* IDE?
@ 2002-08-16 21:00 Martin J. Bligh
2002-08-16 21:28 ` IDE? Linus Torvalds
0 siblings, 1 reply; 20+ messages in thread
From: Martin J. Bligh @ 2002-08-16 21:00 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: linux-kernel
So did Linus get disk corruption or is something else afoot?
9 hours axboe 1.456.34.40 Delete 2.5 IDE core
9 hours axboe 1.456.34.41 Add 2.4 IDE core, based on late 2.4.19-pre-acX version
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 20+ messages in thread
* Re: IDE?
2002-08-16 21:00 IDE? Martin J. Bligh
@ 2002-08-16 21:28 ` Linus Torvalds
2002-08-17 11:52 ` IDE? Matthias Andree
0 siblings, 1 reply; 20+ messages in thread
From: Linus Torvalds @ 2002-08-16 21:28 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: linux-kernel
In article <2444170000.1029531611@flay>,
Martin J. Bligh <Martin.Bligh@us.ibm.com> wrote:
>So did Linus get disk corruption or is something else afoot?
Martin gave up the fight he had to do all the time, so..
Linus
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 20+ messages in thread
* Re: IDE?
2002-08-16 21:28 ` IDE? Linus Torvalds
@ 2002-08-17 11:52 ` Matthias Andree
2002-08-17 12:06 ` IDE? IDE-TNG driver Andre Hedrick
2002-08-17 12:08 ` IDE? Russell King
0 siblings, 2 replies; 20+ messages in thread
From: Matthias Andree @ 2002-08-17 11:52 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: linux-kernel
On Fri, 16 Aug 2002, Linus Torvalds wrote:
> In article <2444170000.1029531611@flay>,
> Martin J. Bligh <Martin.Bligh@us.ibm.com> wrote:
> >So did Linus get disk corruption or is something else afoot?
>
> Martin gave up the fight he had to do all the time, so..
Not having seen much of all the work, this sounds like it is a sad day,
for Martin who contributed a lot of his time to work on the issues,
while people seemed not to be too grateful, screaming from either end of
the road, this must wear people out.
Is there a way how the improvements that parts of the stuff have
received can be rescued somehow? Or at least the knowledge of which can
be used somewhat directly for a IDE-TNG driver? I'd find it really sad
to just let go of so much time that had been invested into the project
-- but keep in mind I have NO knowledge of the gory details of the last
2.5 IDE stuff.
--
Matthias Andree
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 20+ messages in thread
* Re: IDE? IDE-TNG driver
2002-08-17 11:52 ` IDE? Matthias Andree
@ 2002-08-17 12:06 ` Andre Hedrick
2002-08-17 13:56 ` Skip Ford
2002-08-17 17:16 ` Ruth Ivimey-Cook
2002-08-17 12:08 ` IDE? Russell King
1 sibling, 2 replies; 20+ messages in thread
From: Andre Hedrick @ 2002-08-17 12:06 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Matthias Andree; +Cc: linux-kernel
I will hand it to you guys on a silver platter IDE-TNG.
Below yields modular chipsets and channel index registration.
Selectable IOPS for arch independent Taskfile Transport layers.
Now to finish the job with device class link lists to address fully
modular subdrivers. It also includes 1st generation of device open and
select calls of subdrivers.
You have ide-cd registered on a cdrw and you want to burn a cd?
open(/dev/hdX) transform_subdriver_scsi close(/dev/hdX)
open(/dev/sg) and burn baby burn.
close(/dev/sg) releases transform_subdriver_scsi
open(/dev/hdX) load native atapi transport.
Will do it for TAPE-FLOPPY-DVDCD/RW ...
