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From: Al Viro <viro@ZenIV.linux.org.uk>
To: Linus Torvalds <torvalds@linux-foundation.org>
Cc: "Rafael J. Wysocki" <rjw@sisk.pl>, Willy Tarreau <w@1wt.eu>,
	David Miller <davem@davemloft.net>,
	linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org,
	Andrew Morton <akpm@linux-foundation.org>,
	Jiri Slaby <jirislaby@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!
Date: Thu, 1 May 2008 03:21:42 +0100	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <20080501022142.GP5882@ZenIV.linux.org.uk> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <alpine.LFD.1.10.0804301831330.5994@woody.linux-foundation.org>

On Wed, Apr 30, 2008 at 06:40:39PM -0700, Linus Torvalds wrote:

> Now, we do know that open-source code tends to be higher quality (along a 
> number of metrics) than closed source code, and my argument is that it's 
> not because of bike-shedding (aka code review), but simply because the 
> code is out there and available and visible.
 
Really?  And how, pray tell, being out there will magically improve the
code?  "With enough eyes all bugs are shallow" stuff out of ESR's arse?

FWIW, after the last month's flamefests I decided to actually do something
about review density of code in the areas I'm theoretically responsible
for.  Namely, do systematic review of core data structure handling (starting
with the place where most of the codepaths get into VFS - descriptor tables
and struct file), doing both blow-by-blow writeup on how that sort of things
is done and documentation of the life cycle/locking rules/assertions made
by code/etc.  I made one bad mistake that held the things back for quite
a while - sending heads-up for one of the worse bugs found in process to
never-sufficiently-damned vendor-sec.  The last time I'm doing that, TYVM...

Anyway, I'm going to get the notes on that stuff in order and put them in
the open.  I really hope that other folks will join the fun afterwards.
The goal is to get a coherent braindump that would be sufficient for
people new to the area wanting to understand and review VFS-related code -
both in the tree and in new patches.

files_struct/fdtable handling is mostly dealt with, struct file is only
partially done - unfortunately, struct file_lock has to be dealt with
before that and it's a (predictable) nightmare.  On the other end of
things, fs_struct is not really started, vfsmount review is partially
done, dentry/superblock/inode not even touched.

Even with what little had been covered... well, let's just say that it
caught quite a few fun turds.  With typical age around 3-4 years.  And
VFS is not the messiest part of the tree...

