Software Mestizo Manifesto

Software Mestizo Manifesto

[Roberto Diaz]

Hi this is off-topic sorry.

I am trying to make a manifesto in order to attach it to all my gpl'd
developments.. due to limitations in my english I would like to ask for
your help... and maybe you can have a couple of new ideas to improve it.

I am doing this because gpl'd developments usually involves people all
around the world.. and being aware that a lot of gpl'd / GNU resources are
used by fascist, terrorist and that kind of "people" everyday.. well maybe 
is a begginig.

Please help the way you can.

for now is just this:

/******************  Software Mestizo Manifesto  *********************
 * This code is **Software Mestizo** meaning it has been developed with 
 * the help of a lot of individuals no matter their racial or cultural 
 * origin, they all work together in peace and harmony in the belief of 
 * humankind fraternity, using this software with the purpose to harm 
 * this principles is to harm this software itself, uncivilizated and
 * completely unethical. Please use it only in the context of this 
 * principles or dont use it if you dont agree the spirit of the Authors.
 */


Regards

Roberto

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Re: Software Mestizo Manifesto

[Rik van Riel]

On Wed, 7 Feb 2001, Roberto Diaz wrote:

> I am trying to make a manifesto in order to attach it to all my
> gpl'd developments..

> I am doing this because gpl'd developments usually involves
> people all around the world.. and being aware that a lot of
> gpl'd / GNU resources are used by fascist, terrorist and that
> kind of "people" everyday.. well maybe is a begginig.

Quoted from the GPL:
-------
  6. Each time you redistribute the Program (or any work based on the
Program), the recipient automatically receives a license from the
original licensor to copy, distribute or modify the Program subject to
these terms and conditions.  You may not impose any further
restrictions on the recipients' exercise of the rights granted herein.
You are not responsible for enforcing compliance by third parties to
this License.
-------

Your "ethical" statement is incompatible with the GPL.

(And, IMHO, unethical since it restricts the freedom of
use on free software, but lets not start about that since
we're off-topic for linux-kernel anyway...)

regards,

Rik
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Software Mestizo Manifesto

[Roberto Diaz]

Hi this is off-topic sorry.

I am trying to make a manifesto in order to attach it to all my gpl'd
developments.. due to limitations in my english I would like to ask for
your help... and maybe you can have a couple of new ideas to improve it.

I am doing this because gpl'd developments usually involves people all
around the world and more times this is its main feature.. and being aware
that a lot of gpl'd / GNU resources are used by fascist, terrorist and
that kind of "people" everyday.. well maybe  is a begginig.

Please help the way you can.

for now is just this:

/******************  Software Mestizo Manifesto  *********************
 * This code is **Software Mestizo** meaning it has been developed with 
 * the help of a lot of individuals no matter their racial or cultural 
 * origin, they all work together in peace and harmony in the belief of 
 * humankind fraternity, using this software with the purpose to harm 
 * this principles is to harm this software itself, uncivilizated and
 * completely unethical. Please use it only in the context of this 
 * principles or dont use it if you dont agree the spirit of the Authors.
 */


Regards

Roberto

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Re: Software Mestizo Manifesto

[Roberto Diaz]

> Quoted from the GPL:
> -------
>   6. Each time you redistribute the Program (or any work based on the
> Program), the recipient automatically receives a license from the
> original licensor to copy, distribute or modify the Program subject to
> these terms and conditions.  You may not impose any further
> restrictions on the recipients' exercise of the rights granted herein.
> You are not responsible for enforcing compliance by third parties to
> this License.
> -------
> 
> Your "ethical" statement is incompatible with the GPL.

Thank you very much.. do you find incompatibilities here:

/******************  Software Mestizo Manifesto  *********************
 * This code is **Software Mestizo** meaning it has been developed with
 * the help of many diverse individuals worldwide; no matter their 
 * racial or cultural origin, they all work together in peace and harmony 
 * in the belief of humankind fraternity.  Using this software with the 
 * purpose of harming these principles is to harm the software itself,
 * We advice to use it only in the context of these principles or refrain 
 * from its use if you don't agree with the spirit in which it was 
 * written.
 */ 

Please let the people to decide wether they want to attach this to their
source code.. I am only trying to do a manifesto which I think is valuable

Please send a CC: to Guido Socher <guido@bearix.oche.de> he is the
Editor-in-Chief of www.linuxfocus.org maybe he could help (or kill me
still dont know.. anyway).


Regards

Roberto

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Re: Software Mestizo Manifesto

[Michael B. Trausch]

This is very intesting seeing as the story I read in the Newspaper (USA
Today) on encryption and terrorism today is an example of this.

It seems that people are using open source software to do idiotic
things. Many open source references were made in the article, I should
see if the article is online at all to maybe be able to use it as a
reference.

The only thing is that the good uses of the software are still
promenent, and what really bugs me is that the Government wants to step
into having a "Master Key" for everything as such... they can decrypt
stuff as is, but they have to spend lots of money if they want to do it
and that'll keep them in check verses having a "Master Key" that can
decrypt everything in a given encryption method.  That's just plain
stupid.