Uniform Multi-Platform E-IDE driver Revision: 6.31
ide: Assuming 33MHz system bus speed for PIO modes; override with idebus=xx
SiI680: IDE controller on PCI bus 00 dev 90
SiI680: chipset revision 1
SiI680: not 100% native mode: will probe irqs later
SiI680: BASE CLOCK == 133
ide0: MMIO-DMA at 0xe080df00-0xe080df07, BIOS settings: hda:pio, hdb:pio
ide1: MMIO-DMA at 0xe080df08-0xe080df0f, BIOS settings: hdc:pio, hdd:pio
hda: Maxtor 4G160J8, ATA DISK drive
hdb: Maxtor 4G160J8, ATA DISK drive
ide0 at 0xe080df80-0xe080df87,0xe080df8a on irq 9
hda: host protected area => 1
hda: 320173056 sectors (163929 MB) w/2048KiB Cache, CHS=19929/255/63, UDMA(133)
hdb: host protected area => 1
hdb: 320173056 sectors (163929 MB) w/2048KiB Cache, CHS=19929/255/63, UDMA(133)
hdc: Maxtor 4G160J8, ATA DISK drive
hdd: Maxtor 4G160J8, ATA DISK drive
ide1 at 0xe080dfc0-0xe080dfc7,0xe080dfca on irq 9
hdc: host protected area => 1
hdc: 320173056 sectors (163929 MB) w/2048KiB Cache, CHS=19929/255/63, UDMA(133)
hdd: host protected area => 1
hdd: 320173056 sectors (163929 MB) w/2048KiB Cache, CHS=19929/255/63, UDMA(133)
PIIX3: IDE controller on PCI bus 00 dev 39
PIIX3: chipset revision 0
PIIX3: not 100% native mode: will probe irqs later
ide2: BM-DMA at 0xffa0-0xffa7, BIOS settings: hde:DMA, hdf:DMA
ide3: BM-DMA at 0xffa8-0xffaf, BIOS settings: hdg:pio, hdh:pio
hde: ATAPI 44X CDROM, ATAPI CD/DVD-ROM drive
hdf: CREATIVEDVD5240E-1, ATAPI CD/DVD-ROM drive
ide2 at 0x1f0-0x1f7,0x3f6 on irq 14
hde: ATAPI 40X CD-ROM drive, 128kB Cache, (U)DMA
Uniform CD-ROM driver Revision: 3.12
hdf: ATAPI 32X DVD-ROM drive, 512kB Cache, DMA
Partition check:
/dev/ide/host0/bus0/target0/lun0: p1
/dev/ide/host0/bus0/target1/lun0: p1
/dev/ide/host0/bus1/target0/lun0: p1
/dev/ide/host0/bus1/target1/lun0: p1
If this is what you want, this is what I have to put on the table.
If you do not I will delete the code.
Regards,
Andre Hedrick
LAD Storage Consulting Group
On Sat, 17 Aug 2002, Matthias Andree wrote:
> On Fri, 16 Aug 2002, Linus Torvalds wrote:
>
> > In article <2444170000.1029531611@flay>,
> > Martin J. Bligh <Martin.Bligh@us.ibm.com> wrote:
> > >So did Linus get disk corruption or is something else afoot?
> >
> > Martin gave up the fight he had to do all the time, so..
>
> Not having seen much of all the work, this sounds like it is a sad day,
> for Martin who contributed a lot of his time to work on the issues,
> while people seemed not to be too grateful, screaming from either end of
> the road, this must wear people out.
>
> Is there a way how the improvements that parts of the stuff have
> received can be rescued somehow? Or at least the knowledge of which can
> be used somewhat directly for a IDE-TNG driver? I'd find it really sad
> to just let go of so much time that had been invested into the project
> -- but keep in mind I have NO knowledge of the gory details of the last
> 2.5 IDE stuff.
>
> --
> Matthias Andree
> -
> To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in
> the body of a message to majordomo@vger.kernel.org
> More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html
> Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
>
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 20+ messages in thread
* Re: IDE?
2002-08-17 11:52 ` IDE? Matthias Andree
2002-08-17 12:06 ` IDE? IDE-TNG driver Andre Hedrick
@ 2002-08-17 12:08 ` Russell King
1 sibling, 0 replies; 20+ messages in thread
From: Russell King @ 2002-08-17 12:08 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: linux-kernel
On Sat, Aug 17, 2002 at 01:52:43PM +0200, Matthias Andree wrote:
> Is there a way how the improvements that parts of the stuff have
> received can be rescued somehow?
There were a few bits I submitted that should probably go in - I'll
look at reviving them when I'm less busy and the direction of IDE
stuff has settled down a bit.
