Re: [GIT PULL] kdbus for 4.1-rc1

One Thousand Gnomes
2015-04-15T12:05:04Z

> > There is no comparison between the elegance of X11 property setting and a
> > chunk of proposed kernel code that is half the size of a tiny X server!
>
> Hey, take that up with Havoc, he made the comparison :)

And it concerns me you blindly repeat it without realising its wrong.

> > The dbus model is also flawed in a load of other ways in user space
> > because message handling in the hands of people with no concept of
> > systemic performance analysis just leads to disaster. One of the big
> > reasons dbus is so "slow" isn't that dbus is "slow", it's that the
> > crapware on top of it makes *thousands* of dbus queries.
>
> There's the issue of thousands of dbus queries, and then there's the
> issue that making those queries takes a measurable amount of time. We
> can fix the later one, the first one, well, not so much, but we can
> provide the resources for them to make a faster system if they want to.

If you fix the thousands of queries problem do you need kernel help at
all.

> The internet model with state in the endpoints doesn't always transfer
> properly to local applications, see Havoc's email for the details about
> that.

URL ?

(note how beautifully btw the stateless network and the URL string will
become a reference to state)

> > It's telling that I can lose and recover my internet connection without
> > rebooting but not my desktops internal messaging.
>
> Yes, as those are totally different things, let's not mix the issue up
> here please.

They are *NOT* different things. They are fundamental properties of the
underlying architecture. I worked on stateful networks and still have
the scars. It is a fundamental property of stateful network that every
time any key component goes castors up you lose the lot. It is a fairly
fundamental property of stateless networks that equipment going castors
up has no material impact on the network

The internet is built upon three fundamental breakthroughs in technology

- That stateless networks scale and can be reliable while stateful ones
cannot scale and cannot be fixed to do so

- That flow control is possible over a stateless network

- That efficient data routing is possible over a stateless network

Those are absolutely critical parts of any network or messaging
implementation.

Alan