Head parking (was: IBM HDAPS things are looking up)

Head parking (was: IBM HDAPS things are looking up)

[Martin Knoblauch]

On Thu, Jul 07 2005, Pekka Enberg wrote:
> Jens Axboe wrote:
> > > ATA7 defines a park maneuvre, I don't know how well supported it
is
> > > yet though. You can test with this little app, if it says 'head
> > > parked' it works. If not, it has just idled the drive.
>
> On 7/7/05, Lenz Grimmer <lenz@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> > Great! Thanks for digging this up - it works on my T42, using a
Fujitsu
> > MHT2080AH drive:
>
> Works on my T42p which uses a Hitachi HTS726060M9AT00 drive. I don't
> hear any sound, though.

 Interesting. Same Notebook, same drive. The program say "not parked"
:-( This is on FC2 with a pretty much vanilla 2.6.9 kernel.

[root@l15833 tmp]# uname -a
Linux l15833 2.6.9-noagp #1 Wed May 4 16:09:14 CEST 2005 i686 i686 i386
GNU/Linux
[root@l15833 tmp]# hdparm -i /dev/hda

/dev/hda:

 Model=HTS726060M9AT00, FwRev=MH4OA6BA, SerialNo=MRH403M4GS88XB
 Config={ HardSect NotMFM HdSw>15uSec Fixed DTR>10Mbs }
 RawCHS=16383/16/63, TrkSize=0, SectSize=0, ECCbytes=4
 BuffType=DualPortCache, BuffSize=7877kB, MaxMultSect=16, MultSect=16
 CurCHS=16383/16/63, CurSects=16514064, LBA=yes, LBAsects=117210240
 IORDY=on/off, tPIO={min:240,w/IORDY:120}, tDMA={min:120,rec:120}
 PIO modes:  pio0 pio1 pio2 pio3 pio4
 DMA modes:  mdma0 mdma1 mdma2
 UDMA modes: udma0 udma1 udma2 udma3 udma4 *udma5
 AdvancedPM=yes: mode=0x80 (128) WriteCache=enabled
 Drive conforms to: ATA/ATAPI-6 T13 1410D revision 3a:

 * signifies the current active mode

[root@l15833 tmp]# ./park /dev/hda
head not parked 4c
[root@l15833 tmp]#

Cheers
Martin

------------------------------------------------------
Martin Knoblauch
email: k n o b i AT knobisoft DOT de
www:   http://www.knobisoft.de

Re: Head parking (was: IBM HDAPS things are looking up)

[Pekka Enberg]

On 7/7/05, Martin Knoblauch <knobi@knobisoft.de> wrote:
>  Interesting. Same Notebook, same drive. The program say "not parked"
> :-( This is on FC2 with a pretty much vanilla 2.6.9 kernel.
> 
> [root@l15833 tmp]# uname -a
> Linux l15833 2.6.9-noagp #1 Wed May 4 16:09:14 CEST 2005 i686 i686 i386
> GNU/Linux
> [root@l15833 tmp]# hdparm -i /dev/hda
> 
> /dev/hda:
> 
>  Model=HTS726060M9AT00, FwRev=MH4OA6BA, SerialNo=MRH403M4GS88XB
>  Config={ HardSect NotMFM HdSw>15uSec Fixed DTR>10Mbs }
>  RawCHS=16383/16/63, TrkSize=0, SectSize=0, ECCbytes=4
>  BuffType=DualPortCache, BuffSize=7877kB, MaxMultSect=16, MultSect=16
>  CurCHS=16383/16/63, CurSects=16514064, LBA=yes, LBAsects=117210240
>  IORDY=on/off, tPIO={min:240,w/IORDY:120}, tDMA={min:120,rec:120}
>  PIO modes:  pio0 pio1 pio2 pio3 pio4
>  DMA modes:  mdma0 mdma1 mdma2
>  UDMA modes: udma0 udma1 udma2 udma3 udma4 *udma5
>  AdvancedPM=yes: mode=0x80 (128) WriteCache=enabled
>  Drive conforms to: ATA/ATAPI-6 T13 1410D revision 3a:
> 
>  * signifies the current active mode
> 
> [root@l15833 tmp]# ./park /dev/hda
> head not parked 4c
> [root@l15833 tmp]#

Martin, don't trim the cc!

haji ~ # uname -a
Linux haji 2.6.12 #12 Mon Jun 20 09:39:37 EEST 2005 i686 Intel(R)
Pentium(R) M processor 2.00GHz GenuineIntel GNU/Linux

haji ~ # hdparm -i /dev/hda

/dev/hda:

 Model=HTS726060M9AT00, FwRev=MH4OA6DA, SerialNo=MRH453M4H2A6PB
 Config={ HardSect NotMFM HdSw>15uSec Fixed DTR>10Mbs }
 RawCHS=16383/16/63, TrkSize=0, SectSize=0, ECCbytes=4
 BuffType=DualPortCache, BuffSize=7877kB, MaxMultSect=16, MultSect=16
 CurCHS=16383/16/63, CurSects=16514064, LBA=yes, LBAsects=117210240
 IORDY=on/off, tPIO={min:240,w/IORDY:120}, tDMA={min:120,rec:120}
 PIO modes:  pio0 pio1 pio2 pio3 pio4
 DMA modes:  mdma0 mdma1 mdma2
 UDMA modes: udma0 udma1 udma2 udma3 udma4 *udma5
 AdvancedPM=yes: mode=0x80 (128) WriteCache=enabled
 Drive conforms to: ATA/ATAPI-6 T13 1410D revision 3a:

 * signifies the current active mode

Re: Head parking (was: IBM HDAPS things are looking up)

[Martin Knoblauch]

--- Pekka Enberg <penberg@gmail.com> wrote:

> 
> Martin, don't trim the cc!
> 

 sorry about that, but I did not have the CC at time of reply. I read
LKLM from the archives and respond by cut and paste.

