Re: holy grail

[Werner Almesberger <wa@almesberger.net>]

Anomalous Force wrote:
> you miss my point. im not saying to model it after tcp/ip. that
> was just a reference to a method of data exchange wherein the
> data has metadata to describe it.

I understood that. What I was saying is that metadata in a TCP
connection is usually not sufficient for restoring the endpoint
state.

> it makes full sense in an enterprise with 3000+ users that operates
> 24/7/365. no scheduled down-time for kernel upgrades.

I don't disagree with the usefulness of such functionality, but
I disagree with the level at which you suggest to implement this.

The approach of trying to migrate low-level kernel state has the
following problems/disadvantages:

 - complexity
 - does not allow recovery from corrupt kernel state, as Pavel has
   suggested
 - does not support recovery from corrupt hardware state
 - does not support substitution of infrastructure (e.g. what if
   I want to fail over to a different machine, maybe quickly
   replace some non-hotpluggable hardware (*), or even swap that
   old disk with a new one that has completely different
   characteristics ?)

So, compared to an approach that implements this at the kernel to
user space API level, you get a lot of extra complexity, but miss
several very desirable features.

(*) While the "big iron" in your data center may have hot-swappable
    CPUs and everything, it would be nice if such things could also
    be done with commodity hardware that doesn't provide such
    luxury.

> this is not true. if the system were an integral part of the overall
> design, then programming would include it apriori.

Making something part of the design alone doesn't guarantee that
this is a good approach, nor that it will actually work :-)

> there is a fine distinction between kernel migration, and hot-swap.
> in a hot-swap setup, there will be signals pending from devices
[...]

Err, yes, but what does your "hot-swap" do that kernel migration
doesn't ?

- Werner

-- 
  _________________________________________________________________________
 / Werner Almesberger, Buenos Aires, Argentina         wa@almesberger.net /
/_http://www.almesberger.net/____________________________________________/