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From: Dan Kegel <dank@kegel.com>
To: Bill Huey <billh@tierra.ucsd.edu>
Cc: Alan Cox <alan@lxorguk.ukuu.org.uk>,
	"David S. Miller" <davem@redhat.com>,
	bcrl@redhat.com, torvalds@transmeta.com,
	linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org, linux-aio@kvack.org
Subject: Re: aio
Date: Sat, 22 Dec 2001 22:34:48 -0800	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <3C257B08.C4848C76@kegel.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <20011219.172046.08320763.davem@redhat.com> <E16HTTI-0000w0-00@the-village.bc.nu> <20011222214630.B12352@burn.ucsd.edu>

Bill Huey wrote:
> > There we agree. Things like the current asynch/thread mess in java are
> > partly poor design of language and greatly stupid design of JVM.
> 
> It's not the fault of the JVM runtime nor the the language per se since
> both are excellent. The blame should instead be placed on the political
> process within Sun, which has created a lag in getting a decent IO event
> model/system available in the form of an API.
> 
> This newer system is suppose to be able to scale to tens of thousands of
> FDs and be able to handle heavy duty server side stuff in a more graceful
> manner. It's a reasonable system from what I saw, but the implementation
> of it is highly OS dependent and will be subject to those environmental
> constraints. Couple this and the HotSpot compiler (supposeablly competitive
> with gcc's -O3 from benchmarks) and it should be high useable for a broad
> range of of server side work when intelligently engineered.

I served on JSR-51, the expert group that helped design the new I/O
model.  (The design was Sun's, but we had quite a bit of input.)
For network I/O, there's a Selector object which is essentially
a nice OO wrapper around the /dev/poll or kqueue/kevent abstraction.
Selector does have a distinctly Unixy feel to it, but it can probably
be implemented well on top of any reasonable OS; I'm quite sure
it can be expressed fairly well in terms of Windows NT's asych I/O
or Linux's rt signal stuff.  

(I suspect the initial Linux implementations will just use poll(),
but that's something the Blackdown team can fix.  And heck, it
ought to be easy to implement it on top of all the nifty poll
replacements and choose between them at jvm startup time without
any noticable overhead.)

- Dan

p.s. Davide, I didn't forget /dev/epoll, I just haven't had time to
post Poller_devepoll yet!

