Re: [FC1], 2.6.8-rc2 kernel, new motherboard problems

Re: [FC1], 2.6.8-rc2 kernel, new motherboard problems

[Gene Heskett]

On Thursday 22 July 2004 06:52, Gene Heskett wrote:
[...]
>>Let me know, I'm still Curious.
>>
>>Joebewan

[...]

Update, X-Posted to lkml too, I followed the US link from the
TW site, and it had different versions of these files. I stuck
the 2 newest ones from the US site on a floppy and it all worked.

Now I have from "lspci -vvv|grep -A10 Ethernet" which I think is
the same as the previous listing:

00:04.0 Ethernet controller: nVidia Corporation nForce2 Ethernet Controller (rev a1)
        Subsystem: Biostar Microtech Int'l Corp: Unknown device 2301
        Control: I/O+ Mem+ BusMaster+ SpecCycle- MemWINV- VGASnoop- ParErr- Stepping- SERR- FastB2B-
        Status: Cap+ 66Mhz+ UDF- FastB2B+ ParErr- DEVSEL=fast >TAbort- <TAbort- <MAbort- >SERR- <PERR-
        Latency: 0 (250ns min, 5000ns max)
        Interrupt: pin A routed to IRQ 11
        Region 0: Memory at dc005000 (32-bit, non-prefetchable) [size=4K]
        Region 1: I/O ports at c400 [size=8]
        Capabilities: [44] Power Management version 2
                Flags: PMEClk- DSI- D1+ D2+ AuxCurrent=0mA PME(D0+,D1+,D2+,D3hot+,D3cold+)
                Status: D0 PME-Enable- DSel=0 DScale=0 PME-

However, this, nor the xconfig helps, still don't indicate which
driver I should be using, or where to get it if its not in the
kernel's tree yet a/o 2.6.8-rc2.  So thats the next piece of data I need.

And I haven't attempted to dismantle it to see the MAC address yet.
At nearly 70, sitting tailor fashion on the floor for extended periods
isn't nearly as comfortable as it once was :-)  Which is what that
dismantle will require, the tower its in is trapped under a homemade
desk by some steel bracing I put in when I made it 15 years ago...
But, one could probably rebuild a nearly half ton mopar 392 hemi-head
on it too :-)

-- 
Cheers, Gene
There are 4 boxes to be used in defense of liberty. 
Soap, ballot, jury, and ammo.
Please use in that order, starting now.  -Ed Howdershelt, Author
Additions to this message made by Gene Heskett are Copyright 2004, 
Maurice E. Heskett, all rights reserved.

Re: [FC1], 2.6.8-rc2 kernel, new motherboard problems

[Nuno Monteiro]

On 2004.07.22 13:49, Gene Heskett wrote:
> 
> 00:04.0 Ethernet controller: nVidia Corporation nForce2 Ethernet
> Controller (rev a1)
>         Subsystem: Biostar Microtech Int'l Corp: Unknown device 2301

> However, this, nor the xconfig helps, still don't indicate which
> driver I should be using, or where to get it if its not in the
> kernel's tree yet a/o 2.6.8-rc2.  So thats the next piece of data I
> need.

Hi Gene,


I believe you'll need forcedeth.c for this one. It's called "Reverse  
Engineered nForce Ethernet support", under Device Driver -> Networking ->  
Ethernet 10/100 Mbit.


Cheers,


		Nuno

Re: [FC1], 2.6.8-rc2 kernel, new motherboard problems

[Lee Revell]

On Thu, 2004-07-22 at 14:49, Nuno Monteiro wrote:
> On 2004.07.22 13:49, Gene Heskett wrote:
> > 
> > 00:04.0 Ethernet controller: nVidia Corporation nForce2 Ethernet
> > Controller (rev a1)
> >         Subsystem: Biostar Microtech Int'l Corp: Unknown device 2301
> 
> > However, this, nor the xconfig helps, still don't indicate which
> > driver I should be using, or where to get it if its not in the
> > kernel's tree yet a/o 2.6.8-rc2.  So thats the next piece of data I
> > need.
> 
> Hi Gene,
> 
> 
> I believe you'll need forcedeth.c for this one. It's called "Reverse  
> Engineered nForce Ethernet support", under Device Driver -> Networking ->  
> Ethernet 10/100 Mbit.