  parent reply	other threads:[~2008-05-01  2:22 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 229+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2008-04-30  2:03 Slow DOWN, please!!! David Miller
2008-04-30  4:03 ` David Newall
2008-04-30  4:18   ` David Miller
2008-04-30 13:04     ` David Newall
2008-04-30 13:18       ` Michael Kerrisk
2008-04-30 14:51       ` Linus Torvalds
2008-04-30 18:21         ` David Newall
2008-04-30 18:27           ` Linus Torvalds
2008-04-30 18:55             ` David Newall
2008-04-30 19:08               ` Linus Torvalds
2008-04-30 19:16                 ` David Newall
2008-04-30 19:25                   ` Linus Torvalds
2008-05-01  4:31                     ` David Newall
2008-05-01  4:37                       ` David Miller
2008-05-01 13:49                       ` Lennart Sorensen
2008-05-01 15:28                       ` Kasper Sandberg
2008-05-01 17:49                         ` Russ Dill
2008-05-02  1:47                           ` Kasper Sandberg
2008-05-02  2:54                             ` Russ Dill
2008-05-02  7:01                               ` Kasper Sandberg
2008-05-02 17:34                               ` Lee Mathers (TCAFS)
2008-05-02 18:21                                 ` Andi Kleen
2008-05-02 21:34                                   ` Kasper Sandberg
2008-04-30 19:06             ` Chris Friesen
2008-04-30 19:13               ` Linus Torvalds
2008-04-30 19:22                 ` David Newall
2008-04-30 19:42                   ` Linus Torvalds
2008-04-30  7:11   ` Tarkan Erimer
2008-04-30 13:28     ` David Newall
2008-04-30 13:38       ` Mike Galbraith
2008-04-30 14:41       ` mws
2008-04-30 14:55   ` Russ Dill
2008-04-30 14:48 ` Peter Teoh
2008-04-30 19:36 ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-04-30 20:00   ` Andrew Morton
2008-04-30 20:20     ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-04-30 20:05   ` Linus Torvalds
2008-04-30 20:14     ` Linus Torvalds
2008-04-30 20:56       ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-04-30 23:34       ` Greg KH
2008-04-30 20:45     ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-04-30 21:37       ` Linus Torvalds
2008-04-30 22:23         ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-04-30 22:31           ` Linus Torvalds
2008-04-30 22:41             ` Andrew Morton
2008-04-30 23:23               ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-04-30 23:41                 ` david
2008-04-30 23:51                   ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-05-01  0:57               ` Adrian Bunk
2008-05-01  1:25                 ` Linus Torvalds
2008-05-01  2:13                   ` Adrian Bunk
2008-05-01  2:30                     ` Linus Torvalds
2008-05-01 18:54                       ` Adrian Bunk
2008-05-14 14:55                       ` Pavel Machek
2008-05-01  1:35                 ` Theodore Tso
2008-05-01 12:31               ` Tarkan Erimer
2008-05-01 15:34                 ` Stefan Richter
2008-05-02 14:05                   ` Tarkan Erimer
2008-04-30 22:46             ` Willy Tarreau
2008-04-30 22:52               ` Andrew Morton
2008-04-30 23:21                 ` Willy Tarreau
2008-04-30 23:38                   ` Chris Shoemaker
2008-04-30 23:20               ` Linus Torvalds
2008-05-01  0:42                 ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-05-01  1:19                   ` Linus Torvalds
2008-05-01  1:31                     ` Andrew Morton
2008-05-01  1:43                       ` Linus Torvalds
2008-05-01 10:59                         ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-05-01 15:26                           ` Linus Torvalds
2008-05-01 17:09                             ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-05-01 17:41                               ` Linus Torvalds
2008-05-01 18:11                                 ` Al Viro
2008-05-01 18:23                                   ` Linus Torvalds
2008-05-01 18:30                                     ` Linus Torvalds
2008-05-01 18:58                                     ` Willy Tarreau
2008-05-01 19:37                                     ` Al Viro
2008-05-01 19:58                                       ` Andrew Morton
2008-05-01 20:07                                       ` Joel Becker
2008-05-01 18:50                                 ` Willy Tarreau
2008-05-01 19:07                                   ` david
2008-05-01 19:28                                     ` Willy Tarreau
2008-05-01 19:46                                       ` david
2008-05-01 19:53                                         ` Willy Tarreau
2008-05-01 22:17                                   ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-05-01 19:39                                 ` Friedrich Göpel
2008-05-01 21:59                                 ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-05-02 12:17                                   ` Stefan Richter
2008-05-01 18:35                             ` Chris Frey
2008-05-02 13:22                               ` Enrico Weigelt
2008-05-01  1:40                     ` Linus Torvalds
2008-05-01  1:51                       ` David Miller
2008-05-01  2:01                         ` Linus Torvalds
2008-05-01  2:17                           ` David Miller
2008-05-01  2:21                       ` Al Viro [this message]
2008-05-01  5:19                         ` david
2008-05-04  3:26                         ` Rene Herman
2008-05-01  2:31                       ` Nigel Cunningham
2008-05-01 18:32                         ` Stephen Clark
2008-05-01  3:53                       ` Frans Pop
2008-05-01 11:38                       ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-04-30 14:28                         ` Arjan van de Ven
2008-05-01 12:41                           ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-04-30 15:06                             ` Arjan van de Ven
2008-05-01  5:50                     ` Willy Tarreau
2008-05-01 11:53                       ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-05-01 12:11                         ` Will Newton
2008-05-01 13:16                         ` Bartlomiej Zolnierkiewicz
2008-05-01 13:53                           ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-05-01 14:35                             ` Bartlomiej Zolnierkiewicz
