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From: Bill Davidsen <davidsen@tmr.com>
To: Trond Myklebust <trond.myklebust@fys.uio.no>
Cc: "J. Bruce Fields" <bfields@fieldses.org>,
	Theodore Tso <tytso@mit.edu>,
	Thomas Glanzmann <sithglan@stud.uni-erlangen.de>,
	LKML <linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org>
Subject: Re: ext4 features
Date: Mon, 10 Jul 2006 18:37:30 -0400	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <44B2D6AA.3090707@tmr.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <1152562135.6220.7.camel@lade.trondhjem.org>

Trond Myklebust wrote:

>On Sat, 2006-07-08 at 17:04 -0400, Bill Davidsen wrote:
>  
>
>>No, I didn't quite mean a manual touch, but a system call to "close and 
>>set time to high resolution" for files where time uniformity is 
>>important. Consider that in most cases the inodes times are set by the 
>>host machine clock, which I close the change reflects the fileserving 
>>host idea of time. If there were a call to close a file and set the 
>>times like touch, then that could be used, for both local and network files.
>>    
>>
>
>Close should never update the time since that would be a violation of
>POSIX rules. Normally, an NFS client will never need to update the time:
>RPC calls like WRITE, READ and SETATTR will automatically do it for us
>whenever necessary.
>  
>

Let me restate this a third time in another way. What I suggest is a 
system call, NOT NAMED CLOSE, which does a close and touch. This was all 
blue sky discussion, new system calls are as valid as nanosecond 
resolution and syncronization between servers. Since this is a new call 
it is not specified by POSIX.

And Linus has already suggested that he would accept something similar, 
when I proposed something like "noatime" mounts, which only updated 
atime and mtime on open and close, to keep metadata relevant but not 
have the overhead of constant updates.

Actually, now that I have more free time I may revisit that idea.

-- 
bill davidsen <davidsen@tmr.com>
  CTO TMR Associates, Inc
  Doing interesting things with small computers since 1979