--
Russell King (rmk@arm.linux.org.uk) The developer of ARM Linux
http://www.arm.linux.org.uk/personal/aboutme.html
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 20+ messages in thread
* Re: IDE? IDE-TNG driver
2002-08-17 12:06 ` IDE? IDE-TNG driver Andre Hedrick
@ 2002-08-17 13:56 ` Skip Ford
2002-08-17 15:23 ` Matthew D. Pitts
2002-08-17 17:16 ` Ruth Ivimey-Cook
1 sibling, 1 reply; 20+ messages in thread
From: Skip Ford @ 2002-08-17 13:56 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Andre Hedrick; +Cc: linux-kernel
Andre Hedrick wrote:
>
> I will hand it to you guys on a silver platter IDE-TNG.
>
[snip]
>
> If this is what you want, this is what I have to put on the table.
> If you do not I will delete the code.
Can't you just create a patch and send it to the list? I for one would
like to try out your code. Just diff it and send it without the song
and dance please.
--
Skip
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 20+ messages in thread
* Re: IDE? IDE-TNG driver
2002-08-17 13:56 ` Skip Ford
@ 2002-08-17 15:23 ` Matthew D. Pitts
2002-08-17 20:07 ` Alan Cox
0 siblings, 1 reply; 20+ messages in thread
From: Matthew D. Pitts @ 2002-08-17 15:23 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Skip Ford, Andre Hedrick; +Cc: linux-kernel
I agree. Send a patch and I will test it, too.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Skip Ford" <skip.ford@verizon.net>
To: "Andre Hedrick" <andre@linux-ide.org>
Cc: <linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org>
Sent: Saturday, August 17, 2002 9:56 AM
Subject: Re: IDE? IDE-TNG driver
> Andre Hedrick wrote:
> >
> > I will hand it to you guys on a silver platter IDE-TNG.
> >
> [snip]
> >
> > If this is what you want, this is what I have to put on the table.
> > If you do not I will delete the code.
>
> Can't you just create a patch and send it to the list? I for one would
> like to try out your code. Just diff it and send it without the song
> and dance please.
>
> --
> Skip
> -
> To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in
> the body of a message to majordomo@vger.kernel.org
> More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html
> Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 20+ messages in thread
* Re: IDE? IDE-TNG driver
2002-08-17 12:06 ` IDE? IDE-TNG driver Andre Hedrick
2002-08-17 13:56 ` Skip Ford
@ 2002-08-17 17:16 ` Ruth Ivimey-Cook
2002-08-17 18:03 ` Andre Hedrick
1 sibling, 1 reply; 20+ messages in thread
From: Ruth Ivimey-Cook @ 2002-08-17 17:16 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Andre Hedrick; +Cc: Matthias Andree, linux-kernel
On Sat, 17 Aug 2002, Andre Hedrick wrote:
>
>I will hand it to you guys on a silver platter IDE-TNG.
>
>Below yields modular chipsets and channel index registration.
>Selectable IOPS for arch independent Taskfile Transport layers.
...
>You have ide-cd registered on a cdrw and you want to burn a cd?
>open(/dev/hdX) transform_subdriver_scsi close(/dev/hdX)
>open(/dev/sg) and burn baby burn.
>close(/dev/sg) releases transform_subdriver_scsi
>open(/dev/hdX) load native atapi transport.
Andre, I see the thought, but surely this is prine to races and other
difficulties.
Wouldn't it be better to provide an IDE ioctl() that enables the caller to use
set the SCSI transport on an open FD, so your sequence becomes:
open(/dev/hdX)
ioctl(transform_subdriver_scsi)
ioctl(scsi_ops)
write(data)
close(/dev/hdX)
Ruth
--
Ruth Ivimey-Cook
Software engineer and technical writer.
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 20+ messages in thread
* Re: IDE? IDE-TNG driver
2002-08-17 17:16 ` Ruth Ivimey-Cook
@ 2002-08-17 18:03 ` Andre Hedrick
2002-08-17 22:57 ` Ruth Ivimey-Cook
0 siblings, 1 reply; 20+ messages in thread
From: Andre Hedrick @ 2002-08-17 18:03 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Ruth Ivimey-Cook; +Cc: linux-kernel
ide_ioctl(fd, HDIO_SET_IDE_SCSI, bool)
Where bool does the subdriver switch.
