public inbox for linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org
 help / color / mirror / Atom feed
From: Alan Cox <alan@lxorguk.ukuu.org.uk>
To: William Lee Irwin III <wli@holomorphy.com>
Cc: Robert Love <rml@ximian.com>,
	Andrea Arcangeli <andrea@novell.com>,
	Nick Piggin <nickpiggin@yahoo.com.au>,
	Ingo Molnar <mingo@elte.hu>, Andrew Morton <akpm@osdl.org>,
	Linux Kernel Mailing List <linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org>
Subject: Re: [patch] sched: fix scheduling latencies for !PREEMPT kernels
Date: Tue, 14 Sep 2004 20:19:57 +0100	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <1095189593.16988.72.camel@localhost.localdomain> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <20040914192104.GB9106@holomorphy.com>

On Maw, 2004-09-14 at 20:21, William Lee Irwin III wrote:
> The "safely call schedule() while holding it" needs quite a bit of
> qualification; it's implicitly dropped during voluntary context
> switches and reacquired when rescheduled, but it's not valid to force
> such a task into an involuntary context switch and calling schedule()
> implies dropping the lock, so it has to be done at the proper times.
> This is a complex semantic that likely trips up numerous callers (as
> well as attempts to explain it, though surely you know these things,
> and merely wanted a shorter line for the bullet point).

The problem is people think of the BKL as a lock. It isn't a lock it has
never been a lock and it's all DaveM's fault 8) for naming it that when
he moved my asm entry point stuff into C.

The BKL turns on old style unix non-pre-emptive sematics between all
code that is within lock_kernel sections, that is it. That also makes it
hard to clean up because lock_kernel is delimiting code properties (its
essentially almost a function attribute) and spin_lock/down/up and
friends are real locks and lock data.

I've seen very few cases where there is a magic transform from one to
the other because of this. So if you want to kill the BKL add proper
locking to data structures covered by BKL users until the lock_kernel
simply does nothing.

> or sweeps others care to devolve to me, so I'll largely be using
> whatever tactic whoever cares to drive all this (probably Alan) prefers.

Fix the data structure locking starting at the lowest level is how I've
always tackled these messes. When the low level locking is right the
rest just works (usually 8)).

	"Lock data not code"