Wow, nVidia won't release the specs for a *10/100 ethernet controller*? 
Having to reverse engineer a network driver is ridiculous in this day
and age.  I can understand binary-only graphics drivers, there is a lot
of valuable IP in there, but this is a freaking network card.  What do
they expect people to do?

Maybe some bad press would set them straight.

Lee

Re: [FC1], 2.6.8-rc2 kernel, new motherboard problems

[Gene Heskett]

On Friday 23 July 2004 20:55, Lee Revell wrote:
>On Thu, 2004-07-22 at 14:49, Nuno Monteiro wrote:
>> On 2004.07.22 13:49, Gene Heskett wrote:
>> > 00:04.0 Ethernet controller: nVidia Corporation nForce2 Ethernet
>> > Controller (rev a1)
>> >         Subsystem: Biostar Microtech Int'l Corp: Unknown device
>> > 2301
>> >
>> > However, this, nor the xconfig helps, still don't indicate which
>> > driver I should be using, or where to get it if its not in the
>> > kernel's tree yet a/o 2.6.8-rc2.  So thats the next piece of
>> > data I need.
>>
>> Hi Gene,
>>
>>
>> I believe you'll need forcedeth.c for this one. It's called
>> "Reverse Engineered nForce Ethernet support", under Device Driver
>> -> Networking -> Ethernet 10/100 Mbit.
>
>Wow, nVidia won't release the specs for a *10/100 ethernet
> controller*? Having to reverse engineer a network driver is
> ridiculous in this day and age.  I can understand binary-only
> graphics drivers, there is a lot of valuable IP in there, but this
> is a freaking network card.  What do they expect people to do?
>
>Maybe some bad press would set them straight.
>
>Lee

Well, I have it working now.  The real problem is an arp cacheing 
problem I believe.  It works exactly as expected when I give that 
device the same MAC address in the machines bios settings as the 
D-Link card had.  And I don't know howto force arp to refresh its 
cache before it times out, which it didn't do in something like 14 
hours.  It would have been something I would have had to do on a 
RH7.3 box, which has so far been dead stable with over a 70 day 
uptime now.  For all I know, maybe a reboot would have fixed it as I 
have NDI where this 'arp cache' is located, and if in memory only, a 
powerdown would have forced a refresh.  I can think of a lot of "what 
if's" :-)

Nvidia is immune to bad press, and probably cannot release a thing 
other than some API help due to copyright contracts with the coders 
who wrote their winderz drivers for them,  The only cure would be for 
them to hired a couple of dozen programmers of the minimum quality 
the open source programmers exhibit, which I happen to think is top 
notch, and the CEO can only see outgo without compensatory income for 
all that salary, so they contract it out for a known cost, and get 
tied up in restrictive contracts.

Fscking copyright problems will be the end of any resemblance of 
civilization before the Warren Hatches have fallen by the wayside.  
Its happening right before our eyes.

-- 
Cheers, Gene
There are 4 boxes to be used in defense of liberty. 
Soap, ballot, jury, and ammo.
Please use in that order, starting now.  -Ed Howdershelt, Author
Additions to this message made by Gene Heskett are Copyright 2004, 
Maurice E. Heskett, all rights reserved.

Re: [FC1], 2.6.8-rc2 kernel, new motherboard problems

[Lee Revell]

