From: Larry McVoy <lm@bitmover.com>
To: Daniel Phillips <phillips@bonn-fries.net>
Cc: Linus Torvalds <torvalds@transmeta.com>, linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org
Subject: Re: [PATCH] Remove Bitkeeper documentation from Linux tree
Date: Sat, 20 Apr 2002 10:41:41 -0700 [thread overview]
Message-ID: <20020420104141.A29646@work.bitmover.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <E16ya3u-0000RG-00@starship>
Oh, my. A couple of thoughts:
a) if it would ease the incredible silent (?) seething anguish of Daniel and
others, I'd be happy to post a copy of Jeff's docs on the bitkeeper.com
website someplace and you could replace the patch with a pointer to that.
Seems silly but if it makes the uproar go away...
b) To all of the "silently seething" folks, build a better answer for
free and the kernel team will switch in a heartbeat. How about you
think of BitKeeper as a stepping stone, a temporary thing until a
better answer appears? It doesn't even have to be better, just good
enough.
We built BK to make the key people more efficient. To some extent, it
is doing that. We'll keep trying to make it help make those people more
efficient. That's *good* for the kernel. Which was always the goal.
I'm terribly sorry that this product space doesn't generate enough
consulting business that it can support itself in a politically correct
way, but it doesn't. Get over it. You either get crap tools or you get
tools that have a business model. In this space, the GPL doesn't work,
you need some other way to pay for the work.
If you don't agree, by all means, feel free to *prove* me wrong by
designing, implementing, and supporting a better (or as good)
answer. That is what Linus has said, and I agree, and the "silently
seething" folks need to either put up or go back to being silent.
A thing to keep in mind is that there are a large number of talkers,
people who spend their time flaming but very little of their time writing
useful code. Those people seem to have the most time to argue about
licenses. There are other people who spend their time writing code,
useful code. The goal is to help the second, smaller, group.
BitKeeper seems to make that second group more productive. And it happily
allows for the license haters to keep on working the way they used to,
at the same speed as they used to. Daniel raised the point that BK has
created the "ins" and the "outs". That's not quite right, it's a question
of "efficient" versus "not quite so efficient". Yeah, it has the effect
of creating an "in" group, but that is because it is easier to work that
way, not because of any evil plan to take over the world with BK.
To repeat: if http://www.bitkeeper.com/kernel-howto.html or something
like that makes you happier, I'll do that immediately.
--
---
Larry McVoy lm at bitmover.com http://www.bitmover.com/lm
next prev parent reply other threads:[~2002-04-20 17:42 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 328+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
2002-04-19 15:12 [PATCH] Remove Bitkeeper documentation from Linux tree Daniel Phillips
2002-04-20 15:52 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-04-20 16:16 ` Roman Zippel
2002-04-20 16:25 ` David Lang
2002-04-20 17:05 ` Roman Zippel
2002-04-20 17:16 ` Linus Torvalds
2002-04-20 16:25 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-04-19 16:33 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-04-20 16:56 ` Linus Torvalds
2002-04-19 17:17 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-04-20 17:35 ` Linus Torvalds
2002-04-20 17:38 ` Thunder from the hill
2002-04-21 2:26 ` Ian Molton
2002-06-18 19:12 ` Greg Stark
2002-04-20 17:19 ` [PATCH] " Roman Zippel
2002-04-20 21:03 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-04-20 21:36 ` Skip Ford
2002-04-20 21:40 ` Rik van Riel
2002-04-20 23:14 ` Larry McVoy
2002-04-20 21:53 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-04-21 0:04 ` Roman Zippel
2002-04-21 0:17 ` Larry McVoy
2002-04-21 9:22 ` Jochen Friedrich
2002-04-21 10:05 ` Thunder from the hill
2002-04-21 10:17 ` Thunder from the hill
2002-04-21 11:10 ` Anton Altaparmakov
2002-04-21 16:46 ` Jochen Friedrich
2002-04-21 17:00 ` Larry McVoy
2002-04-21 17:05 ` Anton Altaparmakov
2002-04-21 17:14 ` Larry McVoy
2002-04-21 13:18 ` Rik van Riel
2002-04-21 13:41 ` yodaiken
2002-04-21 16:50 ` Jochen Friedrich
2002-04-21 17:18 ` yodaiken