Just that ioctl's are being blasted and people using are frowned upon.
This was a feature Alan Cox poked me for to try and move away from how
modules are basically an all or nothing grab-all.
Regards,
Andre Hedrick
LAD Storage Consulting Group
On Sat, 17 Aug 2002, Ruth Ivimey-Cook wrote:
> On Sat, 17 Aug 2002, Andre Hedrick wrote:
>
> >
> >I will hand it to you guys on a silver platter IDE-TNG.
> >
> >Below yields modular chipsets and channel index registration.
> >Selectable IOPS for arch independent Taskfile Transport layers.
> ...
> >You have ide-cd registered on a cdrw and you want to burn a cd?
> >open(/dev/hdX) transform_subdriver_scsi close(/dev/hdX)
> >open(/dev/sg) and burn baby burn.
> >close(/dev/sg) releases transform_subdriver_scsi
> >open(/dev/hdX) load native atapi transport.
>
>
> Andre, I see the thought, but surely this is prine to races and other
> difficulties.
>
> Wouldn't it be better to provide an IDE ioctl() that enables the caller to use
> set the SCSI transport on an open FD, so your sequence becomes:
>
> open(/dev/hdX)
> ioctl(transform_subdriver_scsi)
> ioctl(scsi_ops)
> write(data)
> close(/dev/hdX)
>
> Ruth
>
> --
> Ruth Ivimey-Cook
> Software engineer and technical writer.
>
> -
> To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in
> the body of a message to majordomo@vger.kernel.org
> More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html
> Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
>
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 20+ messages in thread
* Re: IDE? IDE-TNG driver
2002-08-17 15:23 ` Matthew D. Pitts
@ 2002-08-17 20:07 ` Alan Cox
0 siblings, 0 replies; 20+ messages in thread
From: Alan Cox @ 2002-08-17 20:07 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Matthew D. Pitts; +Cc: Skip Ford, Andre Hedrick, linux-kernel
You can do the switch (one way only right now) in 2.4.20-pre2-ac3.
Ultimately for 2.4 I want to get to the point where open() tries to
switch between srfoo and hdfoo and locks out the other user. For 2.5 we
can get more esoteric. 2.4 has to continue to just work
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 20+ messages in thread
* Re: IDE? IDE-TNG driver
2002-08-17 18:03 ` Andre Hedrick
@ 2002-08-17 22:57 ` Ruth Ivimey-Cook
2002-08-17 23:06 ` Andre Hedrick
2002-08-18 0:28 ` Scott Bronson
0 siblings, 2 replies; 20+ messages in thread
From: Ruth Ivimey-Cook @ 2002-08-17 22:57 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Andre Hedrick; +Cc: linux-kernel
On Sat, 17 Aug 2002, Andre Hedrick wrote:
>
>ide_ioctl(fd, HDIO_SET_IDE_SCSI, bool)
Seems fine to me...
>Where bool does the subdriver switch.
>Just that ioctl's are being blasted and people using are frowned upon.
? so how is cdrecord (or whatever) supposed to do its stuff -- is it ioctl()
-> fcntl()? If so, I suppose that's ok, but the basic premise still exists,
surely?
>This was a feature Alan Cox poked me for to try and move away from how
>modules are basically an all or nothing grab-all.
I don't think modules are the answer to any of this:
a) some people want basically module-less kernels
b) in some environments, you need to be able to select the IO mechanism
without the ability to select the module to load.
anyway...
<slightly confused by it all>
Ruth
--
Ruth Ivimey-Cook
Software engineer and technical writer.
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 20+ messages in thread
* Re: IDE? IDE-TNG driver
2002-08-17 22:57 ` Ruth Ivimey-Cook
@ 2002-08-17 23:06 ` Andre Hedrick
2002-08-18 3:01 ` Erik Andersen
2002-08-18 0:28 ` Scott Bronson
1 sibling, 1 reply; 20+ messages in thread
From: Andre Hedrick @ 2002-08-17 23:06 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Ruth Ivimey-Cook; +Cc: linux-kernel
On Sat, 17 Aug 2002, Ruth Ivimey-Cook wrote:
> On Sat, 17 Aug 2002, Andre Hedrick wrote:
> >
> >ide_ioctl(fd, HDIO_SET_IDE_SCSI, bool)
>
> Seems fine to me...
