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From: mws@twisted-brains.org
To: David Newall <davidn@davidnewall.com>
Cc: Tarkan Erimer <tarkan@netone.net.tr>,
	David Miller <davem@davemloft.net>,
	linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org,
	Linus Torvalds <torvalds@linux-foundation.org>
Subject: Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!
Date: Wed, 30 Apr 2008 16:41:25 +0200	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <48188515.8040008@twisted-brains.org> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <48187400.8050401@davidnewall.com>

David Newall schrieb:
> Tarkan Erimer wrote:
>> I completely disagree with your foolish and nonsense comments about
>> the Linux Kernel and the Linux OS. It's perfectly clear that you
>> didn't understand well enough how the linux development process works.
>> If you thought that the recently released kernels are not stable then,
>> you have to wait the 2.6.x.y series or you can use the distro kernels.
>> All of your comments are pointless and no base. You are free to choose
>> BSD or whatever you want to use. No one is putting a gun on your head
>> to use Linux :-)
> 
> The problem is not exactly faults in recently released kernels, rather
> that introduction of faults is common when it should be rare, and
> kernels are released as stable when they are fragile.  Ignoring a
> problem, and not caring if they migrate to BSD, is foolishness.  Of
> course you don't want people to migrate to BSD, so don't pretend that
> you don't care.
> 
>> Do you think really think that BSD license is more free as making a
>> fool of you ?
> 
> It is a matter of transparent fact that BSD's licence is less
> restrictive than Linux's.  Whether that is desirable is not something
> that need be discussed at this juncture.  My point in raising BSD was
> that, from a commercial point of view, BSD is attractive in a way that
> Linux is not.  The many commercial vendors who have been taken to task
> for not honouring their GPL obligations are strong demonstrations of
> that.  Do not pretend that Linux is sacrosanct.  BSD would be an easy
> swap for vendors should Linux gain a reputation for poor quality (and it
> already runs Linux applications.)
> 
> Reputations snowball.  By the time anybody notices that a good one has
> become tarnished it could be too late, and take too long, to rectify. 
> I'm sure somebody else observed approximately this just yesterday, so
> it's not just me, is it?
> 
> I won't champion this because it's unimportant to me.  Linux's quality
> problems are not my problems.  I do what I can to help Linux, but I'm
> not religious about operating systems and I know that good, free
> operating systems will continue to thrive, even if Linux's dies, just as
> they did before Linux was born.
> 
> Ignore the problem, even shoot the messenger, if you like; or be adult,
> consider the proposition dispassionately, and take steps from there.
> 
> I've said my bit, in fact more than I wanted to, so I choose to stop here.
> --
> To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in
> the body of a message to majordomo@vger.kernel.org
> More majordomo info at  http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html
> Please read the FAQ at  http://www.tux.org/lkml/
> 
within all time you spent up here to discuss nonsense (from my pov it is),

several bugfixes, regression fixes, new drivers, ... have been done or started.

lets concentrate back on what counts - shouldn't we?