On Sat, 2004-07-24 at 01:58, Gene Heskett wrote:
> On Friday 23 July 2004 20:55, Lee Revell wrote:
> >On Thu, 2004-07-22 at 14:49, Nuno Monteiro wrote:
> >> On 2004.07.22 13:49, Gene Heskett wrote:
> >> > 00:04.0 Ethernet controller: nVidia Corporation nForce2 Ethernet
> >> > Controller (rev a1)
> >> >         Subsystem: Biostar Microtech Int'l Corp: Unknown device
> >> > 2301
> >> >
> >> > However, this, nor the xconfig helps, still don't indicate which
> >> > driver I should be using, or where to get it if its not in the
> >> > kernel's tree yet a/o 2.6.8-rc2.  So thats the next piece of
> >> > data I need.
> >>
> >> Hi Gene,
> >>
> >>
> >> I believe you'll need forcedeth.c for this one. It's called
> >> "Reverse Engineered nForce Ethernet support", under Device Driver
> >> -> Networking -> Ethernet 10/100 Mbit.
> >
> >Wow, nVidia won't release the specs for a *10/100 ethernet
> > controller*? Having to reverse engineer a network driver is
> > ridiculous in this day and age.  I can understand binary-only
> > graphics drivers, there is a lot of valuable IP in there, but this
> > is a freaking network card.  What do they expect people to do?
> >
> >Maybe some bad press would set them straight.
> >
> >Lee
> 
> Nvidia is immune to bad press, and probably cannot release a thing 
> other than some API help due to copyright contracts with the coders 
> who wrote their winderz drivers for them,  The only cure would be for 
> them to hired a couple of dozen programmers of the minimum quality 
> the open source programmers exhibit, which I happen to think is top 
> notch, and the CEO can only see outgo without compensatory income for 
> all that salary, so they contract it out for a known cost, and get 
> tied up in restrictive contracts.
> 

I am not talking about them releasing driver code, I am just talking
about datasheets so we can write our own driver, something that tells
you which bits to write to which registers to get it to do $FOO.

Their net cost: $0.

Lee

Re: [FC1], 2.6.8-rc2 kernel, new motherboard problems

[Chris Wedgwood]

On Sat, Jul 24, 2004 at 02:06:47AM -0400, Lee Revell wrote:

> I am not talking about them releasing driver code, I am just talking
> about datasheets so we can write our own driver, something that
> tells you which bits to write to which registers to get it to do
> $FOO.

nv traditionally are very poor in this respect

> Their net cost: $0.

they claimed that it would give competitors too much insight to their
hardware (obviously true since nobody else makes 3D-hardware or
network controllers)


   --cw

Re: [FC1], 2.6.8-rc2 kernel, new motherboard problems

[Gene Heskett]

On Saturday 24 July 2004 02:06, Lee Revell wrote:
>On Sat, 2004-07-24 at 01:58, Gene Heskett wrote:
>> On Friday 23 July 2004 20:55, Lee Revell wrote:
>> >On Thu, 2004-07-22 at 14:49, Nuno Monteiro wrote:
>> >> On 2004.07.22 13:49, Gene Heskett wrote:
>> >> > 00:04.0 Ethernet controller: nVidia Corporation nForce2
>> >> > Ethernet Controller (rev a1)
>> >> >         Subsystem: Biostar Microtech Int'l Corp: Unknown
>> >> > device 2301
>> >> >
>> >> > However, this, nor the xconfig helps, still don't indicate
>> >> > which driver I should be using, or where to get it if its not
>> >> > in the kernel's tree yet a/o 2.6.8-rc2.  So thats the next
>> >> > piece of data I need.
>> >>
>> >> Hi Gene,
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> I believe you'll need forcedeth.c for this one. It's called
>> >> "Reverse Engineered nForce Ethernet support", under Device
>> >> Driver -> Networking -> Ethernet 10/100 Mbit.
>> >
>> >Wow, nVidia won't release the specs for a *10/100 ethernet
>> > controller*? Having to reverse engineer a network driver is
>> > ridiculous in this day and age.  I can understand binary-only
>> > graphics drivers, there is a lot of valuable IP in there, but
>> > this is a freaking network card.  What do they expect people to
>> > do?
>> >
>> >Maybe some bad press would set them straight.
>> >
>> >Lee
>>
>> Nvidia is immune to bad press, and probably cannot release a thing
>> other than some API help due to copyright contracts with the
>> coders who wrote their winderz drivers for them,  The only cure
>> would be for them to hired a couple of dozen programmers of the
>> minimum quality the open source programmers exhibit, which I
>> happen to think is top notch, and the CEO can only see outgo
>> without compensatory income for all that salary, so they contract
>> it out for a known cost, and get tied up in restrictive contracts.
>
>I am not talking about them releasing driver code, I am just talking
>about datasheets so we can write our own driver, something that
> tells you which bits to write to which registers to get it to do
> $FOO.
>
>Their net cost: $0.
>
>Lee

I'm under the impression the forcedeth writers did have access to this 
data.  Is this incorrect? The qusetion is directed at the forcedeth 
authors.  If you are one, then please clarify.