  reply	other threads:[~2001-12-23  6:32 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 101+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
     [not found] <20011218020456.A11541@redhat.com>
2001-12-18 16:50 ` Scheduler ( was: Just a second ) Linus Torvalds
2001-12-18 16:56   ` Rik van Riel
2001-12-18 17:18     ` Linus Torvalds
2001-12-18 19:04       ` Alan Cox
2001-12-18 21:02         ` Larry McVoy
2001-12-18 21:14           ` David S. Miller
2001-12-18 21:17             ` Larry McVoy
2001-12-18 21:19               ` Rik van Riel
2001-12-18 21:30               ` David S. Miller
2001-12-18 21:18           ` Rik van Riel
2001-12-19 17:44           ` IRC (was: Scheduler) Daniel Phillips
2001-12-19 17:51             ` Larry McVoy
2001-12-19 18:24               ` Daniel Phillips
2001-12-19 18:19             ` M. Edward (Ed) Borasky
2001-12-19 18:27               ` Daniel Phillips
2001-12-19 18:40               ` J Sloan
2001-12-19 16:50         ` Scheduler ( was: Just a second ) Daniel Phillips
     [not found]           ` <Pine.LNX.4.33.0112190859050.1872-100000@penguin.transmeta.com>
2001-12-19 18:57             ` aio Ben LaHaise
2001-12-19 19:29               ` aio Dan Kegel
2001-12-20  4:04                 ` aio Benjamin LaHaise
2001-12-19 20:09               ` aio Daniel Phillips
2001-12-19 20:21               ` aio Davide Libenzi
     [not found]               ` <mailman.1008792601.3391.linux-kernel2news@redhat.com>
2001-12-19 20:23                 ` aio Pete Zaitcev
2001-12-20  0:13               ` aio David S. Miller
2001-12-20  0:21                 ` aio Benjamin LaHaise
2001-12-20  0:36                   ` aio Andrew Morton
2001-12-20  0:55                     ` aio H. Peter Anvin
2001-12-20  0:47                   ` aio Davide Libenzi
2001-12-20  1:16                 ` aio Bill Huey
2001-12-20  1:20                   ` aio David S. Miller
2001-12-20  2:26                     ` aio Bill Huey
2001-12-20  2:45                       ` aio David S. Miller
2001-12-19 18:57                         ` aio John Heil
2001-12-20  3:06                           ` aio David S. Miller
2001-12-19 19:30                             ` aio John Heil
2001-12-20  5:29                               ` aio David S. Miller
2001-12-20  3:21                             ` aio Bill Huey
2001-12-27  9:36                               ` aio Martin Dalecki
2001-12-20  3:07                         ` aio Bill Huey
2001-12-20  3:13                           ` aio David S. Miller
2001-12-20  3:47                             ` aio Benjamin LaHaise
2001-12-20  5:39                               ` aio David S. Miller
2001-12-20  5:58                                 ` aio Benjamin LaHaise
2001-12-20  6:00                                   ` aio David S. Miller
2001-12-20  6:46                                     ` aio Mike Castle
2001-12-20  6:55                                       ` aio Robert Love
2001-12-20  7:13                                         ` aio Mike Castle
2001-12-20  7:01                                       ` aio David S. Miller
2001-12-20  7:27                                 ` aio Daniel Phillips
     [not found]                                 ` <Pine.LNX.4.33.0112201127400.2656-100000@localhost.localdomain>
2001-12-20 11:49                                   ` aio William Lee Irwin III
2001-12-20 16:32                                   ` aio Dan Kegel
2001-12-20 18:05                                     ` aio Davide Libenzi
2001-12-20 21:45                                   ` aio Lincoln Dale
2001-12-20 21:59                                     ` aio Linus Torvalds
2001-12-24 11:44                                       ` aio Gerold Jury
2001-12-20 23:02                                     ` aio Lincoln Dale
2001-12-21 17:24                               ` aio Alan Cox
2001-12-21 17:16                                 ` aio Benjamin LaHaise
2001-12-23  5:35                                   ` aio Bill Huey
2001-12-20 14:38                             ` aio Luigi Genoni
2001-12-20 17:26                             ` aio Henning Schmiedehausen
2001-12-20 20:04                               ` aio M. Edward (Ed) Borasky
2001-12-20 23:53                               ` aio David S. Miller
2001-12-21  0:28                                 ` Offtopic Java/C# [Re: aio] Bill Huey
     [not found]                         ` <mailman.1008817860.10606.linux-kernel2news@redhat.com>
2001-12-20  5:16                           ` aio Pete Zaitcev
2001-12-20 16:16                         ` aio Dan Kegel
2001-12-21 11:44                           ` aio Gerold Jury
2001-12-21 13:48                             ` aio Ingo Molnar
2001-12-21 15:27                               ` aio Gerold Jury
2001-12-24 11:08                                 ` aio Gerold Jury
2001-12-20 17:24                         ` aio Henning Schmiedehausen
2001-12-20  2:37                     ` aio Cameron Simpson
2001-12-20  2:47                       ` aio David S. Miller
2001-12-20  2:52                         ` aio Cameron Simpson
2001-12-20  2:58                           ` aio David S. Miller
2001-12-20  5:47                             ` aio Linus Torvalds
2001-12-20  5:57                               ` aio David S. Miller
2001-12-20  5:59                                 ` aio Benjamin LaHaise
2001-12-20  6:02                                   ` aio David S. Miller
2001-12-20  6:07                                     ` aio Benjamin LaHaise
2001-12-20  6:12                                       ` aio David S. Miller
2001-12-20  6:23                                         ` aio Linus Torvalds
2001-12-20 10:18                                           ` aio Ingo Molnar
2001-12-20 18:20                                             ` aio Robert Love
2001-12-20 22:30                                               ` aio Cameron Simpson
2001-12-20 22:46                                                 ` aio Benjamin LaHaise
2001-12-20  6:09                                     ` aio Linus Torvalds
2001-12-20 17:28                                       ` aio Suparna Bhattacharya
     [not found]                     ` <mailman.1008816001.10138.linux-kernel2news@redhat.com>
2001-12-20  5:07                       ` aio Pete Zaitcev
2001-12-20  5:10                         ` aio Cameron Simpson
2001-12-21 17:28                     ` aio Alan Cox
2001-12-23  5:46                       ` aio Bill Huey
2001-12-23  6:34                         ` Dan Kegel [this message]
2001-12-23 18:43                           ` aio Davide Libenzi
2001-12-26 20:42                         ` Java and Flam^H^H^H^H AIO (was: aio) Daniel Phillips
2001-12-18 19:11       ` Scheduler ( was: Just a second ) Mike Galbraith
2001-12-18 19:15       ` Rik van Riel
2001-12-18 22:32         ` in defense of the linux-kernel mailing list Ingo Molnar
2001-12-18 17:55   ` Scheduler ( was: Just a second ) Davide Libenzi
2001-12-18 19:43   ` Alexander Viro
2001-12-20  2:56 aio Mikael Pettersson

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