From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org via listexpand id S1758462AbYDJPHs (ORCPT ); Thu, 10 Apr 2008 11:07:48 -0400 Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org id S1757672AbYDJPHf (ORCPT ); Thu, 10 Apr 2008 11:07:35 -0400 Received: from rtr.ca ([76.10.145.34]:2427 "EHLO mail.rtr.ca" rhost-flags-OK-OK-OK-OK) by vger.kernel.org with ESMTP id S1756326AbYDJPHe (ORCPT ); Thu, 10 Apr 2008 11:07:34 -0400 Message-ID: <47FE2D34.10104@rtr.ca> Date: Thu, 10 Apr 2008 11:07:32 -0400 From: Mark Lord Organization: Real-Time Remedies Inc. User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.12 (X11/20080213) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: David Miller Cc: yoshfuji@linux-ipv6.org, jeff@garzik.org, rjw@sisk.pl, linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org, linux-net@vger.kernel.org Subject: Re: 2.6.25-rc8: FTP transfer errors References: <47FD138B.2060801@rtr.ca> <20080409.152933.132174258.davem@davemloft.net> <47FD590C.5020003@rtr.ca> <20080409.182228.193699767.davem@davemloft.net> In-Reply-To: <20080409.182228.193699767.davem@davemloft.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: linux-kernel-owner@vger.kernel.org List-ID: X-Mailing-List: linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org David Miller wrote: > From: Mark Lord > Date: Wed, 09 Apr 2008 20:02:20 -0400 > >> Really, folks. Bug reports are intended to *help* the developers, >> not something to be thrown back in their faces. > > It's a two way street, we asked for a bisect which helps us a lot. .. No, that's a one-way street, where the developers insist that the bug discover do 100% of the work of finding/fixing the bug. A two-way street is when we help each other, where the developers might point out some likely commits, and the bug discover takes additional time to patch/retest around them. Years ago, Linus suggested that he opposed an in-kernel debugger mainly because he preferred that we *think* more about the problems, rather than just finding/fixing symptoms. This 100% reliance upon git-bisect is worse than that. It has people now just tossing regressions into the code left and right, knowing that they can toss all of the testing back at the poor folks whose systems end up not working. > In fact, lately I notice a strong unwillingness to bisect on your > part, in particular. .. I just happen to find/report a lot of regressions. And every single damn one so far has taken days of my time to track down, and in most cases fix by myself. All of them up until this one, have not been bisectable. Yes, this one does seem to reproduce reliably now, so it could be bisected if I wanted to take another day out of my life for it. I did bisect one other issue back in 2.6.24 (or .23?), and that took about 9 hours in total. I'd really like a hand or two with some of these bugs at some point from the folks who keep breaking things. Cheers