-- 
Cheers, Gene
There are 4 boxes to be used in defense of liberty. 
Soap, ballot, jury, and ammo.
Please use in that order, starting now.  -Ed Howdershelt, Author
Additions to this message made by Gene Heskett are Copyright 2004, 
Maurice E. Heskett, all rights reserved.

Re: [FC1], 2.6.8-rc2 kernel, new motherboard problems

[Gene Heskett]

On Saturday 24 July 2004 02:10, Chris Wedgwood wrote:
>On Sat, Jul 24, 2004 at 02:06:47AM -0400, Lee Revell wrote:
>> I am not talking about them releasing driver code, I am just
>> talking about datasheets so we can write our own driver, something
>> that tells you which bits to write to which registers to get it to
>> do $FOO.
>
>nv traditionally are very poor in this respect
>
>> Their net cost: $0.
>
>they claimed that it would give competitors too much insight to
> their hardware (obviously true since nobody else makes 3D-hardware
> or network controllers)

Excuse me, but just exactly what is considered to be "3d"?  The screen 
I'm looking at is a 17" nearly flat crt, and damned sharp considering 
this NEC 5FG is now at least 10 years old, and I've never seen 
anything on it that could be construed to be "3d", not even in my 
wildest, had too many beers or Black Jacks dreams.

Methinks its an overused advertizing phrase that should be tossed in 
the bin (and miss-use of it prosecuted as false advertizing) until 
such time as it can actually, without any special glasses, display an 
image with true depth.

-- 
Cheers, Gene
There are 4 boxes to be used in defense of liberty. 
Soap, ballot, jury, and ammo.
Please use in that order, starting now.  -Ed Howdershelt, Author
Additions to this message made by Gene Heskett are Copyright 2004, 
Maurice E. Heskett, all rights reserved.

Re: [FC1], 2.6.8-rc2 kernel, new motherboard problems

[Carl-Daniel Hailfinger]

Gene Heskett schrieb:

> On Saturday 24 July 2004 02:06, Lee Revell wrote:
> 
>>On Sat, 2004-07-24 at 01:58, Gene Heskett wrote:
>>
>>>On Friday 23 July 2004 20:55, Lee Revell wrote:
>>>
>>>>On Thu, 2004-07-22 at 14:49, Nuno Monteiro wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>On 2004.07.22 13:49, Gene Heskett wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>00:04.0 Ethernet controller: nVidia Corporation nForce2
>>>>>>Ethernet Controller (rev a1)
>>>>>>        Subsystem: Biostar Microtech Int'l Corp: Unknown
>>>>>>device 2301
>>>>>>
>>>>>>However, this, nor the xconfig helps, still don't indicate
>>>>>>which driver I should be using, or where to get it if its not
>>>>>>in the kernel's tree yet a/o 2.6.8-rc2.  So thats the next
>>>>>>piece of data I need.
>>>>>
>>>>>Hi Gene,
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>I believe you'll need forcedeth.c for this one. It's called
>>>>>"Reverse Engineered nForce Ethernet support", under Device
>>>>>Driver -> Networking -> Ethernet 10/100 Mbit.

Right. And it should work perfectly with that driver. However, I recommend
to use at least 2.6.8-rc2 because it has some bugfixes you may need.


>>>>Wow, nVidia won't release the specs for a *10/100 ethernet
>>>>controller*? Having to reverse engineer a network driver is
>>>>ridiculous in this day and age.  I can understand binary-only
>>>>graphics drivers, there is a lot of valuable IP in there, but
>>>>this is a freaking network card.  What do they expect people to
>>>>do?
>>>>
>>>>Maybe some bad press would set them straight.
>>>>
>>>>Lee

Could you please check the facts (or ask the driver authors) before
suggesting to haunt NVidia with bad press? Thanks.