2008-05-01 15:29                           ` Ray Lee
2008-05-01 19:03                             ` Willy Tarreau
2008-05-01 19:36                         ` Valdis.Kletnieks
2008-05-01  1:30                 ` Jeremy Fitzhardinge
2008-05-01  5:35                   ` Willy Tarreau
2008-04-30 23:03             ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-04-30 22:40           ` david
2008-04-30 23:45             ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-04-30 23:57               ` david
2008-05-01  0:01                 ` Chris Shoemaker
2008-05-01  0:14                   ` david
2008-05-01  0:38                     ` Linus Torvalds
2008-05-01  1:39                       ` Jeremy Fitzhardinge
2008-05-01  0:38               ` Adrian Bunk
2008-05-01  0:56                 ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-05-01  1:25                   ` Adrian Bunk
2008-05-01 12:05                     ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-05-01 13:54       ` Stefan Richter
2008-05-01 14:06         ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-04-30 23:29     ` Paul Mackerras
2008-05-01  1:57       ` Jeff Garzik
2008-05-01  2:52         ` Frans Pop
2008-05-01  3:47       ` Linus Torvalds
2008-05-01  4:17         ` Jeff Garzik
2008-05-01  4:46           ` Linus Torvalds
2008-05-04 13:47             ` Krzysztof Halasa
2008-05-04 15:05               ` Jacek Luczak
2008-05-01  9:17           ` Alan Cox
2008-04-30 20:15   ` Andrew Morton
2008-04-30 20:31     ` Linus Torvalds
2008-04-30 20:47       ` Dan Noe
2008-04-30 20:59         ` Andrew Morton
2008-04-30 21:30           ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-04-30 21:37             ` Andrew Morton
2008-04-30 22:08             ` Linus Torvalds
2008-04-30 22:53           ` Mariusz Kozlowski
2008-04-30 23:11             ` Andrew Morton
2008-05-12  9:27               ` Ben Dooks
2008-05-02 10:20             ` Andi Kleen
2008-05-02 15:33               ` Mariusz Kozlowski
2008-04-30 20:54       ` Andrew Morton
2008-04-30 21:21         ` David Miller
2008-04-30 21:47           ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-04-30 22:02           ` Dmitri Vorobiev
2008-04-30 22:19           ` Ingo Molnar
2008-04-30 22:22             ` David Miller
2008-04-30 22:39               ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-04-30 22:54                 ` david
2008-04-30 23:12                 ` Willy Tarreau
2008-04-30 23:59                   ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-05-01  0:15                   ` Chris Shoemaker
2008-05-01  5:09                     ` Willy Tarreau
2008-04-30 22:35             ` Ingo Molnar
2008-04-30 22:49               ` Andrew Morton
2008-04-30 22:51               ` David Miller
2008-05-01  1:40                 ` Ingo Molnar
2008-05-01  2:48                 ` Adrian Bunk
2008-05-05  3:04             ` Rusty Russell
2008-05-02 13:37           ` Helge Hafting
2008-04-30 21:42         ` Dmitri Vorobiev
2008-04-30 22:06           ` Jiri Slaby
2008-04-30 22:10           ` Andrew Morton
2008-04-30 22:19             ` Linus Torvalds
2008-04-30 22:28               ` Dmitri Vorobiev
2008-05-01 16:26                 ` Diego Calleja
2008-05-01 16:31                   ` Dmitri Vorobiev
2008-05-02  1:48                   ` Stephen Rothwell
2008-05-01 23:06               ` Kevin Winchester
2008-04-30 23:04             ` Dmitri Vorobiev
2008-05-01 15:19               ` Jim Schutt
2008-05-01  6:15             ` Jan Engelhardt
2008-05-09  9:28         ` Jiri Kosina
2008-05-09 15:00           ` Jeff Garzik
2008-04-30 21:52       ` H. Peter Anvin
2008-05-01  3:24         ` Bob Tracy
2008-05-01 16:39         ` Valdis.Kletnieks
2008-05-01  0:31       ` RFC: starting a kernel-testers group for newbies Adrian Bunk
2008-04-30  7:03         ` Arjan van de Ven
2008-05-01  8:13           ` Andrew Morton
2008-04-30 14:15             ` Arjan van de Ven
2008-05-01 12:42               ` David Woodhouse
2008-04-30 15:02                 ` Arjan van de Ven
2008-05-05 10:03                 ` Benny Halevy
2008-05-04 12:45               ` Rene Herman
2008-05-04 13:00                 ` Pekka Enberg
2008-05-04 13:19                   ` Rene Herman
2008-05-05 13:13                   ` crosscompiler [WAS: RFC: starting a kernel-testers group for newbies] Enrico Weigelt
2008-05-01  9:16             ` RFC: starting a kernel-testers group for newbies Frans Pop
2008-05-01 10:30               ` Enrico Weigelt
2008-05-01 13:02                 ` Adrian Bunk
2008-05-01 11:30           ` Adrian Bunk
2008-04-30 14:20             ` Arjan van de Ven
2008-05-01 12:53               ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-05-01 13:21               ` Adrian Bunk
2008-05-01 15:49                 ` Andrew Morton
2008-05-01  1:13                   ` Arjan van de Ven
2008-05-02  9:00                     ` Adrian Bunk
2008-05-01 16:38                   ` Steven Rostedt
2008-05-01 17:18                     ` Andrew Morton
2008-05-01 17:24                   ` Theodore Tso
2008-05-01 19:26                     ` Andrew Morton
2008-05-01 19:39                       ` Steven Rostedt
2008-05-02 10:23                       ` Andi Kleen
2008-05-02  2:08                 ` Paul Mackerras
2008-05-02  3:10                   ` Josh Boyer
2008-05-02  4:09                     ` Paul Mackerras
2008-05-02  8:29                       ` Adrian Bunk
2008-05-02 10:16                         ` Paul Mackerras
2008-05-02 11:58                           ` Adrian Bunk
2008-05-02 14:58                         ` Linus Torvalds
2008-05-02 15:44                           ` Carlos R. Mafra
2008-05-02 16:28                             ` Linus Torvalds
2008-05-02 17:15                               ` Carlos R. Mafra
2008-05-02 18:02                                 ` Pallipadi, Venkatesh
2008-05-09 16:32                                   ` Mark Lord
2008-05-09 19:30                                     ` Carlos R. Mafra
2008-05-09 20:39                                       ` Mark Lord
2008-05-01  0:41         ` David Miller
2008-05-01 13:23           ` Adrian Bunk
  -- strict thread matches above, loose matches on Subject: below --
2008-04-30 20:59 Slow DOWN, please!!! devzero

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