From: Dave Jones <davej@redhat.com>
To: Jeff Garzik <jeff@garzik.org>
Cc: v j <vj.linux@gmail.com>,
Trent Waddington <trent.waddington@gmail.com>,
linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org
Subject: Re: GPL vs non-GPL device drivers
Date: Thu, 15 Feb 2007 05:50:12 -0500 [thread overview]
Message-ID: <20070215105011.GA4610@redhat.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <45D42B93.3060209@garzik.org>
On Thu, Feb 15, 2007 at 04:44:51AM -0500, Jeff Garzik wrote:
> Dave Jones wrote:
> > On Wed, Feb 14, 2007 at 10:46:13PM -0800, v j wrote:
> > > Using our source code would not benefit anybody but
> > > our competitors.
> >
> > This excuse has been given time and time again, and repeatedly been
> > proven false. And as soon as one of your competitors makes their
> > drivers open, guess which one gets 1000+ free developers working
> > on their code ?
>
>
> Customers also like to buy hardware where they -know- support will not
> disappear in a year, when the vendor releases a new chip.
Absolutely. This is a very good point.
And users of binary blobs like nvidia.ko are already beginning to see
this problem. (Nvidia dropped support for "legacy" cards a while back)
Only open drivers ensure ongoing vendor-independant support, which
is an important thing. I'd not be happy buying a device that I know
the vendor is going to ship security updates for a year after release.
VJ, how long does your company support each product? And how much
engineering effort is spent doing so, vs effort that you could get
for free by opening your driver(s) ?
> In fact, in some markets, the engineers who wrote the code have often
> moved to the next project, by the time the customers actually get their
> hands on the end result. Open source means that problems found in real
> world field testing can be readily debugged and fixed.
Even open drivers have the same problem. Take for example longhaul.c.
I lost interest in this a while ago and moved on to shinier new hardware
(whilst it still had numerous problems) and rafal picked this up and has
been fixing it up like something possessed since.
If this were a closed driver, it would have been doomed never to improve.
It's a great example of one of the strengths of the open process.
Dave
--
http://www.codemonkey.org.uk
next prev parent reply other threads:[~2007-02-15 10:50 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 255+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
[not found] <9b3a62ab0702142115m4ea7d2c0m6869eb64ef3ee14e@mail.gmail.com>
2007-02-15 5:16 ` GPL vs non-GPL device drivers v j
[not found] ` <75b66ecd0702142130x64824694ieee1869d0d70ab15@mail.gmail.com>
2007-02-15 5:38 ` v j
2007-02-15 5:47 ` Trent Waddington
[not found] ` <9b3a62ab0702142214p5c33a02am7e783c59ae0a64f1@mail.gmail.com>
2007-02-15 6:16 ` v j
2007-02-15 12:45 ` Neil Horman
2007-02-15 6:35 ` Trent Waddington
2007-02-15 6:46 ` v j
2007-02-15 6:56 ` Trent Waddington
2007-02-15 7:32 ` Dave Jones
