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From: David Woodhouse <dwmw2@infradead.org>
To: esr@thyrsus.com
Cc: Arjan van de Ven <arjanv@redhat.com>, linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org
Subject: Re: Background to the argument about CML2 design philosophy
Date: Sun, 20 May 2001 21:59:39 +0100	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <22842.990392379@redhat.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <20010520164700.H4488@thyrsus.com>
In-Reply-To: <20010520164700.H4488@thyrsus.com>  <20010518112625.A14309@thyrsus.com> <20010518113726.A29617@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <20010518114922.C14309@thyrsus.com> <8485.990357599@redhat.com> <20010520111856.C3431@thyrsus.com> <15823.990372866@redhat.com> <20010520114411.A3600@thyrsus.com> <16267.990374170@redhat.com> <20010520131457.A3769@thyrsus.com> <18686.990380851@redhat.com>



esr@thyrsus.com said:
>  I'm nervous that if we go down this path we will end up with a
> thicket of modes and a combinatorial explosion in ruleset complexity,
> leading immediately to a user configuration experience that is more
> complex than necessary, and eventually to an unmaintainable mess in
> the rulesfiles.

Having too many such modes would be a horrible mess, I agree.

> In order to prevent that happening, I would like to have some
> recognized criterion for configuration cases that are so perverse that
> it is a  net loss to accept the additional complexity of handling them
> within the configurator.

> A lot of people (including, apparently, you) are saying there are no
> such cases.  I wonder if you'll change your minds when you have to
> handle the overhead yourselves? 

Of course there are such cases. The criterion is that the code does not 
compile or if it did, it could never be expected to work - like SCSI drivers
without SCSI generic, or PCI devices without CONFIG_PCI.

This is the major criterion which has defined the dependencies already in 
the config files.

You want to add a new mode which hides some of the more esoteric options. 
That's fine. So do so, and then we have two modes. It's still not an 
unmaintainable mess. 

If having even two modes is going to be too troublesome, then keep the one
we have. You can try to simplify it later by encouraging individual
maintainers to hide stuff behind CONFIG_*_ADVANCED options. But keep that
strictly separate from the CML2 discussion.