>>>Nvidia is immune to bad press, and probably cannot release a thing
>>>other than some API help due to copyright contracts with the
>>>coders who wrote their winderz drivers for them,  The only cure
>>>would be for them to hired a couple of dozen programmers of the
>>>minimum quality the open source programmers exhibit, which I
>>>happen to think is top notch, and the CEO can only see outgo
>>>without compensatory income for all that salary, so they contract
>>>it out for a known cost, and get tied up in restrictive contracts.
>>
>>I am not talking about them releasing driver code, I am just talking
>>about datasheets so we can write our own driver, something that
>>tells you which bits to write to which registers to get it to do
>>$FOO.
>>
>>Their net cost: $0.
>>
>>Lee
> 
> 
> I'm under the impression the forcedeth writers did have access to this 
> data.  Is this incorrect? The question is directed at the forcedeth 
> authors.  If you are one, then please clarify.

I am one of the authors. We did not have any information in the first
place, but now that our reverse engineered driver works well, NVidia
contributed bugfixes and gigabit support to our driver.


Regards,
Carl-Daniel
-- 
http://www.hailfinger.org/

Re: [FC1], 2.6.8-rc2 kernel, new motherboard problems

[Gene Heskett]

On Saturday 24 July 2004 08:16, Carl-Daniel Hailfinger wrote:
>Gene Heskett schrieb:
>> On Saturday 24 July 2004 02:06, Lee Revell wrote:
[...]
>>>>>>I believe you'll need forcedeth.c for this one. It's called
>>>>>>"Reverse Engineered nForce Ethernet support", under Device
>>>>>>Driver -> Networking -> Ethernet 10/100 Mbit.
>
>Right. And it should work perfectly with that driver. However, I
> recommend to use at least 2.6.8-rc2 because it has some bugfixes
> you may need.

Thats the kernel version I'm running already :)
[...]
>>>>>Maybe some bad press would set them straight.
>>>>>
>>>>>Lee
[...]
>> I'm under the impression the forcedeth writers did have access to
>> this data.  Is this incorrect? The question is directed at the
>> forcedeth authors.  If you are one, then please clarify.
>
>I am one of the authors. We did not have any information in the
> first place, but now that our reverse engineered driver works well,
> NVidia contributed bugfixes and gigabit support to our driver.

Which would be nice I guess, if the rest of my system wasn't limited 
to 100mb/sec.  In my case here at home, thats plenty fast enough.

In any event thanks for the info.  My biggest squawk is that so far, 
I've had to assign it the same MAC address as the old D-Link card 
wore in order to make the firewall pass me.  arp problems I think.  
Other than that, its working great.

>Regards,
>Carl-Daniel

-- 
Cheers Carl-Daniel, Gene
There are 4 boxes to be used in defense of liberty. 
Soap, ballot, jury, and ammo.
Please use in that order, starting now.  -Ed Howdershelt, Author
Additions to this message made by Gene Heskett are Copyright 2004, 
Maurice E. Heskett, all rights reserved.

Re: [FC1], 2.6.8-rc2 kernel, new motherboard problems

[Lee Revell]

On Sat, 2004-07-24 at 08:16, Carl-Daniel Hailfinger wrote:
> Gene Heskett schrieb:
> 
> > On Saturday 24 July 2004 02:06, Lee Revell wrote:

> >>>>Wow, nVidia won't release the specs for a *10/100 ethernet
> >>>>controller*? Having to reverse engineer a network driver is
> >>>>ridiculous in this day and age.  I can understand binary-only
> >>>>graphics drivers, there is a lot of valuable IP in there, but
> >>>>this is a freaking network card.  What do they expect people to
> >>>>do?
> >>>>
> >>>>Maybe some bad press would set them straight.
> >>>>
> >>>>Lee
> 
> Could you please check the facts (or ask the driver authors) before
> suggesting to haunt NVidia with bad press? Thanks.
> 

All the facts I needed to know were in the original post.  You had to
reverse engineer a network driver because Nvidia would not release
specs.  We should not be having to reverse engineer a 10/100 ethernet
controller in 2004.  The Linux community should make noise when vendors
do this.
 
> > I'm under the impression the forcedeth writers did have access to this 
> > data.  Is this incorrect? The question is directed at the forcedeth 
> > authors.  If you are one, then please clarify.
> 
> I am one of the authors. We did not have any information in the first
> place, but now that our reverse engineered driver works well, NVidia
> contributed bugfixes and gigabit support to our driver.

This is pretty shoddy on their part.  Like I said, I can understand not
wanting to release the specs for their GFX cards, but a freaking 10/100
ethernet controller is ridiculous.

Lee