	- Mike

Roberto Diaz wrote:
> 
> Hi this is off-topic sorry.
> 
> I am trying to make a manifesto in order to attach it to all my gpl'd
> developments.. due to limitations in my english I would like to ask for
> your help... and maybe you can have a couple of new ideas to improve it.
> 
> I am doing this because gpl'd developments usually involves people all
> around the world.. and being aware that a lot of gpl'd / GNU resources are
> used by fascist, terrorist and that kind of "people" everyday.. well maybe
> is a begginig.
> 
> Please help the way you can.
> 
> for now is just this:
> 
> /******************  Software Mestizo Manifesto  *********************
>  * This code is **Software Mestizo** meaning it has been developed with
>  * the help of a lot of individuals no matter their racial or cultural
>  * origin, they all work together in peace and harmony in the belief of
>  * humankind fraternity, using this software with the purpose to harm
>  * this principles is to harm this software itself, uncivilizated and
>  * completely unethical. Please use it only in the context of this
>  * principles or dont use it if you dont agree the spirit of the Authors.
>  */
> 
> Regards
> 
> Roberto
> 
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Roberto Diaz <rdiazmartin@vivaldi.dtts.net>
> http://vivaldi.dtts.net
> Powered by ddt dynamic DNS
> Powered by GNU running on a Linux kernel.
> Powered by Debian (The real wonder)
> 
> Concerto Grosso Op. 3/8 A minor
> Antonio Vivaldi (so... do you need beautiful words?)
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
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Re: Software Mestizo Manifesto

[Alan Cox]

> > Your "ethical" statement is incompatible with the GPL.

I disagree. Its a statement. Its a request. It says 'advice'. Anyone is
entitled to advise how to use GPL software. The only issue is if someone
chooses to require it is not used by XYZ person. 


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Re: Software Mestizo Manifesto

[Peter Samuelson]

  [Roberto Diaz]
> > I am trying to make a manifesto in order to attach it to all my
> > gpl'd developments..

[Rik van Riel]
> Quoted from the GPL:
> -------
>   6. Each time you redistribute the Program (or any work based on the
> Program), the recipient automatically receives a license from the
> original licensor to copy, distribute or modify the Program subject to
[...]
> Your "ethical" statement is incompatible with the GPL.

Quoted from the GPL:
-------
  0. [...] Activities other than copying, distribution and modification
are not covered by this License; they are outside its scope.


Roberto's statement is about *use*, not *distribution*, so it is
orthogonal to the GPL.

It *does*, however, violate the DFSG, at least in spirit (since it is
only a suggestion).  For what it's worth, the DFSG is my standard for
whether a particular project is worth my time to contribute code to.

Also, Roberto -- it is rather presumptuous to assume that all of your
(potentially) thousands of contributors from around the world happen to
agree about that "fraternity of mankind" or whatever that was.  Call me
a misanthrope, but I'm not sure *I* agree with that one.

Peter
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Re: Software Mestizo Manifesto

[Alan Cox]

> It *does*, however, violate the DFSG, at least in spirit (since it is
> only a suggestion).  For what it's worth, the DFSG is my standard for
> whether a particular project is worth my time to contribute code to.

Vast amounts of debian included code contains suggestions about use. 

> Also, Roberto -- it is rather presumptuous to assume that all of your
> (potentially) thousands of contributors from around the world happen to
> agree about that "fraternity of mankind" or whatever that was.  Call me
> a misanthrope, but I'm not sure *I* agree with that one.

Sure, but its an opinion so whats the big deal. Its no different to RMS
view of the world that the GPL discussion and FSF projects push or the 
other end of the world view that ESR pushes in the docs with his projects

Basically I think its not a linux-legal issue 8)

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Re: Software Mestizo Manifesto

[Peter Samuelson]

[ac]
> Vast amounts of debian included code contains suggestions about use. 

I'll not dispute your word because I know you for an objective person.
But I don't remember coming across any such examples at least recently.
Maybe I just don't remember them because they didn't sound like, well,
manifestos.

> > Also, Roberto -- it is rather presumptuous to assume that all of
> > your (potentially) thousands of contributors from around the world
> > happen to agree

> Sure, but its an opinion so whats the big deal. Its no different to
> RMS view of the world that the GPL discussion and FSF projects push

As may be .. there's still a difference between restrictions on use and
restrictions on distribution.  FSF never even implies anything about
how you are "supposed" to use software -- and discussions on
distribution largely parallel the GPL in any case, which I have already
agreed to.  They are in that sense much less invasive, from the POV of
contributing developers.  (OTOH there is the "sign over your copyrights
to the FSF" convention so in that case they are more invasive.)

I suppose none of this matters in any case, because the GPL allows me
to take your software, strip out the "I'd prefer if you didnt..."
comments and redistribute.  This is in contrast to the old BSD license,
or the Free Documentation License, where it is possible to prevent bits
from being clipped.

