From: David Newall <davidn@davidnewall.com>
To: Theodore Tso <tytso@MIT.EDU>
Cc: Marcin Letyns <mletyns@gmail.com>,
Linux Kernel Mailing List <linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org>
Subject: Re: stable? quality assurance?
Date: Wed, 14 Jul 2010 06:15:20 +0930 [thread overview]
Message-ID: <4C3CD060.50904@davidnewall.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <4735EF77-6C7D-46D6-8C2B-C910A2D662D2@mit.edu>
Theodore Tso wrote:
> What this means is yes that stable basically means, "stable
> for the core kernel developers". You can say that this isn't
> correct, and maybe even dishonest, but if we wait until 2.6.34.N
> before we call a release "stable", and this discourages users
> from testing 2.6.34.M for M<N, it just delays when bugs will
> be found and fixed.
>
Calling it stable instils and reinforces a Pavlovian response in typical
users, that recent Linux kernels are dangerous and unreliable; one year
old was suggested as a safe benchmark. Typical users being 99% of the
population, testing hardly begins until a kernel is "sufficiently old."
This Pavlovian response is what really delays finding and fixing bugs.
Being up-front and saying which kernels are likely to fail would help
many users calculate the risk and improve their willingness to try newer
kernels. "Sufficiently old" might well come down to six months, maybe four.
That is to say, instead of taking a year to pass gamma-testing, new
kernels could be passed in six months or less. That would be a big
improvement in stability and quality assurance however you dice it.
> But demanding that kernel.org become "more stable" when it
> is supported by purely volunteers is simply not reasonable.
Let's not be hysterical; nobody made any demands. Semantics aside, the
suggestion is reasonable because it affects developers' workloads not
one whit. The only change is the label that Linus applies to new releases.
next prev parent reply other threads:[~2010-07-13 20:45 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 72+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
2010-07-11 7:18 stable? quality assurance? Martin Steigerwald
2010-07-11 8:39 ` Eric Dumazet
2010-07-11 14:22 ` Martin Steigerwald
2010-07-11 14:52 ` Martin Steigerwald
2010-07-11 15:58 ` William Pitcock
2010-07-11 16:34 ` Eric Dumazet
2010-07-16 6:59 ` Greg KH
2010-08-05 3:27 ` Jeremy Fitzhardinge
2010-07-11 17:04 ` Heinz Diehl
2010-07-11 13:16 ` Ted Ts'o
2010-07-11 18:02 ` Anca Emanuel
2010-07-12 6:46 ` David Newall
[not found] ` <AANLkTilGjfx9sb66qVfZn1SeFPURHUrrdE7JCrild8VX@mail.gmail.com>
2010-07-12 12:35 ` Fwd: " Marcin Letyns
2010-07-12 12:42 ` Alexey Dobriyan
[not found] ` <AANLkTik64lxDiCN-eRo3i_-cTqAvCzbaRI4EEXoD44Vj@mail.gmail.com>
2010-07-12 12:52 ` Fwd: " Marcin Letyns
2010-07-12 14:57 ` Valdis.Kletnieks
2010-07-12 15:56 ` David Newall
2010-07-12 17:48 ` Marcin Letyns
2010-07-12 18:00 ` Stefan Richter
2010-07-12 19:58 ` David Newall
2010-07-12 21:11 ` Stefan Richter
2010-07-12 21:39 ` Martin Steigerwald
2010-07-12 22:44 ` Stefan Richter
2010-07-15 7:23 ` david
2010-07-13 16:50 ` Theodore Tso
2010-07-13 20:45 ` David Newall [this message]
2010-07-14 6:33 ` Theodore Tso
2010-09-04 17:12 ` Martin Steigerwald
2010-07-11 13:56 ` Lee Mathers
2010-07-11 14:51 ` Martin Steigerwald
2010-07-11 17:22 ` Willy Tarreau
2010-07-11 21:38 ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2010-07-12 4:17 ` Willy Tarreau
2010-07-12 9:56 ` Martin Steigerwald
2010-07-12 15:43 ` Martin Steigerwald
2010-07-12 17:36 ` Willy Tarreau
2010-07-12 19:56 ` Martin Steigerwald
2010-07-12 23:03 ` Stefan Richter
2010-07-13 10:30 ` Martin Steigerwald
2010-07-15 7:32 ` david
2010-07-12 17:55 ` Stefan Richter
2010-09-04 16:38 ` Martin Steigerwald
2010-09-04 18:46 ` Ted Ts'o
2010-09-04 19:11 ` Martin Steigerwald
2010-09-04 23:23 ` Ted Ts'o
2010-09-05 7:59 ` Martin Steigerwald
2010-09-04 19:24 ` Stefan Richter
2010-09-04 19:34 ` Stefan Richter
2010-09-04 20:21 ` Martin Steigerwald
2010-09-04 22:50 ` Stefan Richter
2010-09-04 23:16 ` Ted Ts'o
2010-09-05 8:35 ` Avi Kivity
2010-09-05 9:48 ` Martin Steigerwald
2010-07-11 19:49 ` Stefan Richter
2010-07-13 11:11 ` Alejandro Riveira Fernández
2010-07-13 12:50 ` rt2x00: slow wifi with correct basic rate bitmap (was Re: stable? quality assurance?) Stefan Richter
2010-07-13 15:35 ` John W. Linville
2010-07-13 18:19 ` Alejandro Riveira Fernández
2010-07-13 18:38 ` John W. Linville
2010-07-13 19:07 ` Alejandro Riveira Fernández
2010-07-13 18:06 ` Alejandro Riveira Fernández
2010-07-13 19:18 ` Stefan Richter
2010-07-12 19:46 ` stable? quality assurance? Nix
[not found] ` <AANLkTimEdVsmIgXBbmhsq75ElQvGAI8avsM8-wlDpm4z@mail.gmail.com>
2010-07-15 9:09 ` Valeo de Vries
2010-07-16 7:00 ` Greg KH
2010-07-16 7:19 ` Justin P. Mattock
2010-07-16 15:25 ` Randy Dunlap
2010-07-16 15:34 ` Valeo de Vries
-- strict thread matches above, loose matches on Subject: below --
2010-09-04 16:42 Martin Steigerwald
2010-09-04 17:22 ` Willy Tarreau
2010-09-04 19:33 ` Martin Steigerwald
2010-09-04 20:19 ` Willy Tarreau
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