CML2 1.1.1, wiuth experimental fast mode

CML2 1.1.1, wiuth experimental fast mode

[Eric S. Raymond]

The latest version is always available at http://www.tuxedo.org/~esr/cml2/

Release 1.1.1: Sat Apr 14 23:41:34 EDT 2001
	* Synchronized with 2.4.4-pre1.
	* Adam Lackorzynski's patch to make install-cml2 do the right thing 
	  with relative installation paths.
	* The old menuconfig shortcut that 'm' in a boolean entry field
	  sets 'y' is now implemented. 
	* Simplified color scheme.
	* Added fast-mode command to suppress side-effect computation 
	  on slow machines.

I'd appreciate it if some of you with slow machines would try running 
with fast mode on and seeing if that addresses the sluggishness.
-- 
		<a href="http://www.tuxedo.org/~esr/">Eric S. Raymond</a>

Never could an increase of comfort or security be a sufficient good to be
bought at the price of liberty.
	-- Hillaire Belloc

Re: CML2 1.1.1, wiuth experimental fast mode

[Jeff Garzik]

"Eric S. Raymond" wrote:
> Release 1.1.1: Sat Apr 14 23:41:34 EDT 2001
>         * Synchronized with 2.4.4-pre1.

pre3 is out ;-)

>         * Added fast-mode command to suppress side-effect computation
>           on slow machines.
> 
> I'd appreciate it if some of you with slow machines would try running
> with fast mode on and seeing if that addresses the sluggishness.

I assume that, eventually there will be no slow mode or fast mode
distinction... just a single fast mode.  Right?  :)

-- 
Jeff Garzik       | "Give a man a fish, and he eats for a day. Teach a
Building 1024     |  man to fish, and a US Navy submarine will make sure
MandrakeSoft      |  he's never hungry again." -- Chris Neufeld

Re: CML2 1.1.1, wiuth experimental fast mode

[Eric S. Raymond]

Jeff Garzik <jgarzik@mandrakesoft.com>:
> I assume that, eventually there will be no slow mode or fast mode
> distinction... just a single fast mode.  Right?  :)

That's an interesting question to which I do not yet know the answer.
I am continuing to speed-tune.
-- 
		<a href="http://www.tuxedo.org/~esr/">Eric S. Raymond</a>

The Constitution is not neutral. It was designed to take the
government off the backs of the people.
	-- Justice William O. Douglas 

Re: CML2 1.1.1, wiuth experimental fast mode

[Olaf Titz]

[Warning: historical reference ahead.]

> > I'd appreciate it if some of you with slow machines would try running
> > with fast mode on and seeing if that addresses the sluggishness.
>
> I assume that, eventually there will be no slow mode or fast mode
> distinction... just a single fast mode.  Right?  :)

Perhaps not, if fast mode won't display on the screen while running,
or such things... ;-)

Olaf

Re: CML2 1.1.1, wiuth experimental fast mode

[Anton Altaparmakov]

At 04:45 15/04/2001, Eric S. Raymond wrote:
>Release 1.1.1: Sat Apr 14 23:41:34 EDT 2001
>         * The old menuconfig shortcut that 'm' in a boolean entry field
>           sets 'y' is now implemented.
>         * Simplified color scheme.

Much better now! make xconfig still seems to be the old way (hadn't tried 
it before)? - At least I get two shades of green. The lighter one is 
completely unreadable on the silver background. Could I suggest to get rid 
of the light/dark green distinction altogether, do it like the new 
menuconfig colors, they are much improved now. - Also removing the N and 
replacing M by m has improved readability  by a long way. (-:

>         * Added fast-mode command to suppress side-effect computation
>           on slow machines.
>
>I'd appreciate it if some of you with slow machines would try running
>with fast mode on and seeing if that addresses the sluggishness.

On my Pentium 133S with fastmode I get a more than 2 fold increase in speed 
and  it feels a lot more usable. Still have to wait between key presses but 
it is better than before.

I also tried this on a Dual Celeron 450. Speed is fine but you can still 
feel that something is happening in between the key press and it taking 
effect. fastmode doesn't make much difference that I could feel there.

One general note: scrolling between entries (up/down arrow) seems slower 
than it should be. It is noticeable when you want to scroll several entries 
at once and hit an arrow key quickly several times in succession. Perhaps 
the action taken after reaching an entry could be delayed until the next 
key press and only then when it is not one of the move to next/prev option 
ones? That should make moving up/down instantaneous like in the old (cml1) 
menuconfig. But then I have no idea how cml2 works so maybe my suggestion 
is bogus...

Keep up the good work. You are on the right track. (-:

Best regards,

         Anton


-- 
Anton Altaparmakov <aia21 at cam.ac.uk> (replace at with @)
Linux NTFS Maintainer / WWW: http://sourceforge.net/projects/linux-ntfs/
ICQ: 8561279 / WWW: http://www-stu.christs.cam.ac.uk/~aia21/

Re: CML2 1.1.1, wiuth experimental fast mode

[Eric S. Raymond]

Anton Altaparmakov <aia21@cam.ac.uk>:
> Much better now! make xconfig still seems to be the old way (hadn't tried 
> it before)? - At least I get two shades of green. The lighter one is 
> completely unreadable on the silver background. Could I suggest to get rid 
> of the light/dark green distinction altogether, do it like the new 
> menuconfig colors, they are much improved now.

Yeah, that was a typo.  It will work this way in 1.1.2.

> On my Pentium 133S with fastmode I get a more than 2 fold increase in speed 
> and  it feels a lot more usable. Still have to wait between key presses but 
> it is better than before.

Uh oh.  

If you still have to wait I'd better make fastmode disable more stuff :-(.
 
> One general note: scrolling between entries (up/down arrow) seems slower 
> than it should be.

That should be fixed now.  I found a way to recode menuconfig's screen refresh
that will be faster and eliminate the screen flicker.

> Keep up the good work. You are on the right track. (-:

Thanks!
-- 
		<a href="http://www.tuxedo.org/~esr/">Eric S. Raymond</a>

"Rightful liberty is unobstructed action, according to our will, within limits
drawn around us by the equal rights of others."
	-- Thomas Jefferson

Re: CML2 1.1.1, wiuth experimental fast mode

[Albert D. Cahalan]

> 	* Added fast-mode command to suppress side-effect computation 
> 	  on slow machines.

You could put the computation in a low-priority thread, so that it
still gets done but doesn't mess up responsiveness.

Re: CML2 1.1.1, wiuth experimental fast mode

[Eric S. Raymond]

Albert D. Cahalan <acahalan@cs.uml.edu>:
> > 	* Added fast-mode command to suppress side-effect computation 
> > 	  on slow machines.
> 
> You could put the computation in a low-priority thread, so that it
> still gets done but doesn't mess up responsiveness.

Yes, I've thought about doing exactly this.  It's a huge nasty can of
worms, though, because it would mean that the side effects from
setting a symbol could manifest some unpredictable amount of time
after they were triggered.  And what if the user has taken actions
that set variables during that window?  What if the side-effects
conflict?

Clearly, that way lies madness.  I think my effort would be better spent
speed-tuning the deduction algorithms so fastmode can go away.  
-- 
		<a href="http://www.tuxedo.org/~esr/">Eric S. Raymond</a>

The men and women who founded our country knew, by experience, that there
are times when the free person's answer to oppressive government has to be
delivered with a bullet.  Thus, the right to bear arms is not just *a*
freedom; it's the mother of all freedoms.  Don't let them disarm you!