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From: Ingo Molnar <mingo@elte.hu>
To: Linus Torvalds <torvalds@linux-foundation.org>
Cc: Jeremy Fitzhardinge <jeremy@goop.org>,
	Zachary Amsden <zach@vmware.com>,
	Thomas Gleixner <tglx@linutronix.de>,
	john stultz <johnstul@us.ibm.com>,
	akpm@linux-foundation.org, LKML <linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org>,
	Rusty Russell <rusty@rustcorp.com.au>, Andi Kleen <ak@suse.de>,
	Chris Wright <chrisw@sous-sol.org>,
	Alan Cox <alan@lxorguk.ukuu.org.uk>
Subject: Re: ABI coupling to hypervisors via CONFIG_PARAVIRT
Date: Fri, 9 Mar 2007 22:04:30 +0100	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <20070309210430.GA14905@elte.hu> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <Pine.LNX.4.64.0703091137340.10832@woody.linux-foundation.org>


* Linus Torvalds <torvalds@linux-foundation.org> wrote:

> So please
> 
>  - point out things that are badly done. [...]

the thing badly done is fundamental and it trumps any other small 
technological detail complaint i have, because it affects the 
development and maintainance model: to promise backwards compatibility 
to 4-5 different hypervisors, using separate ABIs for each. /One/ such 
ABI would be complex enough to maintain IMO.

( if there is no backwards compatibility promise then i have zero
  complaints: then paravirt_ops + the hypercall just becomes another API
  internal to Linux that we can improve at will. But that is not
  realistic: if we provide CONFIG_VMI today, people will expect to have
  CONFIG_VMI in the future too. )

as i said in the very, very first email about this topic: /one/ new ABI 
towards hypervisors should be introduced step by step, and via concensus 
across hypervisors. We should treat the hypercall ABI very similar to 
the system call ABI: the system call ABI is largely based on a concensus 
between applications.

[ i think apic_write() granularity is bad too - but that is a small
  technical issue, dwarved by the ABI issues that impact the development
  model IMO. ]

	Ingo

  parent reply	other threads:[~2007-03-09 21:05 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 37+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2007-03-09 18:02 ABI coupling to hypervisors via CONFIG_PARAVIRT Ingo Molnar
2007-03-09 18:28 ` Andi Kleen
2007-03-09 18:30 ` Linus Torvalds
2007-03-09 19:24   ` Ingo Molnar
2007-03-09 19:51     ` Linus Torvalds
2007-03-09 20:12       ` Ingo Molnar
2007-03-09 21:05         ` Jeremy Fitzhardinge
2007-03-09 21:06         ` Linus Torvalds
2007-03-09 21:36           ` Ingo Molnar
2007-03-09 21:40             ` Jeremy Fitzhardinge
2007-03-09 22:27             ` Linus Torvalds
2007-03-09 22:50               ` Ingo Molnar
2007-03-09 23:07               ` Zachary Amsden
2007-03-09 23:10             ` Ingo Molnar
2007-03-09 23:38               ` Zachary Amsden
2007-03-09 21:04       ` Ingo Molnar [this message]
2007-03-09 21:27         ` Chris Wright
2007-03-09 21:47           ` Ingo Molnar
2007-03-09 21:59             ` Jeremy Fitzhardinge
2007-03-09 22:12               ` Ingo Molnar
2007-03-09 22:30                 ` Jeremy Fitzhardinge
2007-03-09 22:10             ` Chris Wright
2007-03-09 22:24               ` Ingo Molnar
2007-03-09 22:36                 ` Jeremy Fitzhardinge
2007-03-09 23:38                   ` Ingo Molnar
2007-03-09 22:46                 ` Chris Wright
2007-03-09 23:02                   ` Ingo Molnar
2007-03-09 23:13                 ` Rik van Riel
2007-03-09 20:50     ` Jan Engelhardt
2007-03-09 22:50       ` Lee Revell
2007-03-14  8:41         ` alsa was " Pavel Machek
2007-03-14 15:59           ` Jaroslav Kysela
2007-03-15  9:03             ` Pavel Machek
2007-03-15  9:10               ` Pavel Machek
2007-03-15  9:23                 ` Zachary Amsden
2007-03-15  9:32                   ` Pavel Machek
2007-03-09 19:00 ` Chris Wright

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