Martin


------------------------------------------------------
Martin Knoblauch
email: k n o b i AT knobisoft DOT de
www:   http://www.knobisoft.de

Re: Head parking (was: IBM HDAPS things are looking up)

[Dan Christensen]

# ./park /dev/hda
head not parked 4c

# hdparm -i /dev/hda

/dev/hda:

 Model=HTS548040M9AT00, FwRev=MG2OA53A, SerialNo=MRL252L2JU2JYB
 Config={ HardSect NotMFM HdSw>15uSec Fixed DTR>10Mbs }
 RawCHS=16383/16/63, TrkSize=0, SectSize=0, ECCbytes=4
 BuffType=DualPortCache, BuffSize=7877kB, MaxMultSect=16, MultSect=off
 CurCHS=16383/16/63, CurSects=16514064, LBA=yes, LBAsects=78140160
 IORDY=on/off, tPIO={min:240,w/IORDY:120}, tDMA={min:120,rec:120}
 PIO modes:  pio0 pio1 pio2 pio3 pio4 
 DMA modes:  mdma0 mdma1 mdma2 
 UDMA modes: udma0 udma1 udma2 udma3 udma4 *udma5 
 AdvancedPM=yes: mode=0x80 (128) WriteCache=enabled
 Drive conforms to: ATA/ATAPI-6 T13 1410D revision 3a: 

 * signifies the current active mode

Dan

Re: Head parking (was: IBM HDAPS things are looking up)

[Martin Knoblauch]

--- Pekka Enberg <penberg@gmail.com> wrote:

> On 7/7/05, Martin Knoblauch <knobi@knobisoft.de> wrote:
> >  Interesting. Same Notebook, same drive. The program say "not
> parked"
> > :-( This is on FC2 with a pretty much vanilla 2.6.9 kernel.
> > 
> > [root@l15833 tmp]# hdparm -i /dev/hda
> > 
> > /dev/hda:
> > 
> >  Model=HTS726060M9AT00, FwRev=MH4OA6BA, SerialNo=MRH403M4GS88XB
> 
> haji ~ # hdparm -i /dev/hda
> 
> /dev/hda:
> 
>  Model=HTS726060M9AT00, FwRev=MH4OA6DA, SerialNo=MRH453M4H2A6PB

 OK, different FW levels. After upgrading my disk to MH40A6GA my head
parks :-) Minimum required level for this disk seems to be A6DA. Hope
this info is useful. 

[root@l15833 tmp]# hdparm -i /dev/hda

/dev/hda:

 Model=HTS726060M9AT00, FwRev=MH4OA6GA, SerialNo=MRH403M4GS88XB
 Config={ HardSect NotMFM HdSw>15uSec Fixed DTR>10Mbs }
 RawCHS=16383/16/63, TrkSize=0, SectSize=0, ECCbytes=4
 BuffType=DualPortCache, BuffSize=7877kB, MaxMultSect=16, MultSect=16
 CurCHS=16383/16/63, CurSects=16514064, LBA=yes, LBAsects=117210240
 IORDY=on/off, tPIO={min:240,w/IORDY:120}, tDMA={min:120,rec:120}
 PIO modes:  pio0 pio1 pio2 pio3 pio4
 DMA modes:  mdma0 mdma1 mdma2
 UDMA modes: udma0 udma1 udma2 udma3 udma4 *udma5
 AdvancedPM=yes: mode=0x80 (128) WriteCache=enabled
 Drive conforms to: ATA/ATAPI-6 T13 1410D revision 3a:

 * signifies the current active mode

[root@l15833 tmp]# ./park /dev/hda
head parked
[root@l15833 tmp]#


Cheers
Martin

------------------------------------------------------
Martin Knoblauch
email: k n o b i AT knobisoft DOT de
www:   http://www.knobisoft.de

RE: Head parking (was: IBM HDAPS things are looking up)

[Alejandro Bonilla]

> --- Pekka Enberg <penberg@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > On 7/7/05, Martin Knoblauch <knobi@knobisoft.de> wrote:
> > >  Interesting. Same Notebook, same drive. The program say "not
> > parked"
> > > :-( This is on FC2 with a pretty much vanilla 2.6.9 kernel.
> > >
> > > [root@l15833 tmp]# hdparm -i /dev/hda
> > >
> > > /dev/hda:
> > >
> > >  Model=HTS726060M9AT00, FwRev=MH4OA6BA, SerialNo=MRH403M4GS88XB
> >
> > haji ~ # hdparm -i /dev/hda
> >
> > /dev/hda:
> >
> >  Model=HTS726060M9AT00, FwRev=MH4OA6DA, SerialNo=MRH453M4H2A6PB
>
>  OK, different FW levels. After upgrading my disk to MH40A6GA my head
> parks :-) Minimum required level for this disk seems to be A6DA. Hope
> this info is useful.

Martin,

	Simply upgrading your firmware fixed your problem for being to park the
head?

.Alejandro

RE: Head parking (was: IBM HDAPS things are looking up)

[Martin Knoblauch]

--- Alejandro Bonilla <abonilla@linuxwireless.org> wrote:

> 
> > --- Pekka Enberg <penberg@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > > On 7/7/05, Martin Knoblauch <knobi@knobisoft.de> wrote:
> > > >  Interesting. Same Notebook, same drive. The program say "not
> > > parked"
> > > > :-( This is on FC2 with a pretty much vanilla 2.6.9 kernel.
> > > >
> > > > [root@l15833 tmp]# hdparm -i /dev/hda
> > > >
> > > > /dev/hda:
> > > >
> > > >  Model=HTS726060M9AT00, FwRev=MH4OA6BA, SerialNo=MRH403M4GS88XB
> > >
> > > haji ~ # hdparm -i /dev/hda
> > >
> > > /dev/hda:
> > >
> > >  Model=HTS726060M9AT00, FwRev=MH4OA6DA, SerialNo=MRH453M4H2A6PB
> >
> >  OK, different FW levels. After upgrading my disk to MH40A6GA my
> head
> > parks :-) Minimum required level for this disk seems to be A6DA.
> Hope
> > this info is useful.
> 
> Martin,
> 
> 	Simply upgrading your firmware fixed your problem for being to park
> the
> head?
> 

 Yup. Do not forget that FW is very powerful. Likely the parking
feature was added after A6BA.

 Basically I saw that the only difference between me and Pekka was the
FW (discounting the different CPU speed and Kernel version). I googled
around and found the IBM FW page at:

http://www-306.ibm.com/pc/support/site.wss/document.do?sitestyle=ibm&lndocid=MIGR-41008

 Download is simple, just don't use the "IBM Download Manager". Main
problem is that one needs a bootable floopy drive and "the other OS" to
create a bootable floppy. It would be great if IBM could provide floppy
images for use with "dd" for the poor Linux users.