2007-02-15 9:44 ` Jeff Garzik
2007-02-15 10:50 ` Dave Jones [this message]
2007-02-15 14:24 ` Jan De Luyck
2007-02-15 14:37 ` Benny Amorsen
2007-02-15 14:47 ` Bernd Petrovitsch
2007-02-15 17:49 ` Jan Knutar
2007-02-15 7:55 ` Neil Brown
2007-02-15 14:45 ` Bernd Petrovitsch
2007-02-15 20:21 ` Chris Snook
2007-02-15 22:34 ` Jeff Garzik
2007-02-16 4:20 ` Alexandre Oliva
2007-02-15 6:11 ` Dave Jones
2007-02-15 6:27 ` v j
2007-02-15 6:43 ` Neil Brown
2007-02-15 6:55 ` v j
2007-02-15 7:02 ` Trent Waddington
2007-02-15 7:09 ` v j
2007-02-15 7:18 ` Trent Waddington
2007-02-15 7:30 ` Neil Brown
2007-02-15 11:52 ` Adrian Bunk
2007-02-15 7:11 ` Randy Dunlap
2007-02-15 7:28 ` v j
2007-02-15 7:43 ` Neil Brown
2007-02-15 7:53 ` Trent Waddington
2007-02-15 8:11 ` Neil Brown
2007-02-15 8:35 ` Trent Waddington
2007-02-15 20:56 ` David Schwartz
2007-02-15 21:51 ` Trent Waddington
2007-02-16 0:38 ` David Schwartz
2007-02-16 12:53 ` Adrian Bunk
2007-02-17 2:42 ` David Schwartz
2007-02-17 8:29 ` Neil Brown
2007-02-18 2:55 ` Michael K. Edwards
2007-02-18 3:26 ` Trent Waddington
2007-02-18 6:56 ` Michael K. Edwards
2007-02-18 7:20 ` Michael K. Edwards
2007-02-18 8:54 ` Oleg Verych
2007-02-18 23:42 ` Michael K. Edwards
2007-02-18 13:57 ` Theodore Tso
2007-02-18 21:16 ` Trent Waddington
2007-02-18 1:26 ` Trent Waddington
2007-02-18 1:28 ` David Lang
2007-02-18 1:51 ` Trent Waddington
2007-02-19 17:48 ` David Schwartz
2007-02-19 20:55 ` Trent Waddington
2007-02-19 21:53 ` Michael K. Edwards
2007-02-19 22:26 ` Trent Waddington
2007-02-19 22:48 ` Michael K. Edwards
2007-02-19 22:58 ` Trent Waddington
2007-02-19 23:18 ` Michael K. Edwards
2007-02-19 23:26 ` Trent Waddington
2007-02-20 0:28 ` Michael K. Edwards
2007-02-20 0:36 ` Trent Waddington
2007-02-20 0:50 ` Michael K. Edwards
2007-02-20 0:55 ` Trent Waddington
2007-02-20 0:58 ` Michael K. Edwards
2007-02-20 1:00 ` Trent Waddington
2007-02-20 7:48 ` Trent Waddington
2007-02-20 8:24 ` v j
2007-02-20 9:01 ` Trent Waddington
2007-02-20 1:29 ` David Schwartz
2007-02-20 5:19 ` v j
2007-02-20 10:54 ` Nick Piggin
2007-02-20 11:00 ` Bernd Petrovitsch
2007-02-20 15:14 ` Valdis.Kletnieks
2007-02-20 15:39 ` Bernd Petrovitsch
2007-02-20 14:36 ` Helge Hafting
2007-02-20 20:30 ` Jan-Benedict Glaw
2007-02-21 12:45 ` Helge Hafting
2007-02-21 22:08 ` Michael K. Edwards
2007-02-21 23:30 ` Nuno Silva
2007-02-22 0:26 ` Michael K. Edwards
2007-02-21 23:34 ` David Lang
2007-02-22 0:28 ` Michael K. Edwards
2007-02-22 1:30 ` D. Hazelton
2007-02-22 2:05 ` Michael K. Edwards
2007-02-22 4:17 ` D. Hazelton
2007-02-22 4:24 ` Trent Waddington
2007-02-22 6:12 ` Michael K. Edwards
2007-02-22 9:28 ` Jon K Hellan
2007-02-22 16:45 ` Theodore Tso
2007-02-22 20:30 ` D. Hazelton
2007-02-25 0:59 ` Adrian Bunk
2007-02-22 14:14 ` Alan
2007-02-22 22:42 ` Michael K. Edwards
2007-02-23 0:18 ` Alan
2007-02-23 1:12 ` Randy Dunlap
2007-02-23 1:21 ` Michael K. Edwards
2007-02-22 14:10 ` Alan
2007-02-22 21:36 ` D. Hazelton
2007-02-22 22:28 ` Michael K. Edwards