2002-04-21 15:17 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-04-21 16:32 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-04-20 16:46 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-04-21 16:57 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-04-20 17:11 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-04-22 12:06 ` Roman Zippel
2002-04-22 16:39 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-04-23 13:49 ` Roman Zippel
2002-04-23 14:51 ` Larry McVoy
2002-04-22 15:29 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-04-23 17:00 ` Rik van Riel
2002-04-23 18:12 ` Roman Zippel
2002-04-23 15:13 ` Roman Zippel
2002-04-23 15:17 ` Larry McVoy
2002-04-23 15:35 ` Roman Zippel
2002-04-23 15:37 ` Larry McVoy
2002-04-23 16:04 ` Roman Zippel
2002-04-23 17:01 ` Rik van Riel
2002-04-23 17:06 ` Roman Zippel
2002-04-23 15:05 ` Rik van Riel
2002-04-23 15:27 ` Roman Zippel
2002-04-21 2:30 ` Ian Molton
2002-04-21 15:33 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-04-20 15:46 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-04-21 15:59 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-04-21 23:36 ` Ian Molton
2002-04-26 21:58 ` Rik van Riel
2002-04-20 16:37 ` Linus Torvalds
2002-04-19 16:45 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-04-20 16:54 ` Alexander Viro
2002-04-21 2:36 ` Ian Molton
2002-04-20 15:54 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-04-20 16:29 ` Nils Philippsen
2002-04-20 16:56 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-04-21 2:38 ` Ian Molton
2002-04-20 16:13 ` Anton Altaparmakov
2002-04-19 16:21 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-04-20 16:51 ` Anton Altaparmakov
2002-04-19 17:05 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-04-20 17:09 ` Linus Torvalds
2002-04-19 17:32 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-04-20 17:51 ` Linus Torvalds
2002-04-19 21:02 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-04-20 21:07 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-04-19 22:01 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-04-20 22:20 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-04-19 22:34 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-04-20 22:54 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-04-21 1:41 ` Rob Landley
2002-04-20 15:44 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-04-21 15:52 ` Rob Landley
2002-04-21 15:59 ` Russell King
2002-04-20 16:10 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-04-21 16:15 ` Russell King
2002-04-21 16:15 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-04-21 16:02 ` arjan
2002-04-20 22:30 ` Stelian Pop
2002-04-21 2:46 ` Ian Molton
2002-04-20 22:37 ` Russell King
2002-04-20 23:15 ` Kenneth Johansson
2002-04-20 17:05 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-04-21 17:15 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-04-21 1:38 ` Oliver Xymoron
2002-04-21 15:32 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-04-20 22:00 ` Stevie O
2002-04-20 22:14 ` Anton Altaparmakov
2002-04-21 2:48 ` Ian Molton
2002-04-20 22:31 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-04-21 17:16 ` Suggestion " CaT
2002-04-21 17:40 ` Larry McVoy
2002-04-20 17:50 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-04-21 17:54 ` CaT
2002-04-21 18:11 ` Larry McVoy
2002-04-21 18:20 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-04-21 18:23 ` Larry McVoy
2002-04-21 18:12 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-04-20 18:23 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-04-21 18:30 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-04-20 19:01 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-04-23 6:04 ` Jamie Lokier
2002-04-22 10:44 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-04-22 10:47 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-04-23 10:57 ` Rasmus Andersen
2002-04-21 22:08 ` Barry K. Nathan
2002-04-21 17:48 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-04-21 17:54 ` Larry McVoy
2002-04-21 17:59 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-04-21 18:18 ` Larry McVoy
2002-04-23 12:10 ` Jes Sorensen
2002-04-23 15:02 ` Larry McVoy
2002-04-23 15:07 ` Jes Sorensen
2002-04-23 15:12 ` Larry McVoy
2002-04-23 16:06 ` Christoph Hellwig
2002-04-24 9:03 ` David Woodhouse
2002-04-24 11:33 ` Dave Jones
2002-04-21 18:53 ` Linus Torvalds
2002-04-21 18:25 ` Tigran Aivazian
2002-04-20 17:51 ` Larry McVoy
2002-04-19 18:27 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-04-20 17:51 ` Rob Landley