 Then I pondered over the risk involved with the update. Curiosity won
:-) And now the head parks. BUT - I definitely do not encourage anybody
to perform the procedure. Do at your own risk after thinking about the
possible consequences ...

 Anyway someone reported a non working  HTS548040M9AT00 with FW
revision MG2OA53A. The newest revision, from the same floppy image, is
A5HA.

Cheers
Martin 

------------------------------------------------------
Martin Knoblauch
email: k n o b i AT knobisoft DOT de
www:   http://www.knobisoft.de

Re: [Hdaps-devel] RE: Head parking (was: IBM HDAPS things are looking up)

[Dave Hansen]

On Thu, 2005-07-07 at 10:14 -0700, Martin Knoblauch wrote:
>  Basically I saw that the only difference between me and Pekka was the
> FW (discounting the different CPU speed and Kernel version). I googled
> around and found the IBM FW page at:
> 
> http://www-306.ibm.com/pc/support/site.wss/document.do?sitestyle=ibm&lndocid=MIGR-41008
> 
>  Download is simple, just don't use the "IBM Download Manager". Main
> problem is that one needs a bootable floopy drive and "the other OS" to
> create a bootable floppy. It would be great if IBM could provide floppy
> images for use with "dd" for the poor Linux users.

Did you really need to make 18 diskettes?

I have the feeling that this will work for many T4[012]p? users:

http://www-307.ibm.com/pc/support/site.wss/document.do?lndocid=TPAD-HDFIRM

-- Dave

Re: [Hdaps-devel] RE: Head parking (was: IBM HDAPS things are looking up)

[Martin Knoblauch]

--- Dave Hansen <dave@sr71.net> wrote:

> On Thu, 2005-07-07 at 10:14 -0700, Martin Knoblauch wrote:
> >  Basically I saw that the only difference between me and Pekka was
> the
> > FW (discounting the different CPU speed and Kernel version). I
> googled
> > around and found the IBM FW page at:
> > 
> >
>
http://www-306.ibm.com/pc/support/site.wss/document.do?sitestyle=ibm&lndocid=MIGR-41008
> > 
> >  Download is simple, just don't use the "IBM Download Manager".
> Main
> > problem is that one needs a bootable floopy drive and "the other
> OS" to
> > create a bootable floppy. It would be great if IBM could provide
> floppy
> > images for use with "dd" for the poor Linux users.
> 
> Did you really need to make 18 diskettes?
>

 yikes - no !! :-) Somewhere on that page there is a table that tells
you which of the 18 floppies is for your disk. In my case it was #13.
 
> I have the feeling that this will work for many T4[012]p? users:
> 
>
http://www-307.ibm.com/pc/support/site.wss/document.do?lndocid=TPAD-HDFIRM
> 

 Yeah, I think that is the "DA" version. You still need "the other OS",
although you don't need the floppy.

 If IBM would provide a CD image (bootable ISO) containing FW for all
supported drives - that would be great. No need for the "other OS" any
more.

Cheers
Martin

------------------------------------------------------
Martin Knoblauch
email: k n o b i AT knobisoft DOT de
www:   http://www.knobisoft.de

Re: [Hdaps-devel] RE: Head parking (was: IBM HDAPS things are looking up)

[Erik Mouw]

On Thu, Jul 07, 2005 at 11:45:38AM -0700, Martin Knoblauch wrote:
>  If IBM would provide a CD image (bootable ISO) containing FW for all
> supported drives - that would be great. No need for the "other OS" any
> more.

I can imagine IBM doesn't do that because in that way you can't update
the firmware of the CD/DVD drive. Bootable FreeDOS floppy images would
be a nice idea, though.


Erik (not a ThinkPad owner)

-- 
+-- Erik Mouw -- www.harddisk-recovery.com -- +31 70 370 12 90 --
| Lab address: Delftechpark 26, 2628 XH, Delft, The Netherlands

Re: [Hdaps-devel] RE: Head parking (was: IBM HDAPS things are looking up)

[Martin Knoblauch]

--- Erik Mouw <erik@harddisk-recovery.com> wrote:

> On Thu, Jul 07, 2005 at 11:45:38AM -0700, Martin Knoblauch wrote:
> >  If IBM would provide a CD image (bootable ISO) containing FW for
> all
> > supported drives - that would be great. No need for the "other OS"
> any
> > more.
> 
> I can imagine IBM doesn't do that because in that way you can't
> update
> the firmware of the CD/DVD drive. Bootable FreeDOS floppy images
> would
> be a nice idea, though.
> 
> 

 now, this is getting off-topic. The CD image I proposed would be only
for the hard disks.

 Bootable XXXX-Dos floppy images that one could just "dd" of the floppy
would be great, because they eliminate the need for "the other OS", but
you still need a floppy drive. I am not sure how many Notebook owners
actually have one. The hardest part in my FW upgrade was actually
finding a drive in our company.

Martin

------------------------------------------------------
Martin Knoblauch
email: k n o b i AT knobisoft DOT de
www:   http://www.knobisoft.de

Re: [Hdaps-devel] RE: Head parking (was: IBM HDAPS things are looking up)

[Shawn Starr]

You can take the .exe file and turn this into a bootable CD (using a RW CD) I 
forgot how I did it, but if I remember correctly, I took a floppy dos image 
and made that into the boot 'stub' and threw the exe into the CD (a la 
El-Torito).

I flashed the disk firmware once since I got the laptop.

Shawn.


On July 7, 2005 14:51, Erik Mouw wrote:
> On Thu, Jul 07, 2005 at 11:45:38AM -0700, Martin Knoblauch wrote:
> >  If IBM would provide a CD image (bootable ISO) containing FW for all
> > supported drives - that would be great. No need for the "other OS" any
> > more.
>
> I can imagine IBM doesn't do that because in that way you can't update
> the firmware of the CD/DVD drive. Bootable FreeDOS floppy images would
> be a nice idea, though.
>
>
> Erik (not a ThinkPad owner)

Re: [Hdaps-devel] RE: Head parking (was: IBM HDAPS things are looking up)

[Martin Knoblauch]

--- Dave Hansen <dave@sr71.net> wrote:

> 
> I have the feeling that this will work for many T4[012]p? users:
> 
>
http://www-307.ibm.com/pc/support/site.wss/document.do?lndocid=TPAD-HDFIRM
> 

 Actually, I think your feeling is wrong. Looking at the readme.txt it
seems version 7.1 of the upgrade floppy has the "BA" firmware that I
had on my disk in the beginning (not parking the heads).