Peter
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Re: Software Mestizo Manifesto

[Roberto Diaz]

> > > Your "ethical" statement is incompatible with the GPL.
> 
> I disagree. Its a statement. Its a request. It says 'advice'. Anyone is
> entitled to advise how to use GPL software. The only issue is if someone
> chooses to require it is not used by XYZ person. 

Please.. I am not lawyer... my intention were good, just to give authors
the freedom to say "hey please dont drop a nuclear weapon in my city using
my software" just that..

As you see even I have troubles with my english.. 

If someone agree this intentions please help.


Regards

Roberto

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Re: Software Mestizo Manifesto

[Pavel Machek]

Hi!

> > > > Your "ethical" statement is incompatible with the GPL.
> > 
> > I disagree. Its a statement. Its a request. It says 'advice'. Anyone is
> > entitled to advise how to use GPL software. The only issue is if someone
> > chooses to require it is not used by XYZ person. 
> 
> Please.. I am not lawyer... my intention were good, just to give authors
> the freedom to say "hey please dont drop a nuclear weapon in my city using
> my software" just that..

You may say "please don't drop nuclear weapon". You may *not* say "you
must not drop nuclear weapon", that would violate GPL.
								Pavel
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Re: Software Mestizo Manifesto

[Gerhard Mack]

On Sun, 11 Feb 2001, Pavel Machek wrote:

> Hi!
> 
> > > > > Your "ethical" statement is incompatible with the GPL.
> > > 
> > > I disagree. Its a statement. Its a request. It says 'advice'. Anyone is
> > > entitled to advise how to use GPL software. The only issue is if someone
> > > chooses to require it is not used by XYZ person. 
> > 
> > Please.. I am not lawyer... my intention were good, just to give authors
> > the freedom to say "hey please dont drop a nuclear weapon in my city using
> > my software" just that..
> 
> You may say "please don't drop nuclear weapon". You may *not* say "you
> must not drop nuclear weapon", that would violate GPL.
> 
								Pavel

"For all our friends who wish to rid the world of other races.  This
software is best operated with the computer plugged directly into the high
voltage lines outside your house ..."

	Gerhard


--
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gmack@innerfire.net

<>< As a computer I find your faith in technology amusing.

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Re: Software Mestizo Manifesto

[Matthias Rosenkranz]

On Wed, 07. Feb 2001 at 01:40:56 -0500 Michael B. Trausch wrote:
> 
> This is very intesting seeing as the story I read in the Newspaper (USA
> Today) on encryption and terrorism today is an example of this.
> 
> It seems that people are using open source software to do idiotic
> things. Many open source references were made in the article, I should
> see if the article is online at all to maybe be able to use it as a
> reference.

You probably mean that one:
http://www.usatoday.com/life/cyber/tech/2001-02-05-binladen.htm

	Matthias
	
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Re: Software Mestizo Manifesto

[Alan Cox]

> > It seems that people are using open source software to do idiotic
> > things. Many open source references were made in the article, I should
> > see if the article is online at all to maybe be able to use it as a
> > reference.
> 
> You probably mean that one:
> http://www.usatoday.com/life/cyber/tech/2001-02-05-binladen.htm

It has to be said that if Im blowing up planes full of people then I'm probably
not concerned about software licensing issues or a visit from the BSA.

Alan

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Re: Software Mestizo Manifesto

[Michael Trausch]

Alan Cox wrote:
> 
> > > It seems that people are using open source software to do idiotic
> > > things. Many open source references were made in the article, I should
> > > see if the article is online at all to maybe be able to use it as a
> > > reference.
> >
> > You probably mean that one:
> > http://www.usatoday.com/life/cyber/tech/2001-02-05-binladen.htm
> 
> It has to be said that if Im blowing up planes full of people then I'm probably
> not concerned about software licensing issues or a visit from the BSA.
> 
> Alan

ROFL... This is true.  However, I've got to wonder how many people
actually like Bin Laden are out there.  And seeing as though they can't
seem to catch him, he must be doing a pretty damn good job at working on
the software issue.  We'll see how long it takes for the Government to
finally decide to violate the Freedom of Speech and require Master Keys.

And I'd hope that the Linux community doesn't bend over and succumb to
that, becuase thinking logically here, if the M-Key fell in the wrong
hands it could be used without court orders.  That's the whole thing
that the Government apparently doesn't realize.

Anywayz, we'll see what happens.  I'm off of the list currently so that
I can work on my own software project for now, but I'll probably be back
on within a matter of months, we'll see how bored I get if I get free
time from my software project :-P.

	- Mike
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Re: Software Mestizo Manifesto

[Mike Coleman]

Pavel Machek <pavel@suse.cz> writes:
> You may say "please don't drop nuclear weapon". You may *not* say "you
> must not drop nuclear weapon", that would violate GPL.

I can see the headline/FUD now:

   FREE SOFTWARE FANATICS REFUSE TO DISAVOW USE OF NUCLEAR WEAPONS

:-)


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