2007-02-25 10:42 ` Pavel Machek
2007-02-25 11:33 ` David Schwartz
2007-02-25 19:39 ` Pavel Machek
2007-02-26 0:47 ` David Schwartz
2007-02-26 1:54 ` D. Hazelton
2007-02-25 11:54 ` Michael K. Edwards
2007-02-25 13:52 ` Alan
2007-02-25 14:21 ` Michael K. Edwards
2007-02-25 19:10 ` Alan
2007-02-26 10:16 ` Michael K. Edwards
2007-02-26 14:12 ` Alan
2007-02-25 22:27 ` Trent Waddington
2007-02-26 10:17 ` Michael K. Edwards
2007-02-25 20:15 ` D. Hazelton
2007-02-25 17:56 ` Stephen Clark
2007-02-19 22:47 ` David Schwartz
2007-02-15 13:09 ` Jan Engelhardt
2007-02-15 8:12 ` Nick Piggin
2007-02-15 10:01 ` Xavier Bestel
2007-02-15 10:51 ` Mohammed Gamal
2007-02-15 11:00 ` Xavier Bestel
2007-02-15 11:05 ` Trent Waddington
2007-02-15 11:17 ` Dave Jones
2007-02-15 11:15 ` Dave Jones
2007-02-15 11:35 ` Trent Waddington
2007-02-15 13:14 ` Jan Engelhardt
2007-02-15 14:43 ` Bernd Petrovitsch
2007-02-15 16:22 ` Stuart MacDonald
2007-02-16 0:36 ` Scott Preece
2007-02-16 9:44 ` Xavier Bestel
2007-02-16 9:58 ` Bernd Petrovitsch
2007-02-15 7:24 ` Dave Jones
2007-02-15 9:54 ` Xavier Bestel
2007-02-15 14:14 ` Neil Horman
2007-02-15 14:43 ` Bernd Petrovitsch
2007-02-15 16:25 ` Rik van Riel
2007-02-15 16:53 ` Theodore Tso
2007-02-15 18:20 ` v j
2007-02-15 18:41 ` Josh Boyer
2007-02-16 15:34 ` Lennart Sorensen
2007-02-15 18:58 ` Xavier Bestel
2007-02-15 19:02 ` Miguel Ojeda
2007-02-16 1:12 ` Scott Preece
2007-02-16 1:14 ` David Lang
2007-02-16 5:48 ` v j
2007-02-16 5:57 ` Trent Waddington
2007-02-16 6:25 ` v j
2007-02-16 6:40 ` Miguel Ojeda
2007-02-16 6:45 ` Trent Waddington
2007-02-16 9:16 ` David Schwartz
2007-02-16 10:00 ` Joshua Simmons
2007-02-16 11:42 ` David Schwartz
2007-02-16 11:51 ` Bernd Petrovitsch
2007-02-16 13:29 ` Joshua Simmons
2007-02-17 2:42 ` David Schwartz
2007-02-17 6:44 ` Alexandre Oliva
2007-02-17 7:26 ` Valdis.Kletnieks
2007-02-16 10:35 ` Richard Knutsson
2007-02-16 17:12 ` Dave Neuer
2007-02-16 21:26 ` Scott Preece
2007-02-18 17:08 ` Pavel Machek
2007-02-17 2:42 ` David Schwartz
2007-02-17 10:46 ` Giuseppe Bilotta
2007-02-17 14:19 ` David Schwartz
2007-02-17 23:30 ` Giuseppe Bilotta
2007-02-17 23:55 ` Michael K. Edwards
2007-02-18 9:00 ` Giuseppe Bilotta
2007-02-19 17:53 ` David Schwartz
2007-02-18 5:15 ` Alexandre Oliva
2007-02-17 22:18 ` Dave Neuer
2007-02-17 23:04 ` David Schwartz
2007-02-17 23:04 ` Michael K. Edwards
2007-02-16 9:52 ` Valdis.Kletnieks
2007-02-16 13:44 ` Trent Waddington
2007-02-16 10:30 ` Valdis.Kletnieks
2007-02-16 10:38 ` Bernd Petrovitsch
2007-02-16 14:04 ` Neil Horman
2007-02-16 14:14 ` Jesper Juhl
2007-02-17 2:59 ` David Schwartz
2007-02-17 6:32 ` Alexandre Oliva
2007-02-17 13:27 ` David Schwartz
2007-02-17 19:29 ` Scott Preece
2007-02-17 21:15 ` Michael K. Edwards
2007-02-19 20:31 ` Alan
2007-02-19 20:20 ` Michael K. Edwards
2007-02-19 20:48 ` linux-os (Dick Johnson)
2007-02-19 21:50 ` Michael K. Edwards
2007-02-19 22:12 ` Michael Dreher
2007-02-17 21:21 ` David Schwartz