Cheers
Martin

------------------------------------------------------
Martin Knoblauch
email: k n o b i AT knobisoft DOT de
www:   http://www.knobisoft.de

Updating hard disk firmware (Was: Re: Head parking)

[Frank Sorenson]

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

Martin Knoblauch wrote:
>  Download is simple, just don't use the "IBM Download Manager". Main
> problem is that one needs a bootable floopy drive and "the other OS" to
> create a bootable floppy. It would be great if IBM could provide floppy
> images for use with "dd" for the poor Linux users.

You may be able to use this process to avoid using either a floppy drive
or "the other OS":

1) Download the appropriate firmware exe from
http://www-306.ibm.com/pc/support/site.wss/document.do?lndocid=MIGR-41008
(in my case, this looks like fwhd3313.exe)

2) Find a freedos disk image (I used one that came with biosdisk -
http://linux.dell.com/biosdisk/)

3) Create a disk image for the firmware executable:
cp /usr/share/biosdisk/dosdisk.img /tmp/fwdisk1.img
mount -oloop /tmp/fwtemp.img /mnt/tmp
cp fwhd3313.exe /mnt/tmp
umount /mnt/tmp

4) Create a blank disk image for the extracted contents:
dd if=/dev/zero of=/boot/fwdisk.img bs=1474560 count=1

5) Run qemu to extract files and write the disk image:
qemu -fda /tmp/fwtemp.img -fdb /boot/fwdisk.img
A:\>fwhd3313
...
exit qemu

6) Set up grub to boot the new disk image (requires memdisk from
syslinux - http://syslinux.zytor.com/):
$EDITOR /boot/grub/grub.conf
title IBM Hard Drive Firmware update
        kernel /memdisk
        initrd=/fwdisk.img floppy

7) Reboot and select the "IBM Hard Drive Firmware update" option


It allowed me to run the firmware update program, however it didn't
believe my drive needed updating, so I haven't even successfully tried
the entire process.  Please let me know if it works for you.

DISCLAIMER: I also provide no guarantees.   Hopefully your hard disk
won't fly off the spindle or anything else bad.  If it does, blame
someone else.

Frank
- --
Frank Sorenson - KD7TZK
Systems Manager, Computer Science Department
Brigham Young University
frank@tuxrocks.com
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Updating hard disk firmware & parking hard disk

[Gijs Hillenius]

>>>>> Frank Sorenson writes:

     > Martin Knoblauch wrote:
    >> Download is simple, just don't use the "IBM Download
    >> Manager". Main problem is that one needs a bootable floopy
    >> drive and "the other OS" to create a bootable floppy. It would
    >> be great if IBM could provide floppy images for use with "dd"
    >> for the poor Linux users.

     > You may be able to use this process to avoid using either a
     > floppy drive or "the other OS":

     > 1) Download the appropriate firmware exe from
     > http://www-306.ibm.com/pc/support/site.wss/document.do?lndocid=MIGR-41008
     > (in my case, this looks like fwhd3313.exe)

     > 2) Find a freedos disk image (I used one that came with
     > biosdisk - http://linux.dell.com/biosdisk/)

     > 3) Create a disk image for the firmware executable: cp
     > /usr/share/biosdisk/dosdisk.img /tmp/fwdisk1.img mount -oloop
     > /tmp/fwtemp.img /mnt/tmp cp fwhd3313.exe /mnt/tmp umount
     > /mnt/tmp

     > 4) Create a blank disk image for the extracted contents: dd
     > if=/dev/zero of=/boot/fwdisk.img bs=1474560 count=1

     > 5) Run qemu to extract files and write the disk image: qemu
     > -fda /tmp/fwtemp.img -fdb /boot/fwdisk.img A:\>fwhd3313 ...
     > exit qemu

     > 6) Set up grub to boot the new disk image (requires memdisk
     > from syslinux - http://syslinux.zytor.com/): $EDITOR
     > /boot/grub/grub.conf title IBM Hard Drive Firmware update
     > kernel /memdisk initrd=/fwdisk.img floppy

     > 7) Reboot and select the "IBM Hard Drive Firmware update"
     > option


     > It allowed me to run the firmware update program, however it
     > didn't believe my drive needed updating, so I haven't even
     > successfully tried the entire process.  Please let me know if
     > it works for you.

     > DISCLAIMER: I also provide no guarantees.  Hopefully your hard
     > disk won't fly off the spindle or anything else bad.  If it
     > does, blame someone else.

Hi Frank,

FYI I succesfully used your above method to update the firmware
for the IC25N040ATMR04-0 hard disk that came with my Thinkpad R51. 

Before the update hdparm -i /dev/hda
Model=IC25N040ATMR04-0, FwRev=MO2OAD4A

and after the update
Model=IC25N040ATMR04-0, FwRev=MO2OADEA

So, thanks!

however, the firmware update did not solve the 'head not park'
issue. :-(

sudo ./park /dev/hda
head not parked 4c


Regards

Gijs

-- 
Is it weird in here, or is it just me?
		-- Steven Wright

Re: Updating hard disk firmware & parking hard disk

[Jan Engelhardt]

>however, the firmware update did not solve the 'head not park'
>issue. :-(
>
>sudo ./park /dev/hda
>head not parked 4c

Head parking while the system running is almost useless, since sooner or 
later, someone's going to write/read something.
If you want head parking at shutdown, I suggest using hdparm -y. This puts the 
drive to sleep, which includes spindle spindown and, included, appropriate 
head parking.


Jan Engelhardt
-- 

Re: [Hdaps-devel] Re: Updating hard disk firmware & parking hard disk

[Lenz Grimmer]

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Hash: SHA1

Jan Engelhardt wrote:

> Head parking while the system running is almost useless, since sooner or 
> later, someone's going to write/read something.