2002-04-20 18:41 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-04-20 17:15 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-04-20 17:19 ` Dave Jones
2002-04-20 17:58 ` Eric W. Biederman
2002-04-20 18:35 ` Anton Altaparmakov
2002-04-20 18:13 ` Rik van Riel
2002-04-19 19:43 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-04-20 20:04 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-04-21 2:53 ` Ian Molton
2002-04-21 1:46 ` Rob Landley
2002-04-21 15:51 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-04-21 16:26 ` Tigran Aivazian
2002-04-20 16:34 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-04-21 16:27 ` Richard Gooch
2002-04-20 16:36 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-04-21 16:45 ` Richard Gooch
2002-04-20 17:41 ` Larry McVoy [this message]
2002-04-19 18:07 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-04-20 17:53 ` Eric W. Biederman
2002-04-19 18:15 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-04-20 18:44 ` Eric W. Biederman
2002-04-19 19:22 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-04-20 18:48 ` Russell King
2002-04-19 19:19 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-04-21 2:57 ` Ian Molton
2002-04-21 2:56 ` Arnaldo Carvalho de Melo
2002-04-21 3:46 ` Ian Molton
2002-04-21 3:43 ` Arnaldo Carvalho de Melo
2002-04-21 4:05 ` BK, deltas, snapshots and fate of -pre Alexander Viro
2002-04-21 1:53 ` Rob Landley
2002-04-21 18:40 ` Linus Torvalds
2002-04-21 23:08 ` Pavel Machek
2002-04-24 2:23 ` Linus Torvalds
2002-04-21 3:59 ` David S. Miller
2002-04-21 4:32 ` Andrew Morton
2002-04-21 5:59 ` Andreas Dilger
2002-04-21 4:13 ` Linus Torvalds
2002-04-21 12:53 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-04-22 15:44 ` Larry McVoy
2002-04-21 15:50 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-04-22 16:10 ` Larry McVoy
2002-04-21 16:21 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-04-22 17:17 ` Larry McVoy
2002-04-21 17:34 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-04-22 17:38 ` Larry McVoy
2002-04-21 17:49 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-04-22 17:53 ` Larry McVoy
2002-04-21 18:09 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-04-22 19:53 ` Doug Ledford
2002-04-21 20:29 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-04-22 20:53 ` Doug Ledford
2002-04-21 21:05 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-04-22 21:21 ` Doug Ledford
2002-04-21 21:37 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-04-22 21:45 ` Alexander Viro
2002-04-22 22:49 ` Larry McVoy
2002-04-22 22:08 ` Doug Ledford
2002-04-22 22:25 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-04-22 21:25 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-04-22 21:30 ` Doug Ledford
2002-04-22 21:33 ` Nicholas Harring
2002-04-25 20:53 ` Kai Henningsen
2002-04-21 23:16 ` Pavel Machek
2002-04-23 20:45 ` Rik van Riel
2002-04-25 3:51 ` Ian Molton
2002-04-25 3:55 ` Olivier Galibert
2002-04-25 12:38 ` Ian Molton
2002-04-25 13:33 ` David Woodhouse
2002-04-25 14:29 ` Richard Gooch
2002-04-25 15:41 ` Rik van Riel
2002-04-22 17:31 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-04-27 18:59 ` Richard Gooch
2002-04-26 20:19 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-04-28 17:42 ` Richard Gooch
2002-04-26 20:38 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-04-28 17:52 ` Richard Gooch
2002-04-27 20:02 ` Roman Zippel
2002-04-28 17:40 ` Richard Gooch
2002-04-28 18:08 ` Linus Torvalds
2002-04-28 18:47 ` Richard Gooch
2002-04-28 19:07 ` Kiss The Blade
2002-04-28 19:27 ` Linus Torvalds
2002-04-28 19:41 ` Richard Gooch
2002-04-28 19:49 ` Kiss The Blade
2002-04-28 19:42 ` Richard Gooch
2002-04-28 20:03 ` tomas szepe
2002-04-28 20:11 ` Roman Zippel
2002-04-28 20:40 ` Kiss The Blade
2002-04-29 6:55 ` Kai Henningsen
2002-04-29 6:55 ` Kai Henningsen
2002-04-28 20:06 ` Roman Zippel
2002-04-27 20:40 ` Larry McVoy
2002-04-22 17:10 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-04-21 17:17 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-04-22 17:19 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-04-21 17:37 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-04-22 17:46 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-04-22 17:21 ` Larry McVoy
2002-04-21 17:44 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-04-22 17:48 ` Larry McVoy
