From: "Eric S. Raymond" <esr@thyrsus.com>
To: Alan Cox <alan@lxorguk.ukuu.org.uk>
Cc: Dave Jones <davej@suse.de>,
Arjan van de Ven <arjan@pc1-camc5-0-cust78.cam.cable.ntl.com>,
linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org
Subject: Re: Disgusted with kbuild developers
Date: Fri, 15 Feb 2002 16:46:10 -0500 [thread overview]
Message-ID: <20020215164610.A14418@thyrsus.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <20020215155946.B14083@thyrsus.com> <E16bqC7-0004Mj-00@the-village.bc.nu>
In-Reply-To: <E16bqC7-0004Mj-00@the-village.bc.nu>; from alan@lxorguk.ukuu.org.uk on Fri, Feb 15, 2002 at 09:47:03PM +0000
Alan Cox <alan@lxorguk.ukuu.org.uk>:
> The prototype generates a very convincing table set, and the tables generate
> very convincing graphs. The information to work out what option needs another
> as I've said for months
I've *solved* this problem. I understand the constraints. I know
exactly what you will have to do to get the rest of the way, *because
I did it*.
I have built not just a "proof of concept" but a working
implementation so robust that it is in production use by three
different projects. And a substantial number of kernel developers are
using it now and reporting it good.
The good thing about working with developers like you and Dave Jones
and many of the other loonies on this list is that you are fucking
brilliant. The bad thing is that because you're fucking brilliant,
you're often also ungodly arrogant about second-guessing other
peoples' work -- you think your snap judgment or "proof of concept" is
somehow equivalent to two years of design, coding and testing by
someone who has been concentrating on the problem.
News bulletin: IT'S NOT.
Alan, don't talk to me about "proof of concept". Tell me about a
production-quality system, proven in use by people like Embedsys,
Webmachines, and the Compache project. Tell me you can duplicate what
CML2 does successfully before you run around implying my design
assumptions are full of crap.
--
<a href="http://www.tuxedo.org/~esr/">Eric S. Raymond</a>
next prev parent reply other threads:[~2002-02-15 22:13 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 157+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
2002-02-15 16:55 Disgusted with kbuild developers Jeff Garzik
2002-02-15 16:51 ` Eric S. Raymond
2002-02-15 17:25 ` Dave Jones
2002-02-15 19:01 ` Eric S. Raymond
2002-02-15 17:25 ` Larry McVoy
2002-02-15 17:13 ` Eric S. Raymond
2002-02-15 17:27 ` Tom Rini
2002-02-15 17:31 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-02-15 17:25 ` Eric S. Raymond
2002-02-15 18:24 ` Alexander Viro
2002-02-15 18:55 ` Eric S. Raymond
2002-02-15 19:29 ` Arjan van de Ven
2002-02-15 19:14 ` Eric S. Raymond
2002-02-15 19:58 ` Arjan van de Ven
2002-02-15 19:54 ` Eric S. Raymond
2002-02-15 20:38 ` Dave Jones
2002-02-15 20:45 ` Eric S. Raymond
2002-02-16 8:37 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-02-15 21:34 ` Alan Cox
2002-02-15 20:59 ` Eric S. Raymond
2002-02-15 21:47 ` Alan Cox
2002-02-15 21:46 ` Eric S. Raymond [this message]
2002-02-15 22:40 ` Alan Cox
2002-02-15 22:08 ` Eric S. Raymond
2002-02-15 22:52 ` Alan Cox
2002-02-16 9:50 ` Martin Dalecki
2002-02-16 4:57 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-02-16 7:41 ` Gerd Knorr
2002-02-16 12:36 ` Alan Cox
2002-02-16 14:10 ` Eric S. Raymond
2002-02-15 22:44 ` Rob Landley
2002-02-19 8:04 ` Pavel Machek
2002-02-19 21:13 ` Eric S. Raymond
2002-02-15 22:08 ` Robert Love
2002-02-15 22:28 ` Dave Jones
2002-02-15 22:11 ` Eric S. Raymond
2002-02-15 23:07 ` Alan Cox
2002-02-16 15:54 ` Eric S. Raymond
2002-02-16 16:38 ` Alan Cox
2002-02-16 16:22 ` Eric S. Raymond
2002-02-16 16:52 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-02-16 17:10 ` Alan Cox
2002-02-16 16:50 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-02-16 5:05 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-02-16 11:23 ` Matthias Andree
2002-02-16 14:52 ` Eric S. Raymond
2002-02-16 15:36 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-02-16 15:52 ` Possible breakthrough in the CML2 logjam? Eric S. Raymond
2002-02-16 16:34 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-02-16 16:57 ` Eric S. Raymond
2002-02-16 17:29 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-02-16 17:32 ` Eric S. Raymond
2002-02-16 19:01 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-02-17 0:57 ` Felix von Leitner