Correct, that's why we're discussing to freeze the request queue as well.

> If you want head parking at shutdown, I suggest using hdparm -y. This puts the 
> drive to sleep, which includes spindle spindown and, included, appropriate 
> head parking.

But it suffers from the same fate - as soon as the disk receives a new
request, it will spin up again. So there is no gain, except that just
parking the head without spinning down the spindle can be performed much
faster.

Bye,
	LenZ
- --
- ------------------------------------------------------------------
 Lenz Grimmer <lenz@grimmer.com>                             -o)
 [ICQ: 160767607 | Jabber: LenZGr@jabber.org]                /\\
 http://www.lenzg.org/                                       V_V
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Re: [Hdaps-devel] Re: Updating hard disk firmware & parking hard disk

[Jan Engelhardt]

>> Head parking while the system running is almost useless, since sooner or 
>> later, someone's going to write/read something.
>
>Correct, that's why we're discussing to freeze the request queue as well.

Sounds good (esp. for laptops/notebooks, which should preferably run "on RAM" 
as long as possible)

>But it suffers from the same fate - as soon as the disk receives a new
>request, it will spin up again.

In case of the SUSE bootscripts (and possibly others), some flush barriers are 
engaged, then the disk is spun down and immediately after the poweroff 
happens.

>So there is no gain, except that just
>parking the head without spinning down the spindle can be performed much
>faster.

What's the gain in parking the head manually if it's done anyway when the disk 
spins down (for whatever reason)?



Jan Engelhardt
-- 

Re: [Hdaps-devel] Re: Updating hard disk firmware & parking hard disk

[Paul Slootman]

Jan Engelhardt  <jengelh@linux01.gwdg.de> wrote:
>
>What's the gain in parking the head manually if it's done anyway when the disk 
>spins down (for whatever reason)?

It seems you're completely missing the whole point of this discussion,
which was how to implement the hard disk active protection system that
IBM offers under windows for its laptops, that will park the disk when
it detects that e.g. the laptop is falling off a table.


Paul Slootman

Re: [Hdaps-devel] Re: Updating hard disk firmware & parking hard disk

[Bill Davidsen]

Paul Slootman wrote:
> Jan Engelhardt  <jengelh@linux01.gwdg.de> wrote:
> 
>>What's the gain in parking the head manually if it's done anyway when the disk 
>>spins down (for whatever reason)?
> 
> 
> It seems you're completely missing the whole point of this discussion,
> which was how to implement the hard disk active protection system that
> IBM offers under windows for its laptops, that will park the disk when
> it detects that e.g. the laptop is falling off a table.

Does that imply that we have software to detect falling off a table?

-- 
    -bill davidsen (davidsen@tmr.com)
"The secret to procrastination is to put things off until the
  last possible moment - but no longer"  -me

Re: [Hdaps-devel] Re: Updating hard disk firmware & parking hard disk

[Paul Slootman]

On Wed 13 Jul 2005, Bill Davidsen wrote:
> Paul Slootman wrote:
> >Jan Engelhardt  <jengelh@linux01.gwdg.de> wrote:
> >
> >>What's the gain in parking the head manually if it's done anyway when the 
> >>disk spins down (for whatever reason)?
> >
> >
> >It seems you're completely missing the whole point of this discussion,
> >which was how to implement the hard disk active protection system that
> >IBM offers under windows for its laptops, that will park the disk when
> >it detects that e.g. the laptop is falling off a table.
> 
> Does that imply that we have software to detect falling off a table?

Progress is indeed being made, according to what I've been reading on
l-k.


Paul Slootman

Re: [Hdaps-devel] Re: Updating hard disk firmware & parking hard disk

[Lee Revell]

On Wed, 2005-07-13 at 15:11 -0400, Bill Davidsen wrote:
> Paul Slootman wrote:
> > Jan Engelhardt  <jengelh@linux01.gwdg.de> wrote:
> > 
> >>What's the gain in parking the head manually if it's done anyway when the disk 
> >>spins down (for whatever reason)?
> > 
> > 
> > It seems you're completely missing the whole point of this discussion,
> > which was how to implement the hard disk active protection system that
> > IBM offers under windows for its laptops, that will park the disk when
> > it detects that e.g. the laptop is falling off a table.
> 
> Does that imply that we have software to detect falling off a table?
> 

IBM does, in their Windows driver.

This was all covered in the HDAPS threads of the past few weeks, check
the archives.

Lee

Re: [Hdaps-devel] Updating hard disk firmware & parking hard disk

[Shawn Starr]

Perhaps you also need to flash the BIOS and or Embedded Controller firmware?

Shawn.

On July 13, 2005 04:58, Gijs Hillenius wrote:
> >>>>> Frank Sorenson writes:
>      > Martin Knoblauch wrote:
>      >
>     >> Download is simple, just don't use the "IBM Download
>     >> Manager". Main problem is that one needs a bootable floopy
>     >> drive and "the other OS" to create a bootable floppy. It would
>     >> be great if IBM could provide floppy images for use with "dd"
>     >> for the poor Linux users.
>     >>
>      > You may be able to use this process to avoid using either a
>      > floppy drive or "the other OS":
>      >
>      > 1) Download the appropriate firmware exe from
>      > http://www-306.ibm.com/pc/support/site.wss/document.do?lndocid=MIGR-
>      >41008 (in my case, this looks like fwhd3313.exe)
>      >
>      > 2) Find a freedos disk image (I used one that came with
>      > biosdisk - http://linux.dell.com/biosdisk/)
>      >
>      > 3) Create a disk image for the firmware executable: cp
>      > /usr/share/biosdisk/dosdisk.img /tmp/fwdisk1.img mount -oloop
>      > /tmp/fwtemp.img /mnt/tmp cp fwhd3313.exe /mnt/tmp umount
>      > /mnt/tmp
>      >
>      > 4) Create a blank disk image for the extracted contents: dd
>      > if=/dev/zero of=/boot/fwdisk.img bs=1474560 count=1
>      >
>      > 5) Run qemu to extract files and write the disk image: qemu
>      > -fda /tmp/fwtemp.img -fdb /boot/fwdisk.img A:\>fwhd3313 ...
>      > exit qemu
>      >
>      > 6) Set up grub to boot the new disk image (requires memdisk
>      > from syslinux - http://syslinux.zytor.com/): $EDITOR
>      > /boot/grub/grub.conf title IBM Hard Drive Firmware update
>      > kernel /memdisk initrd=/fwdisk.img floppy
>      >
>      > 7) Reboot and select the "IBM Hard Drive Firmware update"
>      > option
>      >
>      >
>      > It allowed me to run the firmware update program, however it
>      > didn't believe my drive needed updating, so I haven't even
>      > successfully tried the entire process.  Please let me know if
>      > it works for you.
>      >
>      > DISCLAIMER: I also provide no guarantees.  Hopefully your hard
>      > disk won't fly off the spindle or anything else bad.  If it
>      > does, blame someone else.
>
> Hi Frank,
>
> FYI I succesfully used your above method to update the firmware
> for the IC25N040ATMR04-0 hard disk that came with my Thinkpad R51.
>
> Before the update hdparm -i /dev/hda
> Model=IC25N040ATMR04-0, FwRev=MO2OAD4A
>
> and after the update
> Model=IC25N040ATMR04-0, FwRev=MO2OADEA
>
> So, thanks!
>
> however, the firmware update did not solve the 'head not park'
> issue. :-(
>
> sudo ./park /dev/hda
> head not parked 4c
>
>
> Regards
>
> Gijs

