residual charge in the driver circuit. Do you want to take your
> display apart and check with a voltmeter? I dont't :-)

If it is still there after half an hour, its certainly part of the problem.
LCD crystals loose the orientation in seconds, IIRC.
				Pavel
-- 
64 bytes from 195.113.31.123: icmp_seq=28 ttl=51 time=448769.1 ms         

Re: ACPI Hibernate and Suspend Strange behavior 2.6.7/-mm1

[Volker Braun]

On Fri, 16 Jul 2004 19:00:52 +0200, Pavel Machek wrote:
>> > And, if I would shine
>> > a bright light on the screen, I could make out text on it.  In other
>> > words, the backlight was off but it was still displaying stuff.
> 
> If it is still there after half an hour, its certainly part of the problem.

I agree in principle, but I'm also open to the possibility of a very
faint afterimage.

I see two possibilities to "turn off the back light":

1) Push the tiny sensor next to the hinge over the "access ibm" button
manually. This cuts power to the backlight (assuming you did not associate
suspend or anything to the ensuing "LID" acpi event). I can still see the
screen rather clearly, just without the backlight. Its easy to read text
even in a moderately lit room.

2) use "radeontool light off". This cuts power to the backlight
and the lcd. I cannot see the slightest thing on the display, it goes
completely black as if the computer were switched off.

John, could you please comment on what you see during ACPI S3?

Best,
Volker

Re: ACPI Hibernate and Suspend Strange behavior 2.6.7/-mm1

[Vernon Mauery]

On Fri, 2004-07-16 at 10:00, Pavel Machek wrote:
> Hi!
> 
> > > And, if I would shine
> > > a bright light on the screen, I could make out text on it.  In other
> > > words, the backlight was off but it was still displaying stuff.
> > 
> > I cannot reproduce that (T41), but maybe I'm looking at the wrong angle or
> > your eyes are better. In any case I understand that this image is very
> > faint.
> > 
> > I'm not sure whether this is actually part of the problem. The
> > liquid crystals might just keep their current orientation, or there might
> > be some residual charge in the driver circuit. Do you want to take your
> > display apart and check with a voltmeter? I dont't :-)
> 
> If it is still there after half an hour, its certainly part of the problem.
> LCD crystals loose the orientation in seconds, IIRC.
> 				Pavel

I found that on my T40, if I am using the radeonfb built into the kernel
I cannot see a ghost image, but if I use VESA or vga=normal, I can see a
ghost in S3.

--Vernon

Re: ACPI Hibernate and Suspend Strange behavior 2.6.7/-mm1

[Pavel Machek]

Hi!

> > > > And, if I would shine
> > > > a bright light on the screen, I could make out text on it.  In other
> > > > words, the backlight was off but it was still displaying stuff.
> > > 
> > > I cannot reproduce that (T41), but maybe I'm looking at the wrong angle or
> > > your eyes are better. In any case I understand that this image is very
> > > faint.
> > > 
> > > I'm not sure whether this is actually part of the problem. The
> > > liquid crystals might just keep their current orientation, or there might
> > > be some residual charge in the driver circuit. Do you want to take your
> > > display apart and check with a voltmeter? I dont't :-)
> > 
> > If it is still there after half an hour, its certainly part of the problem.
> > LCD crystals loose the orientation in seconds, IIRC.
> > 				Pavel
> 
> I found that on my T40, if I am using the radeonfb built into the kernel
> I cannot see a ghost image, but if I use VESA or vga=normal, I can see a
> ghost in S3.

Well, you can't really expect to run without driver for hardware
(VESA or vga=normal) and still get hardware powersaved correctly.

							Pavel

-- 
Horseback riding is like software...
...vgf orggre jura vgf serr.

ACPI Hibernate and Suspend Strange behavior 2.6.7/-mm1

[Sergio Vergata]

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

Hi all,

I have an IBM t40P.
Starting testing since i got my Laptop, Now starting with 2.6.7 and -mm1 i
Switched from APM to ACPI  and use SwSusp.

Now i trying to get the system working reliable with ACPI, suspending to RAM
will not work as ist should it switch of Display Fan HDD this ist what i see
and hear, but it will not suspend DVDRom an for sure it leave the CPU
powered. I see that cpu i on because the system heats itself up. The time for
the suspended system is round about 10 hours after that the system powers of
and the battery is empty.