  reply	other threads:[~2006-07-10 22:28 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 126+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2006-07-01 16:33 ext4 features Thomas Glanzmann
2006-07-01 17:07 ` Tomasz Torcz
2006-07-01 17:47   ` Thomas Glanzmann
2006-07-01 18:09     ` Claudio Martins
2006-07-01 18:59       ` Thomas Glanzmann
2006-07-01 18:17     ` Tomasz Torcz
2006-07-03  9:44       ` Gabor Gombas
2006-07-03 20:22       ` Helge Hafting
2006-07-03 20:55         ` Tomasz Torcz
2006-07-03 21:01           ` Arjan van de Ven
2006-07-03 21:46             ` Jeff V. Merkey
2006-07-03 21:25               ` Diego Calleja
2006-07-03 22:17                 ` Alan Cox
2006-07-04 14:45                   ` Jan Engelhardt
2006-07-04 16:35                     ` Jeffrey V. Merkey
2006-07-04 18:52                       ` Jeff Garzik
2006-07-04 19:40                         ` Jeffrey V. Merkey
2006-07-05 13:35                       ` Lew Palm
2006-07-03 23:01                 ` Jeff V. Merkey
2006-07-04  9:14                 ` Benny Amorsen
2006-07-05  4:21                   ` Bill Davidsen
2006-07-05  5:13                     ` H. Peter Anvin
2006-07-05  5:45                       ` Jeffrey V. Merkey
2006-07-07 14:12                         ` Pavel Machek
2006-07-05 10:38                       ` Krzysztof Halasa
2006-07-07 14:10                     ` Pavel Machek
2006-07-07 17:45                       ` Krzysztof Halasa
2006-07-07 21:30                         ` Pavel Machek
2006-07-08 10:52                           ` Krzysztof Halasa
2006-07-08 10:55                             ` Pavel Machek
2006-07-08 11:19                               ` Krzysztof Halasa
2006-07-08 11:23                                 ` Pavel Machek
2006-07-08 18:45                                 ` Avi Kivity
2006-07-08 20:24                                   ` Krzysztof Halasa
2006-07-04  9:22                 ` Petr Tesarik
2006-07-04 11:35                   ` Peter Zijlstra
2006-07-04 11:55                     ` ext4 features (salvage) Petr Tesarik
     [not found]                       ` <80294dc60607040508l1022d164ybe0ba10858e54f0c@mail.gmail.com>
2006-07-04 12:31                         ` Petr Tesarik
2006-07-04 12:42                           ` Helge Hafting
2006-07-04 16:20                       ` Matthew Frost
2006-07-04 15:25                     ` ext4 features Pavel Machek
2006-07-05  4:10                     ` Bill Davidsen
2006-07-03 21:46               ` Valdis.Kletnieks
     [not found]                 ` <Pine.LNX.4.61.0607032354170.31747@yvahk01.tjqt.qr>
2006-07-04 14:37                   ` Kernel recycler [was: ext4 features] Jan Engelhardt
2006-07-04 11:14               ` ext4 features Krzysztof Halasa
2006-07-04 22:35               ` Frank van Maarseveen
2006-07-04 23:47                 ` Claudio Martins
2006-07-03 22:12             ` Alan Cox
2006-07-03 21:59               ` Arjan van de Ven
2006-07-03 23:31               ` ext4 features (checksums) Neil Brown
2006-07-04  1:03                 ` Jeff Garzik
2006-07-04  6:09                 ` Avi Kivity
2006-07-04  7:02                   ` Neil Brown
2006-07-04  8:26                     ` Avi Kivity
2006-07-05 11:56                       ` Bill Davidsen
2006-07-05 12:06                   ` Bill Davidsen
2006-07-05 12:19                     ` Avi Kivity
2006-07-08 17:54                       ` Bill Davidsen
2006-07-04  8:17                 ` Alan Cox
2006-07-04 11:08                   ` Thomas Glanzmann
2006-07-04 11:19                 ` Krzysztof Halasa
2006-07-04 12:49                   ` Helge Hafting
2006-07-05 12:01                     ` Bill Davidsen
2006-07-05 12:10                       ` Avi Kivity
2006-07-08 18:02                         ` Bill Davidsen
2006-07-06  0:36           ` Blatant layering violations (was Re: ext4 features) Valerie Henson
2006-07-06 12:15             ` Xavier Bestel
2006-07-06 17:06               ` Valdis.Kletnieks
2006-07-06 20:02             ` Tom Vier
2006-07-03 21:34         ` ext4 features Bill Davidsen
2006-07-03 21:50           ` Valdis.Kletnieks
2006-07-03 22:04             ` Bruce Ferrell
2006-07-04 14:48               ` Valdis.Kletnieks
2006-07-03 23:00             ` Bill Davidsen
2006-07-04 15:01               ` Valdis.Kletnieks
2006-07-05  2:40                 ` Bill Davidsen
2006-07-05  2:47                   ` Valdis.Kletnieks
2006-07-04 12:52             ` Helge Hafting
2006-07-06 15:12       ` Ric Wheeler
2006-07-06 17:05         ` Krzysztof Halasa
2006-07-06 17:27           ` Ric Wheeler
2006-07-06 20:52             ` Valdis.Kletnieks
2006-07-07 17:41               ` Krzysztof Halasa
2006-07-07 17:34             ` Krzysztof Halasa
2006-07-04  1:02 ` Theodore Tso
2006-07-04 19:16   ` Thomas Glanzmann
2006-07-04 19:30   ` Valdis.Kletnieks
2006-07-05 12:24   ` Bill Davidsen
2006-07-05 12:59     ` J. Bruce Fields
2006-07-05 13:17       ` Pádraig Brady
2006-07-05 19:33       ` Trond Myklebust
2006-07-05 21:22         ` Bill Davidsen
2006-07-05 21:42           ` Trond Myklebust
2006-07-08 21:04             ` Bill Davidsen
2006-07-10 20:08               ` Trond Myklebust
2006-07-10 22:37                 ` Bill Davidsen [this message]
2006-07-11  2:36                   ` Trond Myklebust
2006-07-21  3:10                     ` Bill Davidsen
2006-07-21 12:06                       ` Trond Myklebust
2006-07-21 14:36                         ` Theodore Tso
2006-07-21 19:02                           ` Trond Myklebust
2006-07-22 12:25                             ` Theodore Tso
2006-07-05 21:12       ` Bill Davidsen
2006-07-05 21:27         ` linux-os (Dick Johnson)
2006-07-05 21:41         ` J. Bruce Fields
2006-07-06  2:32           ` Bill Davidsen
2006-07-06  2:42             ` Nigel Cunningham
2006-07-06 12:43             ` Trond Myklebust
2006-07-07  2:15               ` Bill Davidsen
2006-07-07  2:30                 ` Trond Myklebust
2006-07-07  2:42                 ` Ric Wheeler
2006-07-07  2:46                   ` Trond Myklebust
2006-07-07  3:16                     ` Bill Davidsen
2006-07-07  8:09                       ` Bernd Petrovitsch
2006-07-07 14:56                       ` Trond Myklebust
2006-07-07 19:52                 ` Theodore Tso
2006-07-05 14:04   ` Avi Kivity
2006-07-04 14:36 ` Andi Kleen
2006-07-04 14:43   ` Thomas Glanzmann
     [not found] <6tVcC-1e1-79@gated-at.bofh.it>
     [not found] ` <6tVcC-1e1-81@gated-at.bofh.it>
     [not found]   ` <6tVcC-1e1-83@gated-at.bofh.it>
     [not found]     ` <6tWib-2Ly-7@gated-at.bofh.it>
     [not found]       ` <6uDdv-7bs-3@gated-at.bofh.it>
     [not found]         ` <6uDGF-7Nj-47@gated-at.bofh.it>
     [not found]           ` <6uDQb-8e8-9@gated-at.bofh.it>
     [not found]             ` <6uDQb-8e8-13@gated-at.bofh.it>
     [not found]               ` <6uE9y-d1-1@gated-at.bofh.it>
     [not found]                 ` <6uPom-87W-23@gated-at.bofh.it>
2006-07-04 12:28                   ` Bodo Eggert
2006-07-04 15:32                     ` Valdis.Kletnieks
     [not found]                 ` <6uEMp-1gr-41@gated-at.bofh.it>
     [not found]                   ` <6uUo2-6SN-5@gated-at.bofh.it>
     [not found]                     ` <6uW6v-15i-19@gated-at.bofh.it>
     [not found]                       ` <6vfLY-4K5-33@gated-at.bofh.it>
2006-07-05 22:40                         ` Bodo Eggert
     [not found] ` <6uXYv-3RG-1@gated-at.bofh.it>
     [not found]   ` <6veG8-350-7@gated-at.bofh.it>
     [not found]     ` <6vfiU-465-13@gated-at.bofh.it>
     [not found]       ` <6vmNk-77r-23@gated-at.bofh.it>
     [not found]         ` <6vnq7-7Tw-55@gated-at.bofh.it>
     [not found]           ` <6vrN0-5Se-9@gated-at.bofh.it>
     [not found]             ` <6vBsY-38p-9@gated-at.bofh.it>
2006-07-07  9:38               ` Bodo Eggert
2006-07-07 14:37                 ` Trond Myklebust
2006-07-09  9:50                   ` Bodo Eggert
  -- strict thread matches above, loose matches on Subject: below --
2006-07-08  2:22 Chuck Ebbert

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