>
> >Where bool does the subdriver switch.
> >Just that ioctl's are being blasted and people using are frowned upon.
>
> ? so how is cdrecord (or whatever) supposed to do its stuff -- is it ioctl()
> -> fcntl()? If so, I suppose that's ok, but the basic premise still exists,
> surely?
>
> >This was a feature Alan Cox poked me for to try and move away from how
> >modules are basically an all or nothing grab-all.
>
> I don't think modules are the answer to any of this:
> a) some people want basically module-less kernels
This is designed to work regardless.
/dev/hdc == ide-cd builtin
insmod ide-scsi
ide_ioctl(fd, HDIO_SET_IDE_SCSI, bool)
converts /dev/hdc == ide-cd builtin to ide-scsi(add-in-module).
> b) in some environments, you need to be able to select the IO mechanism
> without the ability to select the module to load.
See above, I think it solves the problem.
Once ide-scsi is added to the ide_module link list it is as good as
built-in.
> anyway...
>
> <slightly confused by it all>
Me too, because I do not know the direction goal so I am doing the very
best I can. What I really need is an active development team.
Before me:
Mark Lord, Gadi Oxman, Eric Anderson worked well.
ML ide-disk and ide.c global.
GO ide-floppy, ide-tape, ide-scsi
EA ide-cd
Anyways that was long before transport layer w/ all the hardware issues
began to dominate things.
Cheers,
Andre Hedrick
LAD Storage Consulting Group
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 20+ messages in thread
* Re: IDE? IDE-TNG driver
2002-08-17 22:57 ` Ruth Ivimey-Cook
2002-08-17 23:06 ` Andre Hedrick
@ 2002-08-18 0:28 ` Scott Bronson
2002-08-18 3:47 ` Scott Bronson
` (2 more replies)
1 sibling, 3 replies; 20+ messages in thread
From: Scott Bronson @ 2002-08-18 0:28 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Ruth Ivimey-Cook; +Cc: linux-kernel
On Sat, 2002-08-17 at 15:57, Ruth Ivimey-Cook wrote:
> a) some people want basically module-less kernels
Everyone I've heard advocating a moduleless kernel uses an argument that
boils down to "it's slightly more secure." Does anybody have a GOOD
reason for not using modules? Obsolete or embedded hardware arguments
don't count.
> b) in some environments, you need to be able to select the IO mechanism
> without the ability to select the module to load.
If that's the case, won't a kernel parameter suffice? Can you
elaborate?
- Scott
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 20+ messages in thread
* Re: IDE? IDE-TNG driver
2002-08-17 23:06 ` Andre Hedrick
@ 2002-08-18 3:01 ` Erik Andersen
0 siblings, 0 replies; 20+ messages in thread
From: Erik Andersen @ 2002-08-18 3:01 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Andre Hedrick; +Cc: linux-kernel
On Sat Aug 17, 2002 at 04:06:46PM -0700, Andre Hedrick wrote:
> Mark Lord, Gadi Oxman, Eric Anderson worked well.
All these years later, I'm still known to submit
the occasional patch....
-Erik
--
Erik B. Andersen http://codepoet-consulting.com/
--This message was written using 73% post-consumer electrons--
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 20+ messages in thread
* Re: IDE? IDE-TNG driver
2002-08-18 0:28 ` Scott Bronson
@ 2002-08-18 3:47 ` Scott Bronson
2002-08-18 4:07 ` Thomas Molina
2002-08-18 4:20 ` CaT
2002-08-19 0:03 ` David Lang
2002-08-19 9:11 ` Helge Hafting
2 siblings, 2 replies; 20+ messages in thread
From: Scott Bronson @ 2002-08-18 3:47 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Scott Bronson; +Cc: Ruth Ivimey-Cook, linux-kernel
> Everyone I've heard advocating a moduleless kernel uses an argument that
> boils down to "it's slightly more secure." Does anybody have a GOOD
> reason for not using modules? Obsolete or embedded hardware arguments
> don't count.
Someone replied off-list saying that initrds are too hard to create.
That's true. They are. One day, hopefully that will change.
Any other reasons?