Problem number 2 is the problem that of suspending to ram will not reawake the
interrupts of nvram and the acpi interrupts IRQ 9.

Now to the Suspend to Disk problem. Hibernating writes the image to disk
works, but only with disabled apic it poweroff the system in the right way,
with apic the Fan will not shut down don't know if something else isn't
poweredoff.

So i don't use Apic and so acpi works now after powering on the machine and
booting with acpi resume kernel all get to work again. Only sometimes, don't
know why and in witch circumstances, the system boots the kernel and find the
Image in Swapspace, but reading that image says that this is an corruptet
image and stop booting, now if I power the system whith resume=noresume the
kernel boots up find the Image in swap (why that) and restore this found
image back to an running system at the last state. Strange ! After the system
boots everything goes back to work. Only the IRQ problem remains and
hibernating and resuming again will work.

Finaly I have an request: could the acpi_wakeup_devices be addet to some patch
set ? Or preferable to kerneltree it self?!


So i hope someone will read this, and maybe report the same problems, or
better an hint what it could be :-)

CU Sergio
- -- 
Microsoft is to operating systems & security ....
             .... what McDonalds is to gourmet cooking

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ACPI Hibernate and Suspend Strange behavior 2.6.7/-mm1

[Sergio Vergata]

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

Hi all,

I have an IBM t40P. 
Starting testing since i got my Laptop, Now starting with 2.6.7 and -mm1 i 
Switched from APM to ACPI  and use SwSusp.

Now i trying to get the system working reliable with ACPI, suspending to RAM 
will not work as ist should it switch of Display Fan HDD this ist what i see 
and hear, but it will not suspend DVDRom an for sure it leave the CPU 
powered. I see that cpu i on because the system heats itself up. The time for 
the suspended system is round about 10 hours after that the system powers of 
and the battery is empty. 

Problem number 2 is the problem that of suspending to ram will not reawake the 
interrupts of nvram and the acpi interrupts IRQ 9. 

Now to the Suspend to Disk problem. Hibernating writes the image to disk 
works, but only with disabled apic it poweroff the system in the right way, 
with apic the Fan will not shut down don't know if something else isn't 
poweredoff. 

So i don't use Apic and so acpi works now after powering on the machine and 
booting with acpi resume kernel all get to work again. Only sometimes, don't 
know why and in witch circumstances, the system boots the kernel and find the 
Image in Swapspace, but reading that image says that this is an corruptet 
image and stop booting, now if I power the system whith resume=noresume the 
kernel boots up find the Image in swap (why that) and restore this found 
image back to an running system at the last state. Strange ! After the system 
boots everything goes back to work. Only the IRQ problem remains and 
hibernating and resuming again will work. 

Finaly I have an request: could the acpi_wakeup_devices be addet to some patch 
set ? Or preferable to kerneltree it self?! 


So i hope someone will read this, and maybe report the same problems, or 
better an hint what it could be :-) 

CU Sergio

- -- 
Microsoft is to operating systems & security ....
             .... what McDonalds is to gourmet cooking

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Re: ACPI Hibernate and Suspend Strange behavior 2.6.7/-mm1

[Pavel Machek]

Hi!

> So i don't use Apic and so acpi works now after powering on the machine and 
> booting with acpi resume kernel all get to work again. Only sometimes, don't 
> know why and in witch circumstances, the system boots the kernel and find the 
> Image in Swapspace, but reading that image says that this is an corruptet 
> image and stop booting, now if I power the system whith resume=noresume the 
> kernel boots up find the Image in swap (why that) and restore this found 
> image back to an running system at the last state. Strange ! After the system 

fsck now, and never ever resume second time.
If resume fails, force fsck and re-mkswap.
				Pavel

> boots everything goes back to work. Only the IRQ problem remains and 
> hibernating and resuming again will work. 
> 
> Finaly I have an request: could the acpi_wakeup_devices be addet to some patch 
> set ? Or preferable to kerneltree it self?! 
> 
> 
> So i hope someone will read this, and maybe report the same problems, or 
> better an hint what it could be :-) 
> 
> CU Sergio
> 
> - -- 
> Microsoft is to operating systems & security ....
>              .... what McDonalds is to gourmet cooking
> 
> PGP-Key http://vergata.it/GPG/F17FDB2F.asc
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-- 
64 bytes from 195.113.31.123: icmp_seq=28 ttl=51 time=448769.1 ms