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From: Rene Herman <rene.herman@keyaccess.nl>
To: David Miller <davem@davemloft.net>
Cc: david@lang.hm, torvalds@linux-foundation.org,
	arjan@infradead.org, akpm@linux-foundation.org,
	dwmw2@infradead.org, alan@lxorguk.ukuu.org.uk,
	linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org
Subject: Re: [GIT *] Allow request_firmware() to be satisfied from in-kernel, use it in more drivers.
Date: Tue, 15 Jul 2008 04:23:14 +0200	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <487C0A12.9060906@keyaccess.nl> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <20080714.185207.203328391.davem@davemloft.net>

On 15-07-08 03:52, David Miller wrote:

> From: david@lang.hm Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 17:51:37 -0700 (PDT)
> 
>> I agree with this, but the proponents of the seperate firmware are
>> listing the fact that the firmware doesn't tie up ram as one of the
>> big reasons for making the change.
> 
> Exactly.
> 
> Otherwise these firmware changes are utterly pointless.

The point of them is legal. Which everyone knows so could perhaps that 
particular dance be done away with?

The current patches allow to

1) load the firmware from userspace
2) load the firmware from the kernel image (vmlinux)

They lack the ability to load the firmware from the module image.

 From a technical standpoint that seems an odd setup. As a driver author 
you'd either be satisfied with loading the firmware from userspace, or 
if for example you feel you're very much tied to your specific firmware, 
you want it to be as close to you as possible -- in the kernel image 
while you yourself are a module makes little sense. You couldn't for 
example just copy the single module around.

That seems a clear technical point to fix but after that, the point is 
legal. At least for existing drivers, this consists of distributions 
worrying about GPL consequences and wanting to seperate out the existing 
firmware blobs.

They do worry -- whatever those worries might be worth -- so there's the 
point. You may feel it not a good point but that's something other than 
no point existing.

I followed along on these flamewars and I'd say to reject these current 
patches on technical grounds until the ability to build the firmware 
into the module exists and merge it after -- even though people might 
feel there's little or no upside to them, I'd say there's little of no 
downside either once that ability is in.

Rene.

