From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org via listexpand id S261270AbTLHTEa (ORCPT ); Mon, 8 Dec 2003 14:04:30 -0500 Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org id S261276AbTLHTEa (ORCPT ); Mon, 8 Dec 2003 14:04:30 -0500 Received: from k-kdom.nishanet.com ([65.125.12.2]:36362 "EHLO mail2k.k-kdom.nishanet.com") by vger.kernel.org with ESMTP id S261270AbTLHTE2 (ORCPT ); Mon, 8 Dec 2003 14:04:28 -0500 Message-ID: <3FD4CF90.3000905@nishanet.com> Date: Mon, 08 Dec 2003 14:22:56 -0500 From: Bob User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.5) Gecko/20031014 Thunderbird/0.3 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: linux-kernel Subject: dialectical deprecation Re: cdrecord hangs my computer References: <3FD1994C.10607@stinkfoot.org><20031206084032.A3438@animx.eu.org> <20031206220227.GA19016@work.bitmover.com> <20031207110122.GB13844@zombie.inka.de> <1201390000.1070900656@[10.10.2.4]> In-Reply-To: <1201390000.1070900656@[10.10.2.4]> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: linux-kernel-owner@vger.kernel.org X-Mailing-List: linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org Martin J. Bligh wrote: >>In contrast, the old cdrecord interfaces are an UNBELIEVABLE PILE OF CRAP! >>It's an interface that is based on some random hardware layout mechanism >>that isn't even TRUE any more, and hasn't been true for a long time. It's >>not helpful to the user, and it doesn't match how devices are accessed by >>everything else on the system. >> >>It's bad from a technical standpoint (anybody who names a generic device >>with a flat namespace is just basically clueless), and it's bad from a >>usability standpoint. It has _zero_ redeeming qualities. >> >> > >I think the appropriate phrase is "user malevolent" software. Making >the user interface fit some arcane technica rather than the user is >rather tragic. Reality is quite complicated enough as it is, without >deliberately setting out to make it more so. > >M. > > Today I realize that it's not double deprecation, it's dialectical deprecation, for a user who gets caught between the deprecation of ide-scsi and cdrecord targbuslun "flat" naming and then the cdrecord error message when trying to use a full devpath. The user's head is volleyed back and forth as cdrecord maintains its "denial". cdrecord whines about the full devpath in the first instance, will not work if I use 1,0,0 in both places, but seems to catch a clue about the devpath stub from the first instance in order to use its 1,0,0 nomenclature below that. #/etc/default/cdrecord CDR_DEVICE=ATAPI:/dev/scsi/host1/bus0/target0/lun0/generic #ATAPI:1,0,0 won't work in CDR_DEVICE, but... yamaha= ATAPI:1,0,0 -1 -1 "" I'm scared(under-informed) to drop ide-scsi since I'm using 3ware and don't know if just scsi-generic would be enough for that hd controller(needs ide-scsi? 3ware's site doc is not easy to find). -Bob