Re: IBM HDAPS things are looking up (was: Re: [Hdaps-devel] Re: [ltp] IBM HDAPS Someone interested? (Accelerometer))

[Alejandro Bonilla]

Jens Axboe wrote:

>On Mon, Jul 04 2005, Lenz Grimmer wrote:
>  
>
>>>I'll be working on adding sysfs stuff to it tomorrow so it's generally
>>>useful (at least for monitoring things - not yet for parking disk
>>>heads).
>>>      
>>>
>>Maybe there is some kind of all-purpose ATA command that instructs the
>>disk drive to park the heads? Jens, could you give us a hint on how a
>>userspace application would do that?
>>    
>>
>
>Dunno if there's something that explicitly only parks the head, the best
>option is probably to issue a STANDBY_NOW command. You can test this
>with hdparm -y.
>  
>
This is exactly what I said. Use hdparm to make the HD park 
inmediatelly. I did send the email to the HDPARM developer, but he never 
replied. I asked him what would be the best way to make the HD park with 
no exception and then let it come back 5 or 10 seconds later.

Never heard back. ;-(

.Alejandro

Re: IBM HDAPS things are looking up (was: Re: [Hdaps-devel] Re: [ltp] IBM HDAPS Someone interested? (Accelerometer))

[Jens Axboe]

On Mon, Jul 04 2005, Alejandro Bonilla wrote:
> Jens Axboe wrote:
> 
> >On Mon, Jul 04 2005, Lenz Grimmer wrote:
> > 
> >
> >>>I'll be working on adding sysfs stuff to it tomorrow so it's generally
> >>>useful (at least for monitoring things - not yet for parking disk
> >>>heads).
> >>>     
> >>>
> >>Maybe there is some kind of all-purpose ATA command that instructs the
> >>disk drive to park the heads? Jens, could you give us a hint on how a
> >>userspace application would do that?
> >>   
> >>
> >
> >Dunno if there's something that explicitly only parks the head, the best
> >option is probably to issue a STANDBY_NOW command. You can test this
> >with hdparm -y.
> > 
> >
> This is exactly what I said. Use hdparm to make the HD park 
> inmediatelly. I did send the email to the HDPARM developer, but he never 
> replied. I asked him what would be the best way to make the HD park with 
> no exception and then let it come back 5 or 10 seconds later.

IIRC, you don't have to do anything to wake up the drive after a
STANDBYNOW command, if you want to be on the safe side you just issue an
IDLEIMMEDIATE. So your code will look something like:

int drive_standby(int fd)
{
        char foo[4] = { 0xe0, 0, 0, 0 };

        return ioctl(fd, HDIO_DRIVE_CMD, &foo);
}

int drive_wakeup(int fd)
{
        char foo[4] = { 0xe1, 0, 0, 0 };

        return ioctl(fd, HDIO_DRIVE_CMD, &foo);
}

-- 
Jens Axboe

Re: IBM HDAPS things are looking up (was: Re: [Hdaps-devel] Re: [ltp] IBM HDAPS Someone interested? (Accelerometer))

[Arjan van de Ven]

> > This is exactly what I said. Use hdparm to make the HD park 
> > inmediatelly. I did send the email to the HDPARM developer, but he never 
> > replied. I asked him what would be the best way to make the HD park with 
> > no exception and then let it come back 5 or 10 seconds later.
> 
> IIRC, you don't have to do anything to wake up the drive after a
> STANDBYNOW command, if you want to be on the safe side you just issue an
> IDLEIMMEDIATE. So your code will look something like:

the problem for this will be that this app will also want to prevent ANY
io going to the disk for a few seconds.

I mean, what use is parking the head if you notice the laptop falling,
when the kernel submits IO to it and wakes it up again before it hits
the ground :)

Re: IBM HDAPS things are looking up (was: Re: [Hdaps-devel] Re: [ltp] IBM HDAPS Someone interested? (Accelerometer))

[Jens Axboe]

On Mon, Jul 04 2005, Arjan van de Ven wrote:
> 
> > > This is exactly what I said. Use hdparm to make the HD park 
> > > inmediatelly. I did send the email to the HDPARM developer, but he never 
> > > replied. I asked him what would be the best way to make the HD park with 
> > > no exception and then let it come back 5 or 10 seconds later.
> > 
> > IIRC, you don't have to do anything to wake up the drive after a
> > STANDBYNOW command, if you want to be on the safe side you just issue an
> > IDLEIMMEDIATE. So your code will look something like:
> 
> the problem for this will be that this app will also want to prevent ANY
> io going to the disk for a few seconds.
> 
> I mean, what use is parking the head if you notice the laptop falling,
> when the kernel submits IO to it and wakes it up again before it hits
> the ground :)

Yeah, that likely needs a little help from the ide driver. If you force
a spindown, you will effectively have parked the head for as long as the
spindown + spinup takes. That could turn out to be enough, it will take
more than 1-2 seconds anyways.