my 2ct
marcel



  parent reply	other threads:[~2008-04-30 14:41 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 229+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2008-04-30  2:03 Slow DOWN, please!!! David Miller
2008-04-30  4:03 ` David Newall
2008-04-30  4:18   ` David Miller
2008-04-30 13:04     ` David Newall
2008-04-30 13:18       ` Michael Kerrisk
2008-04-30 14:51       ` Linus Torvalds
2008-04-30 18:21         ` David Newall
2008-04-30 18:27           ` Linus Torvalds
2008-04-30 18:55             ` David Newall
2008-04-30 19:08               ` Linus Torvalds
2008-04-30 19:16                 ` David Newall
2008-04-30 19:25                   ` Linus Torvalds
2008-05-01  4:31                     ` David Newall
2008-05-01  4:37                       ` David Miller
2008-05-01 13:49                       ` Lennart Sorensen
2008-05-01 15:28                       ` Kasper Sandberg
2008-05-01 17:49                         ` Russ Dill
2008-05-02  1:47                           ` Kasper Sandberg
2008-05-02  2:54                             ` Russ Dill
2008-05-02  7:01                               ` Kasper Sandberg
2008-05-02 17:34                               ` Lee Mathers (TCAFS)
2008-05-02 18:21                                 ` Andi Kleen
2008-05-02 21:34                                   ` Kasper Sandberg
2008-04-30 19:06             ` Chris Friesen
2008-04-30 19:13               ` Linus Torvalds
2008-04-30 19:22                 ` David Newall
2008-04-30 19:42                   ` Linus Torvalds
2008-04-30  7:11   ` Tarkan Erimer
2008-04-30 13:28     ` David Newall
2008-04-30 13:38       ` Mike Galbraith
2008-04-30 14:41       ` mws [this message]
2008-04-30 14:55   ` Russ Dill
2008-04-30 14:48 ` Peter Teoh
2008-04-30 19:36 ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-04-30 20:00   ` Andrew Morton
2008-04-30 20:20     ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-04-30 20:05   ` Linus Torvalds
2008-04-30 20:14     ` Linus Torvalds
2008-04-30 20:56       ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-04-30 23:34       ` Greg KH
2008-04-30 20:45     ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-04-30 21:37       ` Linus Torvalds
2008-04-30 22:23         ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-04-30 22:31           ` Linus Torvalds
2008-04-30 22:41             ` Andrew Morton
2008-04-30 23:23               ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-04-30 23:41                 ` david
2008-04-30 23:51                   ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-05-01  0:57               ` Adrian Bunk
2008-05-01  1:25                 ` Linus Torvalds
2008-05-01  2:13                   ` Adrian Bunk
2008-05-01  2:30                     ` Linus Torvalds
2008-05-01 18:54                       ` Adrian Bunk
2008-05-14 14:55                       ` Pavel Machek
2008-05-01  1:35                 ` Theodore Tso
2008-05-01 12:31               ` Tarkan Erimer
2008-05-01 15:34                 ` Stefan Richter
2008-05-02 14:05                   ` Tarkan Erimer
2008-04-30 22:46             ` Willy Tarreau
2008-04-30 22:52               ` Andrew Morton
2008-04-30 23:21                 ` Willy Tarreau
2008-04-30 23:38                   ` Chris Shoemaker
2008-04-30 23:20               ` Linus Torvalds
2008-05-01  0:42                 ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-05-01  1:19                   ` Linus Torvalds
2008-05-01  1:31                     ` Andrew Morton
2008-05-01  1:43                       ` Linus Torvalds
2008-05-01 10:59                         ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-05-01 15:26                           ` Linus Torvalds
2008-05-01 17:09                             ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-05-01 17:41                               ` Linus Torvalds
2008-05-01 18:11                                 ` Al Viro
2008-05-01 18:23                                   ` Linus Torvalds
2008-05-01 18:30                                     ` Linus Torvalds
2008-05-01 18:58                                     ` Willy Tarreau
2008-05-01 19:37                                     ` Al Viro
2008-05-01 19:58                                       ` Andrew Morton
2008-05-01 20:07                                       ` Joel Becker
2008-05-01 18:50                                 ` Willy Tarreau
2008-05-01 19:07                                   ` david
2008-05-01 19:28                                     ` Willy Tarreau
2008-05-01 19:46                                       ` david
2008-05-01 19:53                                         ` Willy Tarreau
2008-05-01 22:17                                   ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-05-01 19:39                                 ` Friedrich Göpel
2008-05-01 21:59                                 ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-05-02 12:17                                   ` Stefan Richter
2008-05-01 18:35                             ` Chris Frey
2008-05-02 13:22                               ` Enrico Weigelt
2008-05-01  1:40                     ` Linus Torvalds
2008-05-01  1:51                       ` David Miller
2008-05-01  2:01                         ` Linus Torvalds
2008-05-01  2:17                           ` David Miller
2008-05-01  2:21                       ` Al Viro
2008-05-01  5:19                         ` david
2008-05-04  3:26                         ` Rene Herman
2008-05-01  2:31                       ` Nigel Cunningham
2008-05-01 18:32                         ` Stephen Clark
2008-05-01  3:53                       ` Frans Pop
2008-05-01 11:38                       ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-04-30 14:28                         ` Arjan van de Ven
2008-05-01 12:41                           ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-04-30 15:06                             ` Arjan van de Ven
2008-05-01  5:50                     ` Willy Tarreau
2008-05-01 11:53                       ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-05-01 12:11                         ` Will Newton
2008-05-01 13:16                         ` Bartlomiej Zolnierkiewicz
2008-05-01 13:53                           ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-05-01 14:35                             ` Bartlomiej Zolnierkiewicz