Alan


  reply	other threads:[~2004-09-14 20:33 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 76+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2004-09-14  9:15 [patch] preempt-cleanup.patch, 2.6.9-rc2 Ingo Molnar
2004-09-14  9:34 ` [printk] make console_conditional_schedule() __sched and use cond_resched() William Lee Irwin III
2004-09-14  9:38 ` [patch] preempt-lock-need-resched.patch, 2.6.9-rc2 Ingo Molnar
2004-09-14  9:51   ` [patch] sched: add cond_resched_softirq() Ingo Molnar
2004-09-14  9:57     ` [patch] sched: fix latency in random driver Ingo Molnar
2004-09-14 10:06       ` [patch] sched, ext3: fix scheduling latencies in ext3 Ingo Molnar
2004-09-14 10:13         ` [patch] sched, vfs: fix scheduling latencies in invalidate_inodes() Ingo Molnar
2004-09-14 10:19         ` [patch] sched, vfs: fix scheduling latencies in prune_dcache() and select_parent() Ingo Molnar
2004-09-14 10:25           ` [patch] sched, net: fix scheduling latencies in netstat Ingo Molnar
2004-09-14 10:44             ` [patch] sched, net: fix scheduling latencies in __release_sock Ingo Molnar
2004-09-14 10:50               ` [patch] sched, mm: fix scheduling latencies in copy_page_range() Ingo Molnar
2004-09-14 10:56                 ` [patch] sched, mm: fix scheduling latencies in unmap_vmas() Ingo Molnar
2004-09-14 10:59                 ` [patch] sched, mm: fix scheduling latencies in get_user_pages() Ingo Molnar
2004-09-14 11:02                   ` [patch] sched, mm: fix scheduling latencies in filemap_sync() Ingo Molnar
2004-09-14 11:06                     ` [patch] sched, tty: fix scheduling latencies in tty_io.c Ingo Molnar
2004-09-14 10:53                       ` Alan Cox
2004-09-14 12:00                         ` Ingo Molnar
2004-09-14 11:18                           ` Alan Cox
2004-09-14 12:27                             ` Ingo Molnar
2004-09-14 12:11                               ` Alan Cox
2004-09-14 11:08                       ` [patch] sched, pty: fix scheduling latencies in pty.c Ingo Molnar
2004-09-14 11:12                         ` [patch] might_sleep() additions to fs-writeback.c Ingo Molnar
2004-09-14 11:25                         ` [patch] fix keventd execution dependency Ingo Molnar
2004-09-15 22:18                           ` Rusty Russell
2004-09-14 11:28                       ` [patch] sched: fix scheduling latencies in mttr.c Ingo Molnar
2004-09-14 11:32                         ` [patch] sched: fix scheduling latencies in vgacon.c Ingo Molnar
2004-09-14 11:35                         ` [patch] sched: fix scheduling latencies in NTFS mount Ingo Molnar
2004-09-14 13:31                           ` Anton Altaparmakov
2004-09-14 11:42                         ` [patch] sched: fix scheduling latencies for !PREEMPT kernels Ingo Molnar
2004-09-14 12:55                           ` Nick Piggin
2004-09-14 13:22                             ` Ingo Molnar
2004-09-14 13:33                               ` Nick Piggin
2004-09-14 14:09                                 ` Andrea Arcangeli
2004-09-14 14:28                                   ` Nick Piggin
2004-09-14 15:03                                     ` Andrea Arcangeli
2004-09-14 18:05                                       ` Robert Love
2004-09-14 18:52                                         ` William Lee Irwin III
2004-09-14 19:02                                           ` Robert Love
2004-09-14 19:21                                             ` William Lee Irwin III
2004-09-14 19:19                                               ` Alan Cox [this message]
2004-09-15  0:22                                                 ` Lee Revell
2004-09-15  1:46                                                   ` William Lee Irwin III
2004-09-15  2:00                                                     ` Lee Revell
2004-09-15  2:36                                                       ` William Lee Irwin III
2004-09-15  2:59                                                         ` Lee Revell
2004-09-15 13:36                                                         ` Hans Reiser
2004-09-15 20:40                                                           ` William Lee Irwin III
2004-09-15  1:18                                                 ` William Lee Irwin III
2004-09-14 19:26                                               ` Robert Love
2004-09-14 21:06                                               ` William Lee Irwin III
2004-09-14 19:25                                             ` Andrea Arcangeli
2004-09-14 19:29                                               ` Robert Love
2004-09-14 19:34                                               ` William Lee Irwin III
2004-09-15  1:02                                       ` Lee Revell
2004-09-15  1:39                                         ` William Lee Irwin III
2004-09-15  2:11                                           ` Lee Revell
2004-09-15 11:17                                             ` Ingo Molnar
2004-09-15  9:56                                           ` Ingo Molnar
2004-09-15  9:57                                             ` William Lee Irwin III
2004-09-15 10:12                                               ` Ingo Molnar
2004-09-14 16:31                                   ` William Lee Irwin III
2004-09-14 16:39                                     ` Andrea Arcangeli
2004-09-14 14:54                                 ` Ingo Molnar
2004-09-14 22:55                                   ` Nick Piggin
2004-09-15  6:19                                     ` Ingo Molnar
2004-09-15  8:23                                       ` Nick Piggin
2004-09-15  8:43                                         ` Ingo Molnar
2004-09-15 10:09                                           ` William Lee Irwin III
2004-09-15 10:21                                             ` Ingo Molnar
2004-09-16  1:03                                           ` Nick Piggin
2004-09-16  6:14                                             ` Ingo Molnar
2004-09-15  0:35                                   ` Lee Revell
2004-09-14 13:25                         ` [patch] sched: fix scheduling latencies in mtrr.c Ingo Molnar
2004-09-14 13:15                           ` Alan Cox
2004-09-14 15:00                             ` Ingo Molnar
2004-09-14 18:22                           ` Zwane Mwaikambo

Reply instructions:

You may reply publicly to this message via plain-text email
using any one of the following methods:

* Save the following mbox file, import it into your mail client,
  and reply-to-all from there: mbox

  Avoid top-posting and favor interleaved quoting:
  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Posting_style#Interleaved_style

* Reply using the --to, --cc, and --in-reply-to
  switches of git-send-email(1):

  git send-email \
    --in-reply-to=1095189593.16988.72.camel@localhost.localdomain \
    --to=alan@lxorguk.ukuu.org.uk \
    --cc=akpm@osdl.org \
    --cc=andrea@novell.com \
    --cc=linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org \
    --cc=mingo@elte.hu \
    --cc=nickpiggin@yahoo.com.au \
    --cc=rml@ximian.com \
    --cc=wli@holomorphy.com \
    /path/to/YOUR_REPLY

  https://kernel.org/pub/software/scm/git/docs/git-send-email.html

* If your mail client supports setting the In-Reply-To header
  via mailto: links, try the mailto: link
Be sure your reply has a Subject: header at the top and a blank line before the message body.
This is a public inbox, see mirroring instructions
for how to clone and mirror all data and code used for this inbox