2007-02-18 4:38 ` Alexandre Oliva
2007-02-16 15:40 ` Lennart Sorensen
2007-02-16 9:12 ` Xavier Bestel
2007-02-16 9:44 ` Jon K Hellan
2007-02-16 11:41 ` Jan Engelhardt
2007-02-16 6:46 ` Miguel Ojeda
2007-02-15 19:27 ` Geert Uytterhoeven
2007-02-16 1:24 ` Scott Preece
2007-02-15 22:21 ` Jeff Garzik
2007-02-16 0:04 ` Michael K. Edwards
2007-02-16 0:37 ` Jeff Garzik
2007-02-16 2:09 ` Michael K. Edwards
2007-02-16 2:12 ` Trent Waddington
2007-02-16 4:00 ` Alexandre Oliva
2007-02-16 5:16 ` Jeff Garzik
2007-02-16 5:57 ` Alexandre Oliva
2007-02-15 22:42 ` Gene Heskett
2007-02-16 1:48 ` Scott Preece
2007-02-17 4:03 ` Michael K. Edwards
2007-02-17 4:19 ` Gene Heskett
[not found] ` <7b69d1470702151705h297c3b38g138eb0138b900aea@mail.gmail.com>
2007-02-16 2:00 ` v j
2007-02-16 6:07 ` Chris Friesen
2007-02-16 8:36 ` Martin Mares
2007-02-16 17:00 ` Matthew Frost
2007-02-16 17:52 ` Matthew Frost
2007-02-20 14:55 ` Helge Hafting
2007-02-16 0:10 ` Greg Trounson
2007-02-16 0:18 ` Lee Revell
2007-02-16 0:37 ` Greg Trounson
2007-02-16 1:58 ` Lee Revell
2007-02-16 0:58 ` Scott Preece
2007-02-18 16:42 ` Pavel Machek
2007-02-15 6:15 ` Neil Brown
2007-02-15 6:51 ` Gene Heskett
2007-02-15 6:23 ` Ben Nizette
2007-02-15 7:40 ` Nick Piggin
2007-02-15 20:56 ` David Schwartz
2007-02-15 21:53 ` Bernd Petrovitsch
2007-02-15 22:41 ` Jeff Garzik
2007-02-15 23:20 ` Bernd Petrovitsch
2007-02-15 7:36 ` Arjan van de Ven
2007-02-15 8:04 ` v j
2007-02-15 8:13 ` Arjan van de Ven
2007-02-15 8:17 ` Richard Knutsson
2007-02-15 8:40 ` v j
2007-02-15 19:36 ` Jörn Engel
2007-02-15 8:24 ` Nick Piggin
2007-02-15 11:52 ` Martin Mares
2007-02-16 4:13 ` Alexandre Oliva
2007-02-16 13:32 ` Lennart Sorensen
2007-02-15 11:54 ` Mws
2007-02-15 12:51 ` Manu Abraham
2007-02-15 14:32 ` linux-os (Dick Johnson)
2007-02-15 14:54 ` Manu Abraham
2007-02-16 8:19 ` Valdis.Kletnieks
2007-02-16 9:25 ` Bernd Petrovitsch
2007-02-16 15:33 ` Chris Friesen
2007-02-16 15:58 ` Scott Preece
2007-02-15 15:18 ` Michael K. Edwards
2007-02-15 11:06 Ihar `Philips` Filipau
[not found] <7OHci-7fx-5@gated-at.bofh.it>
[not found] ` <7OHci-7fx-3@gated-at.bofh.it>
[not found] ` <7OJnQ-24B-19@gated-at.bofh.it>
[not found] ` <7OJQP-2VO-9@gated-at.bofh.it>
2007-02-15 11:53 ` Bodo Eggert
[not found] ` <7OI8n-fp-11@gated-at.bofh.it>
[not found] ` <7OIi9-tI-11@gated-at.bofh.it>
[not found] ` <7OS7S-7tW-27@gated-at.bofh.it>
[not found] ` <7OTx3-1tH-17@gated-at.bofh.it>
2007-02-15 23:40 ` Bodo Eggert
[not found] <fa.GPbYGi2HYDPl2WlRgsq2dPbD6cM@ifi.uio.no>
[not found] ` <fa.5t0XkAtEpB2nDYFPJKUBce9BKFE@ifi.uio.no>
[not found] ` <fa.upvZMIS42lj8Tbudh1OdnbDn+Ts@ifi.uio.no>
[not found] ` <fa.821rWTmf8FgAMnDeO7b6yeUeXYg@ifi.uio.no>
[not found] ` <fa.+3hIy95KSdtolNz5kNmm6qk4FU8@ifi.uio.no>
2007-02-15 23:31 ` Robert Hancock
2007-02-16 15:29 ` linux-os (Dick Johnson)
2007-02-16 23:08 ` Robert Hancock
-- strict thread matches above, loose matches on Subject: below --
2007-04-01 12:16 devzero
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