--
dwmw2



  parent reply	other threads:[~2001-05-20 21:00 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 160+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2001-05-05 23:27 CML2 design philosophy heads-up Eric S. Raymond
2001-05-06 12:58 ` Alan Cox
2001-05-07 17:59   ` Tom Rini
2001-05-07 21:57     ` Alan Cox
2001-05-08  9:44       ` Eric S. Raymond
2001-05-08 12:42       ` Helge Hafting
2001-05-08  1:31     ` Eric S. Raymond
2001-05-08  1:43       ` Tom Rini
2001-05-08  1:56         ` Eric S. Raymond
2001-05-08  6:57           ` David Weinehall
2001-05-08  7:00             ` Eric S. Raymond
2001-05-08  6:59           ` Jamie Lokier
2001-05-08  7:15             ` Eric S. Raymond
2001-05-08 14:15               ` Rogier Wolff
2001-05-13 14:22 ` Jes Sorensen
2001-05-13 15:25   ` Eric S. Raymond
2001-05-15 14:43     ` Pavel Machek
2001-05-17  7:26       ` Eric S. Raymond
2001-05-17  7:47         ` Keith Owens
2001-05-17  9:35           ` Michael Meissner
2001-05-17 16:34             ` Tom Rini
2001-05-18  7:43               ` Eric S. Raymond
2001-05-18  8:20                 ` Alan Cox
2001-05-18 14:53                   ` Eric S. Raymond
2001-05-18 14:06                     ` David Lang
2001-05-18 15:09                     ` Keith Owens
2001-05-18 15:19                       ` Arjan van de Ven
2001-05-18 15:39                       ` Alan Cox
2001-05-18 15:58                         ` [kbuild-devel] " Eric S. Raymond
2001-05-18 16:01                           ` Alan Cox
2001-05-18 16:34                             ` Eric S. Raymond
2001-05-18 16:43                               ` Christoph Hellwig
2001-05-18 16:45                               ` Arjan van de Ven
2001-05-18 17:17                                 ` Eric S. Raymond
2001-05-18 17:22                                   ` Arjan van de Ven
2001-05-18 17:25                                     ` Eric S. Raymond
2001-05-19  5:54                                 ` Ben Ford
2001-05-18 17:33                               ` Alan Cox
2001-05-18 18:25                                 ` Eric S. Raymond
2001-05-18 19:13                                   ` Alan Cox
2001-05-18 19:44                                     ` Eric S. Raymond
2001-05-18 20:38                                       ` Alan Cox
2001-05-19  1:49                               ` Aaron Lehmann
2001-05-18 19:12                       ` Jes Sorensen
2001-05-18 15:11                     ` Arjan van de Ven
2001-05-18 15:26                       ` Eric S. Raymond
2001-05-18 15:34                         ` Charles Cazabon
2001-05-18 14:30                           ` David Lang
2001-05-18 15:47                             ` Charles Cazabon
2001-05-18 15:42                           ` Alan Cox
2001-05-19  5:44                           ` Ben Ford
     [not found]                           ` <mailman.990252541.15890.linux-kernel2news@redhat.com>
2001-05-19  6:40                             ` Pete Zaitcev
2001-05-19 10:10                               ` Ben Ford
2001-05-19 10:55                                 ` Arjan van de Ven
2001-05-19 16:13                                 ` Alan Cox
2001-05-19 21:54                                   ` Ben Ford
2001-05-20  0:08                                     ` Alan Cox
2001-05-18 15:37                         ` Arjan van de Ven
2001-05-18 15:49                           ` Eric S. Raymond
2001-05-18 16:16                             ` Arjan van de Ven
2001-05-18 17:04                               ` Eric S. Raymond
2001-05-20 11:19                           ` David Woodhouse
2001-05-20 15:18                             ` Eric S. Raymond
2001-05-20 15:34                               ` Keith Owens
2001-05-20 15:34                             ` David Woodhouse
2001-05-20 15:44                               ` Eric S. Raymond
2001-05-20 15:56                               ` David Woodhouse
2001-05-20 17:14                                 ` Background to the argument about CML2 design philosophy Eric S. Raymond
2001-05-21  0:45                                   ` Jes Sorensen
2001-05-21  9:14                                   ` Helge Hafting
2001-05-21 11:32                                   ` Jonathan Morton
2001-05-22 20:38                                     ` Eric S. Raymond
2001-05-21 12:15                                   ` David Woodhouse
2001-05-21 12:31                                     ` Alan Cox
2001-05-21 23:11                                     ` Jonathan Morton
2001-05-20 17:47                                 ` David Woodhouse
2001-05-20 20:47                                   ` Eric S. Raymond
2001-05-20 20:59                                     ` Arjan van de Ven
2001-05-20 21:10                                     ` Robert M. Love