-- 
Jens Axboe

Re: IBM HDAPS things are looking up (was: Re: [Hdaps-devel] Re: [ltp] IBM HDAPS Someone interested? (Accelerometer))

[Arjan van de Ven]

> 
> Yeah, that likely needs a little help from the ide driver. If you force
> a spindown, you will effectively have parked the head for as long as the
> spindown + spinup takes. That could turn out to be enough, it will take
> more than 1-2 seconds anyways.

I doubt it; laptop disks seem to be optimized for spinning up/down fast
(for powersaving reasons) so while for normal disks I'd agree with you,
for laptop disks I'm far less sure.

Re: IBM HDAPS things are looking up (was: Re: [Hdaps-devel] Re: [ltp] IBM HDAPS Someone interested? (Accelerometer))

[Jens Axboe]

On Mon, Jul 04 2005, Arjan van de Ven wrote:
> 
> > 
> > Yeah, that likely needs a little help from the ide driver. If you force
> > a spindown, you will effectively have parked the head for as long as the
> > spindown + spinup takes. That could turn out to be enough, it will take
> > more than 1-2 seconds anyways.
> 
> I doubt it; laptop disks seem to be optimized for spinning up/down fast
> (for powersaving reasons) so while for normal disks I'd agree with you,
> for laptop disks I'm far less sure.

It isn't too pretty to rely on such unreliable timing anyways. I'm not
too crazy about spinning the disk down either, it's useless wear
compared to just parking the head.

-- 
Jens Axboe

Re: IBM HDAPS things are looking up (was: Re: [Hdaps-devel] Re: [ltp] IBM HDAPS Someone interested? (Accelerometer))

[Lenz Grimmer]

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

Hi,

Jens Axboe wrote:

> It isn't too pretty to rely on such unreliable timing anyways. I'm 
> not too crazy about spinning the disk down either, it's useless wear 
> compared to just parking the head.

Fully agreed, and that's the approach the IBM Windows driver seems to
take - you just hear the disk park its head when the sensor kicks in
(you can hear it) - the disk does not spin down when this happens.

Could this be some reserved ATA command that only works with certain#
drives?

Bye,
	LenZ
- --
- ------------------------------------------------------------------
 Lenz Grimmer <lenz@grimmer.com>                             -o)
 [ICQ: 160767607 | Jabber: LenZGr@jabber.org]                /\\
 http://www.lenzg.org/                                       V_V
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Re: IBM HDAPS things are looking up (was: Re: [Hdaps-devel] Re: [ltp] IBM HDAPS Someone interested? (Accelerometer))

[Jens Axboe]

On Mon, Jul 04 2005, Lenz Grimmer wrote:
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
> 
> Hi,
> 
> Jens Axboe wrote:
> 
> > It isn't too pretty to rely on such unreliable timing anyways. I'm 
> > not too crazy about spinning the disk down either, it's useless wear 
> > compared to just parking the head.
> 
> Fully agreed, and that's the approach the IBM Windows driver seems to
> take - you just hear the disk park its head when the sensor kicks in
> (you can hear it) - the disk does not spin down when this happens.
> 
> Could this be some reserved ATA command that only works with certain#
> drives?

Perhaps the IDLE or IDLEIMMEDIATE commands imply a head parking, that
would make sense. As you say, you can hear a drive parking its head.
Here's a test case, it doesn't sound like it's parking the hard here.

#include <stdio.h>
#include <unistd.h>
#include <fcntl.h>
#include <sys/ioctl.h>
#include <linux/hdreg.h>

int main(int argc, char *argv[])
{
	char cmd[4] = { 0xe1, 0, 0, 0 };
	int fd;

	if (argc < 2) {
		printf("%s <dev>\n", argv[0]);
		return 1;
	}

	fd = open(argv[1], O_RDONLY);
	if (fd == -1) {
		perror("open");
		return 1;
	}

	if (ioctl(fd, HDIO_DRIVE_CMD, cmd))
		perror("ioctl");

	close(fd);
	return 0;
}

-- 
Jens Axboe

Re: IBM HDAPS things are looking up (was: Re: [Hdaps-devel] Re: [ltp] IBM HDAPS Someone interested? (Accelerometer))

[Jens Axboe]

On Mon, Jul 04 2005, Jens Axboe wrote:
> On Mon, Jul 04 2005, Lenz Grimmer wrote:
> > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> > Hash: SHA1
> > 
> > Hi,
> > 
> > Jens Axboe wrote:
> > 
> > > It isn't too pretty to rely on such unreliable timing anyways. I'm 
> > > not too crazy about spinning the disk down either, it's useless wear 
> > > compared to just parking the head.
> > 
> > Fully agreed, and that's the approach the IBM Windows driver seems to
> > take - you just hear the disk park its head when the sensor kicks in
> > (you can hear it) - the disk does not spin down when this happens.
> > 
> > Could this be some reserved ATA command that only works with certain#
> > drives?
> 
> Perhaps the IDLE or IDLEIMMEDIATE commands imply a head parking, that
> would make sense. As you say, you can hear a drive parking its head.
> Here's a test case, it doesn't sound like it's parking the hard here.

ATA7 defines a park maneuvre, I don't know how well supported it is yet
though. You can test with this little app, if it says 'head parked' it
works. If not, it has just idled the drive.


#include <stdio.h>
#include <unistd.h>
#include <fcntl.h>
#include <string.h>
#include <sys/ioctl.h>
#include <linux/hdreg.h>

int main(int argc, char *argv[])
{
	unsigned char buf[8];
	int fd;

	if (argc < 2) {
		printf("%s <dev>\n", argv[0]);
		return 1;
	}

	fd = open(argv[1], O_RDONLY);
	if (fd == -1) {
		perror("open");
		return 1;
	}

	memset(buf, 0, sizeof(buf));
	buf[0] = 0xe1;
	buf[1] = 0x44;
	buf[3] = 0x4c;
	buf[4] = 0x4e;
	buf[5] = 0x55;

	if (ioctl(fd, HDIO_DRIVE_TASK, buf)) {
		perror("ioctl");
		return 1;
	}

	if (buf[3] == 0xc4)
		printf("head parked\n");
	else
		printf("head not parked %x\n", buf[3]);

	close(fd);
	return 0;
}

-- 
Jens Axboe

Re: Head parking (was: IBM HDAPS things are looking up)

[Lenz Grimmer]

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

Hi,

Jens Axboe wrote:

> ATA7 defines a park maneuvre, I don't know how well supported it is 
> yet though. You can test with this little app, if it says 'head 
> parked' it works. If not, it has just idled the drive.