- Scott
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 20+ messages in thread
* Re: IDE? IDE-TNG driver
2002-08-18 3:47 ` Scott Bronson
@ 2002-08-18 4:07 ` Thomas Molina
2002-08-18 4:20 ` CaT
1 sibling, 0 replies; 20+ messages in thread
From: Thomas Molina @ 2002-08-18 4:07 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Scott Bronson; +Cc: linux-kernel
On 17 Aug 2002, Scott Bronson wrote:
> > Everyone I've heard advocating a moduleless kernel uses an argument that
> > boils down to "it's slightly more secure." Does anybody have a GOOD
> > reason for not using modules? Obsolete or embedded hardware arguments
> > don't count.
>
> Someone replied off-list saying that initrds are too hard to create.
>
> That's true. They are. One day, hopefully that will change.
>
> Any other reasons?
Wouldn't the logic be a lot simpler if kernel developers didn't have to
worry about whether their module was built in or inserted at some point in
the future? All the bits could be assembled and symbols would be resolved
at compile time.
ICBW but it appears the largest percentage of users have modules inserted
at boot time, never to be ejected or disturbed. The modules might as well
be built in.
I've never really grokked the whole initrd anyway. What is the point of
building a kernel minus the bits it needs to actually boot the system?
That just forces this ludicrous jerry-rigged mess to provide the
capabilities that should have been built in at compile time.
Of course, we're never going to get away from modules now anyway, so the
argument is probably moot. With PCCARD, USB, Firewire, and Hotplug PCI
there are too many ways to add components not present when the system is
built on an adhoc basis. The alternative would be a bloated monstrosity
with dead code not needed by most people. I remember my early days of
Linux and seeing literally dozens of kernels compiled with different
options, with no clue how to choose the right one for my system.
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 20+ messages in thread
* Re: IDE? IDE-TNG driver
2002-08-18 3:47 ` Scott Bronson
2002-08-18 4:07 ` Thomas Molina
@ 2002-08-18 4:20 ` CaT
1 sibling, 0 replies; 20+ messages in thread
From: CaT @ 2002-08-18 4:20 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Scott Bronson; +Cc: linux-kernel
On Sat, Aug 17, 2002 at 08:47:30PM -0700, Scott Bronson wrote:
> > Everyone I've heard advocating a moduleless kernel uses an argument that
> > boils down to "it's slightly more secure." Does anybody have a GOOD
> > reason for not using modules? Obsolete or embedded hardware arguments
> > don't count.
>
> Someone replied off-list saying that initrds are too hard to create.
>
> That's true. They are. One day, hopefully that will change.
>
> Any other reasons?
Because I shouldn't have to use a feature if I don't need to use a
feature?
I dunno... I've not once heard a decent argument as to why I should
modulerise the ide subsystem, or ext3 or the video drivers and so on.
Where I -do- need to use it though, I do happily use it. One case is to
reset the eepro100 driver so that it works after my computer is brought
out of suspend mode (either RAM or disk).
But why should I -not- make a monolithic kernel when I don't have any
reason to do so? If you can provide me with some decent ones, I'll
happily start...
--
"There was a moo from under the blanket, and I knew it was not a person,
but a calf."
- http://www.iol.co.za/index.php?art_id=qw1028795041273B265
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 20+ messages in thread
* Re: IDE? IDE-TNG driver
2002-08-18 0:28 ` Scott Bronson
2002-08-18 3:47 ` Scott Bronson
@ 2002-08-19 0:03 ` David Lang
2002-08-19 9:11 ` Helge Hafting
2 siblings, 0 replies; 20+ messages in thread
From: David Lang @ 2002-08-19 0:03 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Scott Bronson; +Cc: Ruth Ivimey-Cook, linux-kernel
A couple things in favor of a monlithic kernel.