  reply	other threads:[~2008-07-15  2:21 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 227+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2008-07-14 23:23 [GIT *] Allow request_firmware() to be satisfied from in-kernel, use it in more drivers David Woodhouse
2008-07-14 23:41 ` Andrew Morton
2008-07-14 23:47   ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-14 23:53     ` Yinghai Lu
2008-07-15  0:23       ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-15  0:31         ` Yinghai Lu
2008-07-15  0:50           ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-15  1:08             ` Yinghai Lu
2008-07-15  7:50             ` Ingo Molnar
2008-07-15  0:50         ` Yinghai Lu
2008-07-15  0:52           ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-15  0:53             ` Yinghai Lu
2008-07-15  1:13           ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-15 20:45     ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-07-15 20:49       ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-15 20:57         ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-15 23:45           ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-07-16  7:01         ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-16 21:28           ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-07-16 22:42             ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-17 20:42               ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-07-17 21:25                 ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-17 22:25                   ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-07-18  4:15                 ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-14 23:59   ` Arjan van de Ven
2008-07-15  0:06     ` david
2008-07-15  0:33       ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15  0:51         ` david
2008-07-15  1:02           ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15  1:18             ` david
2008-07-15  2:08               ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15  2:47                 ` david
2008-07-15  7:57                 ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-15 15:04                   ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15 17:01                     ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-15 17:09                       ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15 17:30                         ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-15 17:41                           ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15 17:45                             ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15 18:11                               ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-15 18:21                                 ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15 18:33                                   ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-15 18:20                             ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-15 18:25                               ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15 18:30                                 ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-15 20:00                                   ` Marcel Holtmann
2008-07-15 20:06                                     ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-15 20:30                                       ` Marcel Holtmann
2008-07-15 21:24                                       ` david
2008-07-15 18:44                                 ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-15 18:53                                   ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15 19:09                                     ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-15 19:18                                       ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15 18:58                                   ` Theodore Tso
2008-07-15 19:14                                     ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-15 19:19                                       ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15 19:23                                         ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15 21:14                                         ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-15 21:24                                           ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-15 21:47                                             ` David Miller
2008-07-15 22:42                                               ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-15 22:45                                                 ` David Miller
2008-07-15 23:05                                                 ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-15 21:24                                           ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15 21:39                                             ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-15 22:12                                               ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-15 22:46                                                 ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-16  0:55                                                 ` Sven-Haegar Koch
2008-07-16  8:02                                                   ` Gabor Gombas
2008-07-16  4:55                                       ` Rene Herman
2008-07-15 19:27                                     ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-15  1:52           ` David Miller
2008-07-15  2:23             ` Rene Herman [this message]
2008-07-15  2:24               ` David Miller
2008-07-15  2:32                 ` Rene Herman
2008-07-15  2:39                 ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15  2:45                   ` David Miller
2008-07-15  4:56                     ` Arjan van de Ven
2008-07-15  5:09                       ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-15  5:45                         ` david
2008-07-15  6:03                           ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-15  6:23                             ` Oliver Neukum
2008-07-15 14:40                               ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-15 16:52                                 ` Oliver Neukum
2008-07-15 18:09                                   ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-15  5:32                       ` Rene Herman
2008-07-15  3:06                   ` Rene Herman
2008-07-15 23:33                   ` Alexandre Oliva
2008-07-15  5:15                 ` Benjamin Herrenschmidt
2008-07-15  5:30                   ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-15  1:50         ` David Miller
2008-07-15  2:54           ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-15  5:34             ` david
2008-07-15  0:36       ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-15  0:40         ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15  0:44           ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-15  5:05             ` Benjamin Herrenschmidt
2008-07-15  2:12         ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-15  2:17           ` David Miller
2008-07-15  2:23             ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-15  2:52               ` david
2008-07-15  4:45               ` Willy Tarreau
2008-07-15  1:54     ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-15  2:13       ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15  2:19         ` David Miller
2008-07-15  2:22         ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-15  2:33           ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15  2:40             ` David Miller
2008-07-15  2:51               ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15  3:05                 ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-15  4:58                 ` Willy Tarreau
2008-07-15 14:55                   ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15 15:09                     ` david
2008-07-15 16:01                       ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15 16:21                         ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-15 17:56                         ` david
2008-07-15 17:35                     ` Willy Tarreau
2008-07-15 17:44                       ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-15  3:15             ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-15  3:29               ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15  5:06                 ` Willy Tarreau
2008-07-15  5:32                   ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-15  5:36                     ` Willy Tarreau
2008-07-15  5:37                     ` david
2008-07-16  0:10                     ` Alexandre Oliva
2008-07-16  0:26                       ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15  7:21                 ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-15  7:36                   ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-15  8:07                     ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-15 15:10                       ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15 16:53                         ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-15 17:16                         ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-15 17:25                           ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15 17:54                             ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-15  8:14                     ` Ingo Molnar
2008-07-15  8:24                       ` Ingo Molnar
2008-07-15 12:42                   ` Alan Cox
2008-07-17 21:31                     ` David Miller
2008-07-15  2:48           ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-15  5:12             ` Willy Tarreau
2008-07-15 15:57         ` Frans Pop
2008-07-15 16:04           ` Arjan van de Ven
2008-07-15 16:24             ` Frans Pop
2008-07-15 16:36             ` Frans Pop
2008-07-15 17:33               ` Arjan van de Ven
2008-07-15 17:57                 ` Frans Pop
2008-07-15 16:15           ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15 16:33             ` david
2008-07-15 16:41               ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15 17:25                 ` Frans Pop
2008-07-15 17:36                 ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-15 19:22                 ` Marcel Holtmann
2008-07-15 16:35             ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15 16:48               ` Frans Pop
2008-07-15 17:07                 ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15 19:26               ` Marcel Holtmann
2008-07-15 16:37             ` Frans Pop
2008-07-15 18:05           ` Henrique de Moraes Holschuh
2008-07-15 18:14             ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-15 18:24               ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15 18:37                 ` Chris Friesen
2008-07-15 18:55                 ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-15 19:02                   ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15 19:41                     ` david
2008-07-15 19:59                     ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-15 20:15                       ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15 20:55                         ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-15 23:02                           ` Dave Jones
2008-07-15 23:46                             ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-16  0:00                               ` Dave Jones
2008-07-16  0:10                           ` Chris Adams
2008-07-16  6:04                             ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-15 19:07                   ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-15 19:29                 ` Peter T. Breuer
2008-07-15 18:20             ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-15 19:13               ` Frans Pop
2008-07-15 19:39             ` Marcel Holtmann
2008-07-15 19:20           ` Marcel Holtmann
2008-07-15 19:27             ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15 19:31               ` Marcel Holtmann
2008-07-15 19:38                 ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15 19:44                   ` Marcel Holtmann
2008-07-15 22:19                     ` Adrian Bunk
2008-07-15 19:32               ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15 19:36               ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-15 19:49                 ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15 19:54                   ` Marcel Holtmann
2008-07-15 20:07                     ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15 20:21                       ` Marcel Holtmann
2008-07-15 20:30                         ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15 20:33                         ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-15 21:17                         ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-15 20:26                       ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-15 20:47                         ` Willy Tarreau
2008-07-15 21:24                           ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-16 22:05                         ` Diego Calleja
2008-07-15 21:27                       ` david
2008-07-15 21:40                         ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-15 21:43                         ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15 22:20                           ` Frans Pop
2008-07-15 22:24                           ` david
2008-07-15 22:26                             ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-15 22:50                               ` david
2008-07-15 23:42                             ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-16  0:22                               ` Frans Pop
2008-07-16  0:28                                 ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-16  0:43                                   ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-16  1:11                                     ` Prosaic firmware issues Alexey Dobriyan
2008-07-16  1:45                                       ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-16  5:54                                         ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-16 14:19                                           ` Alexey Dobriyan
2008-07-16  4:42                                     ` [GIT *] Allow request_firmware() to be satisfied from in-kernel, use it in more drivers Willy Tarreau
2008-09-12 20:59                                       ` Jeff Garzik
2008-09-12 21:43                                         ` Willy Tarreau
2008-07-16  0:51                               ` Theodore Tso
2008-07-16  1:36                                 ` Dave Jones
2008-07-16  2:39                                   ` Theodore Tso
2008-07-16  3:07                                   ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-16  9:09                                     ` Peter Zijlstra
2008-07-15 19:57                   ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-15 20:10                     ` Marcel Holtmann
2008-07-15 20:17                       ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15 20:25                         ` Marcel Holtmann
2008-07-15 23:04                     ` Dave Jones
2008-07-15  1:44   ` David Miller
2008-07-15  9:57     ` Marcel Holtmann
2008-07-15  1:45 ` Jeff Garzik
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     [not found]               ` <aPZ0H-2ls-21@gated-at.bofh.it>

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