2008-05-01 15:29                           ` Ray Lee
2008-05-01 19:03                             ` Willy Tarreau
2008-05-01 19:36                         ` Valdis.Kletnieks
2008-05-01  1:30                 ` Jeremy Fitzhardinge
2008-05-01  5:35                   ` Willy Tarreau
2008-04-30 23:03             ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-04-30 22:40           ` david
2008-04-30 23:45             ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-04-30 23:57               ` david
2008-05-01  0:01                 ` Chris Shoemaker
2008-05-01  0:14                   ` david
2008-05-01  0:38                     ` Linus Torvalds
2008-05-01  1:39                       ` Jeremy Fitzhardinge
2008-05-01  0:38               ` Adrian Bunk
2008-05-01  0:56                 ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-05-01  1:25                   ` Adrian Bunk
2008-05-01 12:05                     ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-05-01 13:54       ` Stefan Richter
2008-05-01 14:06         ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-04-30 23:29     ` Paul Mackerras
2008-05-01  1:57       ` Jeff Garzik
2008-05-01  2:52         ` Frans Pop
2008-05-01  3:47       ` Linus Torvalds
2008-05-01  4:17         ` Jeff Garzik
2008-05-01  4:46           ` Linus Torvalds
2008-05-04 13:47             ` Krzysztof Halasa
2008-05-04 15:05               ` Jacek Luczak
2008-05-01  9:17           ` Alan Cox
2008-04-30 20:15   ` Andrew Morton
2008-04-30 20:31     ` Linus Torvalds
2008-04-30 20:47       ` Dan Noe
2008-04-30 20:59         ` Andrew Morton
2008-04-30 21:30           ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-04-30 21:37             ` Andrew Morton
2008-04-30 22:08             ` Linus Torvalds
2008-04-30 22:53           ` Mariusz Kozlowski
2008-04-30 23:11             ` Andrew Morton
2008-05-12  9:27               ` Ben Dooks
2008-05-02 10:20             ` Andi Kleen
2008-05-02 15:33               ` Mariusz Kozlowski
2008-04-30 20:54       ` Andrew Morton
2008-04-30 21:21         ` David Miller
2008-04-30 21:47           ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-04-30 22:02           ` Dmitri Vorobiev
2008-04-30 22:19           ` Ingo Molnar
2008-04-30 22:22             ` David Miller
2008-04-30 22:39               ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-04-30 22:54                 ` david
2008-04-30 23:12                 ` Willy Tarreau
2008-04-30 23:59                   ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-05-01  0:15                   ` Chris Shoemaker
2008-05-01  5:09                     ` Willy Tarreau
2008-04-30 22:35             ` Ingo Molnar
2008-04-30 22:49               ` Andrew Morton
2008-04-30 22:51               ` David Miller
2008-05-01  1:40                 ` Ingo Molnar
2008-05-01  2:48                 ` Adrian Bunk
2008-05-05  3:04             ` Rusty Russell
2008-05-02 13:37           ` Helge Hafting
2008-04-30 21:42         ` Dmitri Vorobiev
2008-04-30 22:06           ` Jiri Slaby
2008-04-30 22:10           ` Andrew Morton
2008-04-30 22:19             ` Linus Torvalds
2008-04-30 22:28               ` Dmitri Vorobiev
2008-05-01 16:26                 ` Diego Calleja
2008-05-01 16:31                   ` Dmitri Vorobiev
2008-05-02  1:48                   ` Stephen Rothwell
2008-05-01 23:06               ` Kevin Winchester
2008-04-30 23:04             ` Dmitri Vorobiev
2008-05-01 15:19               ` Jim Schutt
2008-05-01  6:15             ` Jan Engelhardt
2008-05-09  9:28         ` Jiri Kosina
2008-05-09 15:00           ` Jeff Garzik
2008-04-30 21:52       ` H. Peter Anvin
2008-05-01  3:24         ` Bob Tracy
2008-05-01 16:39         ` Valdis.Kletnieks
2008-05-01  0:31       ` RFC: starting a kernel-testers group for newbies Adrian Bunk
2008-04-30  7:03         ` Arjan van de Ven
2008-05-01  8:13           ` Andrew Morton
2008-04-30 14:15             ` Arjan van de Ven
2008-05-01 12:42               ` David Woodhouse
2008-04-30 15:02                 ` Arjan van de Ven
2008-05-05 10:03                 ` Benny Halevy
2008-05-04 12:45               ` Rene Herman
2008-05-04 13:00                 ` Pekka Enberg
2008-05-04 13:19                   ` Rene Herman
2008-05-05 13:13                   ` crosscompiler [WAS: RFC: starting a kernel-testers group for newbies] Enrico Weigelt
2008-05-01  9:16             ` RFC: starting a kernel-testers group for newbies Frans Pop
2008-05-01 10:30               ` Enrico Weigelt
2008-05-01 13:02                 ` Adrian Bunk
2008-05-01 11:30           ` Adrian Bunk
2008-04-30 14:20             ` Arjan van de Ven
2008-05-01 12:53               ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-05-01 13:21               ` Adrian Bunk
2008-05-01 15:49                 ` Andrew Morton
2008-05-01  1:13                   ` Arjan van de Ven
2008-05-02  9:00                     ` Adrian Bunk
2008-05-01 16:38                   ` Steven Rostedt
2008-05-01 17:18                     ` Andrew Morton
2008-05-01 17:24                   ` Theodore Tso
2008-05-01 19:26                     ` Andrew Morton
2008-05-01 19:39                       ` Steven Rostedt
2008-05-02 10:23                       ` Andi Kleen
2008-05-02  2:08                 ` Paul Mackerras
2008-05-02  3:10                   ` Josh Boyer
2008-05-02  4:09                     ` Paul Mackerras
2008-05-02  8:29                       ` Adrian Bunk
2008-05-02 10:16                         ` Paul Mackerras
2008-05-02 11:58                           ` Adrian Bunk
2008-05-02 14:58                         ` Linus Torvalds
2008-05-02 15:44                           ` Carlos R. Mafra
2008-05-02 16:28                             ` Linus Torvalds
2008-05-02 17:15                               ` Carlos R. Mafra
2008-05-02 18:02                                 ` Pallipadi, Venkatesh
2008-05-09 16:32                                   ` Mark Lord
2008-05-09 19:30                                     ` Carlos R. Mafra
2008-05-09 20:39                                       ` Mark Lord
2008-05-01  0:41         ` David Miller
2008-05-01 13:23           ` Adrian Bunk
  -- strict thread matches above, loose matches on Subject: below --
2008-04-30 20:59 Slow DOWN, please!!! devzero

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