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From: curtis@integratus.com
To: Anton Altaparmakov <aia21@cam.ac.uk>
Cc: Hans Reiser <reiser@namesys.com>, Nathan Scott <nathans@sgi.com>,
	Andreas Gruenbacher <ag@bestbits.at>,
	linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org, linux-fsdevel@vger.kernel.org,
	linux-xfs@oss.sgi.com
Subject: Re: reiser4 (was Re: [PATCH] Revised extended attributesinterface)
Date: Tue, 11 Dec 2001 12:14:24 -0800	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <3C166920.77F644F@integratus.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <20011205143209.C44610@wobbly.melbourne.sgi.com> <20011207202036.J2274@redhat.com> <20011208155841.A56289@wobbly.melbourne.sgi.com> <3C127551.90305@namesys.com> <20011211134213.G70201@wobbly.melbourne.sgi.com> <5.1.0.14.2.20011211184721.04adc9d0@pop.cus.cam.ac.uk>

I know I'm stepping into a minefield, but I just can't help putting in
my 2 pennies.  :-)

Anton Altaparmakov wrote:
> At 12:02 11/12/01, Hans Reiser wrote:
> >What would have happened if set theory had not just sets and elements, but
> >sets, elements, extended-attributes, and streams, and you could not use
> >the same operators on streams that you use on elements?  It would have
> >been crap as a theoretical model.  It does real damage when you add things
> >that require different operators to the set of primitives. Closure is
> >extremely important to design.  Don't do this.
> 
> Since we are going into analogies: You don't use a hammer to affix a screw
> and neither do you use a screwdriver to affix a nail...at least I don't. I
> think you are trying to use a large sledge hammer to put together things
> which do not fit together thus breaking them in the process. To use your
> own words: Don't do this. (-; Each is distinct and should be treated as
> such. </me ducks>

I agree with Anton.  Files have certain characteristics that we all
know and love, stream-style attributes have pretty-much those same
characteristics.  IMHO, we would like EAs to have a different set of
characteristics so that the application programmer has different tools
in her toolbox.  To continue the analogy: "if all you have is a hammer,
everything looks like a nail".  Give someone that _already has_ a hammer
a screwdriver and they will be confused for a while but will end up
happier than if you gave them a "better hammer".

Thanks,

	Curtis

-- 
Curtis Anderson						curtis@integratus.com

  reply	other threads:[~2001-12-11 20:17 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 57+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2001-12-05  3:32 [PATCH] Revised extended attributes interface Nathan Scott
2001-12-05  9:08 ` Anton Altaparmakov
2001-12-06  5:46   ` Nathan Scott
2001-12-06  3:05 ` Daniel Phillips
2001-12-06  5:41   ` Nathan Scott
2001-12-06 15:25     ` Daniel Phillips
2001-12-06 23:15       ` Nathan Scott
2001-12-07  1:45         ` Daniel Phillips
2001-12-07  2:03         ` Daniel Phillips
2001-12-07  3:51           ` Nathan Scott
2001-12-07 20:20 ` Stephen C. Tweedie
2001-12-08  4:58   ` Nathan Scott
2001-12-08 20:17     ` Hans Reiser
2001-12-11  2:42       ` reiser4 (was Re: [PATCH] Revised extended attributes interface) Nathan Scott
2001-12-11 12:02         ` Hans Reiser
2001-12-11 19:23         ` Anton Altaparmakov
2001-12-11 20:14           ` curtis [this message]
2001-12-11 21:34             ` reiser4 (was Re: [PATCH] Revised extended attributesinterface) Hans Reiser
2001-12-11 23:04               ` curtis
2001-12-11 23:28                 ` Hans Reiser
2001-12-11 23:46                   ` Anton Altaparmakov
2001-12-12  1:00                   ` curtis
2001-12-11 21:21           ` reiser4 (was Re: [PATCH] Revised extended attributes interface) Hans Reiser
2001-12-11 23:33             ` Anton Altaparmakov
2001-12-11 23:59               ` Hans Reiser
2001-12-12  2:16                 ` Anton Altaparmakov
2001-12-12 12:02                   ` Hans Reiser
2001-12-12 13:34                   ` Anton Altaparmakov
2001-12-12 15:40                     ` Hans Reiser
2001-12-13  1:43             ` Andrew Pimlott
2001-12-13  9:23               ` Hans Reiser
2001-12-13 10:36                 ` User-manageable sub-ids proposals Romano Giannetti
2001-12-13 13:37                   ` Ragnar Kjørstad
2001-12-13 16:06                     ` Romano Giannetti
2001-12-13 18:58                       ` Ragnar Kjørstad
2001-12-18  0:17                     ` Pavel Machek
2001-12-13 23:24                   ` David Wagner
2001-12-21 21:28                   ` Andreas Ferber
2001-12-13 15:27                 ` reiser4 (was Re: [PATCH] Revised extended attributes interface) Andrew Pimlott
2001-12-13 20:47                   ` Hans Reiser
2001-12-13 21:01                 ` Anton Altaparmakov
2001-12-10 11:52     ` [PATCH] Revised extended attributes interface Stephen C. Tweedie
2001-12-10 15:00       ` Peter J. Braam
2001-12-10 15:56         ` Stephen C. Tweedie
2001-12-10 16:00           ` Mr. James W. Laferriere
2001-12-10 16:15             ` Stephen C. Tweedie
2001-12-10 19:01             ` John Stoffel
2001-12-11  1:22       ` Timothy Shimmin
2001-12-11 11:33         ` Stephen C. Tweedie
2001-12-11 13:30         ` Implementing POSIX ACLs - was: " Anton Altaparmakov
2001-12-11 14:34           ` Stephen C. Tweedie
2001-12-11 15:15           ` Anton Altaparmakov
2001-12-11  1:41       ` Nathan Scott
2001-12-11 13:47         ` Stephen C. Tweedie
2001-12-11 18:23           ` Hans Reiser
2001-12-11 18:46           ` Anton Altaparmakov
2001-12-11 23:37           ` Implementing POSIX ACLs - was " Nathan Scott

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