there is a slight performance advantage becouse the calls don't
have to be far calls
there is a slight memory advantage becouse you don't have the fraction of
a page of ram lost per module
with a monolithic kernel there's no chance of making a mistake and trying
to use incompatable modules with your kernel (and before you say that this
can be fixed with the kernel build remember that for many people the build
machine is not where the kernel will be run)
David Lang
On 17 Aug 2002, Scott
Bronson wrote:
> Date: 17 Aug 2002 17:28:38 -0700
> From: Scott Bronson <bronson@rinspin.com>
> To: Ruth Ivimey-Cook <Ruth.Ivimey-Cook@ivimey.org>
> Cc: linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org
> Subject: Re: IDE? IDE-TNG driver
>
> On Sat, 2002-08-17 at 15:57, Ruth Ivimey-Cook wrote:
> > a) some people want basically module-less kernels
>
> Everyone I've heard advocating a moduleless kernel uses an argument that
> boils down to "it's slightly more secure." Does anybody have a GOOD
> reason for not using modules? Obsolete or embedded hardware arguments
> don't count.
>
>
> > b) in some environments, you need to be able to select the IO mechanism
> > without the ability to select the module to load.
>
> If that's the case, won't a kernel parameter suffice? Can you
> elaborate?
>
> - Scott
>
>
>
> -
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^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 20+ messages in thread
* Re: IDE? IDE-TNG driver
2002-08-18 0:28 ` Scott Bronson
2002-08-18 3:47 ` Scott Bronson
2002-08-19 0:03 ` David Lang
@ 2002-08-19 9:11 ` Helge Hafting
2 siblings, 0 replies; 20+ messages in thread
From: Helge Hafting @ 2002-08-19 9:11 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Scott Bronson; +Cc: linux-kernel
Scott Bronson wrote:
>
> On Sat, 2002-08-17 at 15:57, Ruth Ivimey-Cook wrote:
> > a) some people want basically module-less kernels
>
> Everyone I've heard advocating a moduleless kernel uses an argument that
> boils down to "it's slightly more secure." Does anybody have a GOOD
> reason for not using modules?
1. "No need". Doesn't apply to everybody of course, but
many have enough memory and don't plug in much new stuff.
Recompiling & booting for the rare occation where you
bought a new usb device is ok.
2. A simpler setup. No /etc/modules.conf to worry about.
Compiling ALSA into the kernel surely made life easier.
even more so when also using devfs...
3. Performance. Compiled-in stuff is always there, and
on x86 it exists in the kernel's 4M page so no
TLB loading overhead either.
> Someone replied off-list saying that initrds are too hard to create.
Actually, that isn't an argument for linking everything in.
All you need is the drivers for your root fs and root device.
The rest may still be modular, loaded from /lib/modules on
that root fs.
Helge Hafting
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 20+ messages in thread
* Re: IDE? IDE-TNG driver
@ 2002-08-26 19:17 David Balazic
0 siblings, 0 replies; 20+ messages in thread
From: David Balazic @ 2002-08-26 19:17 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: andre, linux-kernel
Andre Hedrick (andre@linux-ide.org) wrote :
> I will hand it to you guys on a silver platter IDE-TNG.
>
> Below yields modular chipsets and channel index registration.
> Selectable IOPS for arch independent Taskfile Transport layers.
> Now to finish the job with device class link lists to address fully
> modular subdrivers. It also includes 1st generation of device open and
> select calls of subdrivers.
Will it support DISCONNECT/RECONNECT ( of course named differently
in ATA, "overlapped command feature" if I'm not mistaken ) ?
If not, consider this as a request for implementation :-)
I can offer (beta)testing ( I have two ATAPI CD-ROMs ( one is a
rewriter ) and a HD , that all claim ( according to hdparm -I output )
to support overlapped commands ) and maybe money, if everything else
fails :-)
I expect this to improve performance ( latency actually ) on the ATA
channel when slow devices are involved ( and even fast devices can have
slow moments, like a read of a slightly broken sector ).
Best regards,
david balazic
> You have ide-cd registered on a cdrw and you want to burn a cd?
> open(/dev/hdX) transform_subdriver_scsi close(/dev/hdX)
> open(/dev/sg) and burn baby burn.
> close(/dev/sg) releases transform_subdriver_scsi
> open(/dev/hdX) load native atapi transport.
>
> Will do it for TAPE-FLOPPY-DVDCD/RW ...