Great! Thanks for digging this up - it works on my T42, using a Fujitsu
MHT2080AH drive:

  lenz@metis:~/work/ibm_hdaps> sudo ./headpark /dev/hda
  head parked

Judging from the sound the drive makes, this is the same operation that
the windows tool performs.

However, the head does not remain parked for a very long time,
especially if there is a lot of disk activity going on (I tested it by
running a "find /" in parallel). The head parks, but leaves the park
position immediately afterwards again. I guess now we need to find a way
to "nail" the head into the parking position for some time - otherwise
it may already be on its way back to the platter before the laptop hits
the ground...

Thanks again - this is another helpful bit in getting all the pieces
together.

Bye,
	LenZ
- --
- ------------------------------------------------------------------
 Lenz Grimmer <lenz@grimmer.com>                             -o)
 [ICQ: 160767607 | Jabber: LenZGr@jabber.org]                /\\
 http://www.lenzg.org/                                       V_V
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Re: Head parking (was: IBM HDAPS things are looking up)

[Jens Axboe]

On Thu, Jul 07 2005, Lenz Grimmer wrote:
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
> 
> Hi,
> 
> Jens Axboe wrote:
> 
> > ATA7 defines a park maneuvre, I don't know how well supported it is 
> > yet though. You can test with this little app, if it says 'head 
> > parked' it works. If not, it has just idled the drive.
> 
> Great! Thanks for digging this up - it works on my T42, using a Fujitsu
> MHT2080AH drive:
> 
>   lenz@metis:~/work/ibm_hdaps> sudo ./headpark /dev/hda
>   head parked
>
> Judging from the sound the drive makes, this is the same operation that
> the windows tool performs.

Very cool, I wasn't sure if this was a 'new' feature waiting to be
implemented in drives or if ata7 just documented existing use in some
drives.

How long did the park take? Spec states it can take up to 500ms.

> However, the head does not remain parked for a very long time,
> especially if there is a lot of disk activity going on (I tested it by
> running a "find /" in parallel). The head parks, but leaves the park
> position immediately afterwards again. I guess now we need to find a way
> to "nail" the head into the parking position for some time - otherwise
> it may already be on its way back to the platter before the laptop hits
> the ground...

The head just remains parked until the next command is issued. This
needs to be combined with some ide help, to freeze the queue. Perhaps
some sysfs file so you could do

# echo park > /sys/block/hda/device/head_state

Or whatever, at least just exposing this possibility so that the drive
internally can block future io until a 'resume' command is issued.

-- 
Jens Axboe

Re: [Hdaps-devel] Re: Head parking (was: IBM HDAPS things are looking up)

[Lenz Grimmer]

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

Hi,

Jens Axboe wrote:

> Very cool, I wasn't sure if this was a 'new' feature waiting to be 
> implemented in drives or if ata7 just documented existing use in some
>  drives.
> 
> How long did the park take? Spec states it can take up to 500ms.

Hard to measure (I don't have the C skills to add timing to your sample
snippet...), but almost instantly after issuing the command. "time"
states the command takes around 0.733 seconds in total (until the
command returns), the head park happens almost instantly after the
program started, probably after ~300ms).

> The head just remains parked until the next command is issued.

Right, which usually happens right away on a busy system, especially
when it's using swap (think KDE desktops :) )

> This needs to be combined with some ide help, to freeze the queue.
> Perhaps some sysfs file so you could do
> 
> # echo park > /sys/block/hda/device/head_state
> 
> Or whatever, at least just exposing this possibility so that the
> drive internally can block future io until a 'resume' command is
> issued.

Or for a given timeout, whatever happens first. Sounds good to me!
So would this feature require modifications to the IDE layer?

Bye,
	LenZ
- --
- ------------------------------------------------------------------
 Lenz Grimmer <lenz@grimmer.com>                             -o)
 [ICQ: 160767607 | Jabber: LenZGr@jabber.org]                /\\
 http://www.lenzg.org/                                       V_V
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Re: [Hdaps-devel] Re: Head parking (was: IBM HDAPS things are looking up)

[Shawn Starr]

Model: HTS548080M9AT00 (Hitachi)
Laptop: T42.

segfault:/home/spstarr# ./a /dev/hda
head parked

Seems to park, heard it click :)

Shawn.

On July 7, 2005 04:48, Jens Axboe wrote:
> On Thu, Jul 07 2005, Lenz Grimmer wrote:
> > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> > Hash: SHA1
> >
> > Hi,
> >
> > Jens Axboe wrote:
> > > ATA7 defines a park maneuvre, I don't know how well supported it is
> > > yet though. You can test with this little app, if it says 'head
> > > parked' it works. If not, it has just idled the drive.
> >
> > Great! Thanks for digging this up - it works on my T42, using a Fujitsu
> > MHT2080AH drive:
> >
> >   lenz@metis:~/work/ibm_hdaps> sudo ./headpark /dev/hda
> >   head parked
> >
> > Judging from the sound the drive makes, this is the same operation that
> > the windows tool performs.
>
> Very cool, I wasn't sure if this was a 'new' feature waiting to be
> implemented in drives or if ata7 just documented existing use in some
> drives.
>
> How long did the park take? Spec states it can take up to 500ms.
>
> > However, the head does not remain parked for a very long time,
> > especially if there is a lot of disk activity going on (I tested it by
> > running a "find /" in parallel). The head parks, but leaves the park
> > position immediately afterwards again. I guess now we need to find a way
> > to "nail" the head into the parking position for some time - otherwise
> > it may already be on its way back to the platter before the laptop hits
> > the ground...
>
> The head just remains parked until the next command is issued. This
> needs to be combined with some ide help, to freeze the queue. Perhaps
> some sysfs file so you could do
>
> # echo park > /sys/block/hda/device/head_state
>
> Or whatever, at least just exposing this possibility so that the drive
> internally can block future io until a 'resume' command is issued.