2002-02-20 9:07 ` 'revolting' overemphasizes personal beliefs && religion bert hubert
2002-02-16 17:37 ` Possible breakthrough in the CML2 logjam? Larry McVoy
2002-02-16 17:16 ` Eric S. Raymond
2002-02-16 17:48 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-02-16 17:50 ` Larry McVoy
2002-02-18 10:06 ` Rogier Wolff
2002-02-15 20:42 ` Disgusted with kbuild developers Larry McVoy
2002-02-15 20:39 ` Eric S. Raymond
2002-02-15 21:15 ` Dave Jones
2002-02-15 20:58 ` Eric S. Raymond
2002-02-15 21:49 ` Dave Jones
2002-02-15 22:04 ` Eric S. Raymond
2002-02-15 22:41 ` Dave Jones
2002-02-15 23:26 ` Rob Landley
2002-02-16 6:35 ` Eric S. Raymond
2002-02-16 18:20 ` Rob Landley
2002-02-16 9:21 ` David Woodhouse
2002-02-16 13:57 ` Eric S. Raymond
2002-02-16 15:21 ` Adam Kropelin
2002-02-16 14:51 ` David Woodhouse
2002-02-16 15:56 ` Eric S. Raymond
2002-02-16 5:12 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-02-15 22:09 ` Richard Gooch
2002-02-15 21:50 ` Eric S. Raymond
2002-02-15 22:27 ` Dave Jones
2002-02-15 22:19 ` Eric S. Raymond
2002-02-16 0:15 ` Nicolas Pitre
2002-02-16 16:00 ` Eric S. Raymond
2002-02-16 16:53 ` Nicolas Pitre
2002-02-17 0:05 ` Felix von Leitner
2002-02-15 22:38 ` Larry McVoy
2002-02-15 22:22 ` Eric S. Raymond
2002-02-15 23:23 ` Matthias Andree
2002-02-15 23:29 ` Dave Jones
2002-02-15 23:37 ` David Lang
2002-02-16 2:11 ` Matthias Andree
2002-02-15 23:36 ` Larry McVoy
2002-02-15 23:51 ` David Lang
2002-02-16 0:49 ` Alan Cox
2002-02-16 0:08 ` Ben Greear
2002-02-18 9:41 ` Rogier Wolff
2002-02-18 16:07 ` Larry McVoy
2002-02-16 9:53 ` Martin Dalecki
2002-02-16 13:04 ` Matthias Andree
2002-02-16 15:53 ` Michal Jaegermann
2002-02-17 23:06 ` Matthias Andree
2002-02-15 22:41 ` Alan Cox
2002-02-15 23:37 ` Alexander Viro
2002-02-16 1:14 ` William Scott Lockwood III
2002-02-16 1:59 ` Larry McVoy
2002-02-16 2:08 ` William Scott Lockwood III
2002-02-17 4:36 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-02-16 4:17 ` John Jasen
2002-02-16 4:20 ` William Scott Lockwood III
2002-02-15 22:27 ` yodaiken
2002-02-15 22:19 ` Cort Dougan
2002-02-16 8:33 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-02-16 14:53 ` Eric S. Raymond
2002-02-16 16:55 ` Alan Cox
2002-02-15 22:21 ` Robert Love
2002-02-15 22:29 ` That Linux Guy
2002-02-16 5:02 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-02-16 14:50 ` Eric S. Raymond
2002-02-16 15:33 ` CML2 feedback (was Re: Disgusted with kbuild developers) Jeff Garzik
2002-02-16 16:06 ` Disgusted with kbuild developers Nicolas Pitre
2002-02-16 16:08 ` Eric S. Raymond
2002-02-16 16:37 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-02-16 17:34 ` Nicolas Pitre
2002-02-17 6:46 ` Matt D. Robinson
2002-02-16 18:29 ` Of Bundling, Dao and Cowardice Alexander Viro
2002-02-16 19:16 ` That Linux Guy <thatlinuxguy@hotmail.com>,Re: " Rik van Riel
2002-02-18 17:33 ` bill davidsen
2002-02-20 19:53 ` Oliver Xymoron
2002-02-16 22:29 ` Disgusted with kbuild developers Joel Becker
2002-02-17 0:05 ` Rob Landley
2002-02-17 0:26 ` Nicolas Pitre
2002-02-17 23:10 ` Matthias Andree
2002-02-16 9:46 ` Martin Dalecki
2002-02-15 21:24 ` Rob Landley
2002-02-16 9:30 ` Martin Dalecki
2002-02-15 17:02 ` Rik van Riel
2002-02-15 17:35 ` Alexander Viro
2002-02-15 18:00 ` Michael Alan Dorman
-- strict thread matches above, loose matches on Subject: below --
2002-02-15 18:16 Dan Kegel
[not found] <fa.fs57c8v.pms19j@ifi.uio.no>
[not found] ` <fa.h6krj0v.ggg1hm@ifi.uio.no>
2002-02-16 9:04 ` Giacomo A. Catenazzi
2002-02-17 17:59 Michael Elizabeth Chastain
2002-02-17 22:07 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-02-18 21:04 ` Pavel Machek
2002-02-19 2:42 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-02-19 22:27 ` Felix von Leitner
2002-02-20 1:02 ` Keith Moore
2002-02-18 4:20 Michael Elizabeth Chastain
2002-02-18 15:15 SodaPop
2002-02-19 2:48 ` Daniel Phillips
[not found] <fa.i4fkbuv.1k1iiqm@ifi.uio.no>
[not found] ` <fa.iuo8icv.19g8gre@ifi.uio.no>
2002-02-19 7:55 ` Giacomo Catenazzi
[not found] <fa.i8v9q2v.6g8h03@ifi.uio.no>
[not found] ` <fa.hhvfopv.1f70hqv@ifi.uio.no>
2002-02-19 8:04 ` Giacomo Catenazzi
2002-02-19 8:13 ` Alexander Viro
2002-02-19 9:15 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-02-19 21:06 ` Bill Davidsen
2002-02-20 11:43 ` Pavel Machek
2002-02-19 10:04 Greg Banks
[not found] <fa.h0m1njv.tgmh9v@ifi.uio.no>
2002-02-19 11:23 ` Giacomo Catenazzi
2002-02-19 10:51 ` Greg Banks
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