>
> Uniform Multi-Platform E-IDE driver Revision: 6.31
> ide: Assuming 33MHz system bus speed for PIO modes; override with idebus=xx
> SiI680: IDE controller on PCI bus 00 dev 90
> SiI680: chipset revision 1
> SiI680: not 100% native mode: will probe irqs later
> SiI680: BASE CLOCK == 133
> ide0: MMIO-DMA at 0xe080df00-0xe080df07, BIOS settings: hda:pio, hdb:pio
> ide1: MMIO-DMA at 0xe080df08-0xe080df0f, BIOS settings: hdc:pio, hdd:pio
> hda: Maxtor 4G160J8, ATA DISK drive
> hdb: Maxtor 4G160J8, ATA DISK drive
> ide0 at 0xe080df80-0xe080df87,0xe080df8a on irq 9
> hda: host protected area => 1
> hda: 320173056 sectors (163929 MB) w/2048KiB Cache, CHS=19929/255/63, UDMA(133)
> hdb: host protected area => 1
> hdb: 320173056 sectors (163929 MB) w/2048KiB Cache, CHS=19929/255/63, UDMA(133)
> hdc: Maxtor 4G160J8, ATA DISK drive
> hdd: Maxtor 4G160J8, ATA DISK drive
> ide1 at 0xe080dfc0-0xe080dfc7,0xe080dfca on irq 9
> hdc: host protected area => 1
> hdc: 320173056 sectors (163929 MB) w/2048KiB Cache, CHS=19929/255/63, UDMA(133)
> hdd: host protected area => 1
> hdd: 320173056 sectors (163929 MB) w/2048KiB Cache, CHS=19929/255/63, UDMA(133)
> PIIX3: IDE controller on PCI bus 00 dev 39
> PIIX3: chipset revision 0
> PIIX3: not 100% native mode: will probe irqs later
> ide2: BM-DMA at 0xffa0-0xffa7, BIOS settings: hde:DMA, hdf:DMA
> ide3: BM-DMA at 0xffa8-0xffaf, BIOS settings: hdg:pio, hdh:pio
> hde: ATAPI 44X CDROM, ATAPI CD/DVD-ROM drive
> hdf: CREATIVEDVD5240E-1, ATAPI CD/DVD-ROM drive
> ide2 at 0x1f0-0x1f7,0x3f6 on irq 14
> hde: ATAPI 40X CD-ROM drive, 128kB Cache, (U)DMA
> Uniform CD-ROM driver Revision: 3.12
> hdf: ATAPI 32X DVD-ROM drive, 512kB Cache, DMA
> Partition check:
> /dev/ide/host0/bus0/target0/lun0: p1
> /dev/ide/host0/bus0/target1/lun0: p1
> /dev/ide/host0/bus1/target0/lun0: p1
> /dev/ide/host0/bus1/target1/lun0: p1
>
> If this is what you want, this is what I have to put on the table.
> If you do not I will delete the code.
>
> Regards,
>
> Andre Hedrick
> LAD Storage Consulting Group
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 20+ messages in thread
end of thread, other threads:[~2002-08-26 19:14 UTC | newest]
Thread overview: 20+ messages (download: mbox.gz follow: Atom feed
-- links below jump to the message on this page --
2002-08-16 21:00 IDE? Martin J. Bligh
2002-08-16 21:28 ` IDE? Linus Torvalds
2002-08-17 11:52 ` IDE? Matthias Andree
2002-08-17 12:06 ` IDE? IDE-TNG driver Andre Hedrick
2002-08-17 13:56 ` Skip Ford
2002-08-17 15:23 ` Matthew D. Pitts
2002-08-17 20:07 ` Alan Cox
2002-08-17 17:16 ` Ruth Ivimey-Cook
2002-08-17 18:03 ` Andre Hedrick
2002-08-17 22:57 ` Ruth Ivimey-Cook
2002-08-17 23:06 ` Andre Hedrick
2002-08-18 3:01 ` Erik Andersen
2002-08-18 0:28 ` Scott Bronson
2002-08-18 3:47 ` Scott Bronson
2002-08-18 4:07 ` Thomas Molina
2002-08-18 4:20 ` CaT
2002-08-19 0:03 ` David Lang
2002-08-19 9:11 ` Helge Hafting
2002-08-17 12:08 ` IDE? Russell King
-- strict thread matches above, loose matches on Subject: below --
2002-08-26 19:17 IDE? IDE-TNG driver David Balazic
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