2002-04-21 18:03 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-04-22 17:52 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-04-21 18:05 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-04-22 20:18 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-04-21 20:42 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-04-22 20:57 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-04-21 21:06 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-04-22 20:57 ` Anton Altaparmakov
2002-04-22 18:01 ` Anton Altaparmakov
2002-04-21 18:16 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-04-22 18:29 ` Anton Altaparmakov
2002-04-21 18:47 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-04-22 19:41 ` Anton Altaparmakov
2002-04-23 4:57 ` Andre Pang
2002-04-22 11:34 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-04-23 5:56 ` Andreas Dilger
2002-04-21 4:31 ` Ian Molton
2002-04-21 4:20 ` David S. Miller
2002-04-21 4:42 ` Ian Molton
2002-04-21 4:29 ` David S. Miller
2002-04-21 4:49 ` Ben Greear
2002-04-21 6:27 ` Alexander Viro
2002-04-21 11:18 ` Ian Molton
2002-04-21 16:28 ` dean gaudet
2002-04-21 12:57 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-04-22 13:14 ` Impressions of 2.5.8 Matthew D. Pitts
2002-04-21 4:40 ` BK, deltas, snapshots and fate of -pre Skip Ford
2002-04-21 8:31 ` Russell King
2002-04-21 13:05 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-04-22 13:08 ` Russell King
2002-04-21 20:53 ` Skip Ford
2002-04-21 16:35 ` dean gaudet
2002-04-21 17:13 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-04-21 17:23 ` Larry McVoy
2002-04-21 17:32 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-04-21 17:39 ` Larry McVoy
2002-04-21 17:45 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-04-21 17:47 ` Larry McVoy
2002-04-21 17:49 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-04-21 17:57 ` Larry McVoy
2002-04-21 18:07 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-04-21 18:14 ` Larry McVoy
2002-04-21 18:24 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-04-21 18:26 ` Larry McVoy
2002-04-22 6:33 ` Rusty Russell
2002-04-21 15:36 ` [PATCH] Remove Bitkeeper documentation from Linux tree Jeff Garzik
2002-04-21 9:28 ` Jochen Friedrich
2002-04-21 15:53 ` Arnaldo Carvalho de Melo
2002-04-21 18:11 ` John Alvord
2002-04-21 18:15 ` Arnaldo Carvalho de Melo
2002-04-21 15:35 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-04-20 17:09 ` Daniel Phillips
[not found] <20020421101731.D10525@work.bitmover.com>
2002-04-21 17:22 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-04-20 17:48 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-04-21 17:55 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-04-20 18:07 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-04-20 18:13 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-04-21 18:15 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-04-20 18:26 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-04-21 18:40 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-04-21 18:21 ` Larry McVoy
2002-04-20 18:29 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-04-21 18:36 ` Larry McVoy
2002-04-20 18:46 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-04-21 19:07 ` Larry McVoy
2002-04-21 14:39 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-04-21 18:38 ` yodaiken
2002-04-21 18:08 ` Larry McVoy
2002-04-20 18:15 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-04-21 19:06 ` dean gaudet
2002-04-21 14:53 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-04-22 17:03 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-04-21 17:27 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-04-22 17:30 ` Larry McVoy
2002-04-21 17:47 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-04-22 17:40 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-04-21 17:57 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-04-22 20:47 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-04-21 20:54 ` Daniel Phillips
2002-04-22 22:04 ` Davide Libenzi
2002-04-21 20:22 ` Andrew Morton
2002-04-22 0:01 ` Larry McVoy
2002-04-22 20:32 ` Jeff Garzik
-- strict thread matches above, loose matches on Subject: below --
2002-04-22 18:37 Jonathan A. George
2002-04-22 18:58 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-04-22 19:19 ` Jonathan A. George
2002-04-22 19:51 ` Alexander Viro
2002-04-22 19:56 ` Jonathan A. George
2002-04-22 20:13 ` Alexander Viro
2002-04-22 19:52 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-04-22 21:53 ` Jonathan A. George
2002-04-22 19:47 ` Anton Altaparmakov
2002-04-22 19:54 ` Jeff Garzik
2002-04-22 21:13 ` Rik van Riel
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