2001-05-21  3:38                                       ` Nicolas Pitre
2001-05-20 22:51                                     ` David Woodhouse
2001-05-21  1:13                                       ` Eric S. Raymond
2001-05-21  6:41                                       ` David Woodhouse
2001-05-21 10:04                                         ` Eric S. Raymond
2001-05-21 11:05                                         ` David Woodhouse
2001-05-21 20:38                                       ` John Stoffel
2001-05-22  0:59                                         ` Keith Owens
2001-05-22  9:24                                           ` Daniel Phillips
2001-05-23  1:51                                             ` Keith Owens
2001-05-21 23:00                                       ` Jonathan Morton
2001-05-22 13:45                                       ` David Woodhouse
2001-05-22 16:21                                         ` John Stoffel
2001-05-22 17:17                                         ` David Woodhouse
2001-05-21  3:33                                     ` Nicolas Pitre
2001-05-20 20:59                                   ` David Woodhouse [this message]
2001-05-20 18:31                                 ` Jonathan Morton
2001-05-20 20:13                                   ` Eric S. Raymond
2001-05-18 15:59                       ` CML2 design philosophy heads-up Jonathan Morton
2001-05-18 16:17                         ` Eric S. Raymond
2001-05-18 17:35                         ` Mike Galbraith
2001-05-18 20:03                           ` Alan Cox
2001-05-18 17:07                       ` Daniel Phillips
2001-05-18 15:38                     ` Alan Cox
2001-05-18 16:04                       ` Eric S. Raymond
2001-05-18 16:09                         ` [kbuild-devel] " Christoph Hellwig
2001-05-18 16:43                           ` Michael Meissner
2001-05-18 17:13                             ` Arjan van de Ven
2001-05-18 17:22                             ` Eric S. Raymond
2001-05-18 17:42                               ` Christoph Hellwig
2001-05-18 17:42                                 ` Alan Cox
2001-05-18 18:28                                 ` John Cowan
2001-05-18 17:23                         ` Alan Cox
2001-05-18 17:41                           ` Eric S. Raymond
2001-05-18 15:54                     ` Christer Weinigel
2001-05-18 16:02                     ` [kbuild-devel] " Kai Germaschewski
2001-05-18 19:12                 ` frank
2001-05-15 20:32     ` Jes Sorensen
2001-05-15 21:33       ` Eric S. Raymond
2001-05-18 15:19         ` Jes Sorensen
2001-05-18 15:37           ` Justin Carlson
2001-05-18 15:42           ` Eric S. Raymond
2001-05-18 15:53             ` Alan Cox
2001-05-18 15:51           ` [kbuild-devel] " John Cowan
2001-05-18 15:58             ` Christoph Hellwig
2001-05-18 16:00               ` John Cowan
2001-05-18 17:15                 ` Mike Castle
2001-05-18 17:28                   ` Christoph Hellwig
2001-05-21  0:29             ` Jes Sorensen
2001-05-21  1:58               ` Mike Castle
2001-05-21  6:33                 ` Ben Ford
2001-05-21  9:55                   ` Jes Sorensen
2001-05-21 16:59                   ` Mike Castle
2001-05-21 17:03                     ` Alan Cox
2001-05-21  7:21                 ` arjan
2001-05-21  2:10               ` Robert M. Love
2001-05-21  2:35                 ` Jakob Østergaard
2001-05-21  5:01                   ` Mike Galbraith
2001-05-21  9:58                   ` Jes Sorensen
2001-05-21 15:36                     ` Tom Rini
2001-05-21 16:24                       ` Eric S. Raymond
2001-05-21  6:11                 ` Mike A. Harris
2001-05-21 12:08                   ` Robert M. Love
2001-05-21 12:29                     ` Alan Cox
2001-05-21 16:39                       ` Brent D. Norris
2001-05-21 17:48                         ` Eric S. Raymond
2001-05-21 15:18                   ` Wichert Akkerman
2001-05-21 15:21                     ` Alan Cox
2001-05-21 15:52                     ` Alexander Viro
2001-05-21  3:47               ` Nicolas Pitre
2001-05-18 16:22           ` Steven Cole
     [not found]   ` <0105210958040I.10237@spc.esa.lanl.gov>
     [not found]     ` <20010521090130.F9965@opus.bloom.county>
2001-05-21 16:13       ` Steven Cole
2001-05-18 17:10 ` Ruth Ivimey-Cook
  -- strict thread matches above, loose matches on Subject: below --
2001-05-21  3:01 Background to the argument about CML2 design philosophy Ben Bridgwater
2001-05-21 17:36 Wayne.Brown
2001-05-21 17:58 ` Eric S. Raymond
2001-05-21 20:00   ` Urban Widmark
2001-05-22  2:42     ` Eric S. Raymond
2001-05-22 14:42     ` john slee
2001-05-22 17:28       ` Daniel Phillips
2001-05-21 19:05 Wayne.Brown

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