Re: Basic reiserfs question

Re: Basic reiserfs question

[Mack Stevenson]

>Mack Stevenson wrote:
> >
> > I would like to know whether log replays take place whenever the system 
>is
> > booted or only after it has been incorrectly shutdown. I occasionaly see
> > "Warning, log replay (...)" during the boot-up sequence although the 
>system
> > had been correctly shut down, and I would like to know if I should 
>worry.


>From: Hans Reiser <reiser@namesys.com>
>To: Mack Stevenson <mackstevenson@hotmail.com>
>CC: linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org
>Subject: Re: Basic reiserfs question
>Date: Thu, 06 Sep 2001 01:50:59 +0400
>
>
>Are you using redhat?  Do your shutdown scripts unmount the filesystem only 
>if
>it is ext2?

I am using slackware (8.0), and the shutdown script on my system uses:

# Turn off swap, then unmount local file systems.
echo "Turning off swap."
swapoff -a
echo "Unmounting local file systems."
# Don't remount UMSDOS root volumes:
if [ ! "`mount | head -1 | cut -d ' ' -f 5`" = "umsdos" ]; then
  umount -a -r -t nonfs
  echo "Remounting root filesystem read-only."
  mount -n -o remount,ro /
else
  umount -a -r -t nonfs,noumsdos,nosmbfs
fi

# This never hurts:
sync

---

I guess that's not the probem, then... Actually, whenever I shutdown I never 
see any messages about the unmounting (or the mounting in readonly mode) 
failing, which only adds to my confusion.


>From: Samium Gromoff <_deepfire@mail.ru>
>To: linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org
>CC: mackstevenson@hotmail.com
>Subject: Re: Basic reiserfs question
>Date: Thu, 6 Sep 2001 03:35:49 +0000 (UTC)
>
>Actually you see "Warning" only when it is replaying log on
>fs mounted readonly.

Yes, that's the warning I see.


>I wander though why you see it only "occasionally"..
>Normally it replays log every time and you shouldnt bother.

Does it? I know next to nothing about these issues, but I thought that I had 
read somewhere that log replays only occurred after a system crashed and 
couldn't be shutdown properly.

Thank you both,

Mack S.




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Re: Basic reiserfs question

[Hans Reiser]

It seems that we should put something in journal replay that says:

"Warning: replaying a non-empty journal, this means that either your system
crashed, or its shutdown scripts need fixing (a common distro failing at the
moment), or you pushed the power button.  Don't use the hardware power button to
turn your computer off before telling the operating system software to halt
(there exists a 'halt' command you can use), the risk in doing so is that the
files you or your software were writing to at the time you pushed the button can
have garbage added to them."

Chris, do you agree?  Edward, please make this change and create a patch.

Of course, now that the distros have turned off all those annoying messages from
the kernel, most users will never see this, sigh.  I think it is a real problem
that the distros have turned off the messages at boot time....

Hans


Mack Stevenson wrote:
> 
> >Mack Stevenson wrote:
> > >
> > > I would like to know whether log replays take place whenever the system
> >is
> > > booted or only after it has been incorrectly shutdown. I occasionaly see
> > > "Warning, log replay (...)" during the boot-up sequence although the
> >system
> > > had been correctly shut down, and I would like to know if I should
> >worry.
> 
> >From: Hans Reiser <reiser@namesys.com>
> >To: Mack Stevenson <mackstevenson@hotmail.com>
> >CC: linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org
> >Subject: Re: Basic reiserfs question
> >Date: Thu, 06 Sep 2001 01:50:59 +0400
> >
> >
> >Are you using redhat?  Do your shutdown scripts unmount the filesystem only
> >if
> >it is ext2?
> 
> I am using slackware (8.0), and the shutdown script on my system uses:
> 
> # Turn off swap, then unmount local file systems.
> echo "Turning off swap."
> swapoff -a
> echo "Unmounting local file systems."
> # Don't remount UMSDOS root volumes:
> if [ ! "`mount | head -1 | cut -d ' ' -f 5`" = "umsdos" ]; then
>   umount -a -r -t nonfs
>   echo "Remounting root filesystem read-only."
>   mount -n -o remount,ro /
> else
>   umount -a -r -t nonfs,noumsdos,nosmbfs
> fi
> 
> # This never hurts:
> sync
> 
> ---
> 
> I guess that's not the probem, then... Actually, whenever I shutdown I never
> see any messages about the unmounting (or the mounting in readonly mode)
> failing, which only adds to my confusion.
> 
> >From: Samium Gromoff <_deepfire@mail.ru>
> >To: linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org
> >CC: mackstevenson@hotmail.com
> >Subject: Re: Basic reiserfs question
> >Date: Thu, 6 Sep 2001 03:35:49 +0000 (UTC)
> >
> >Actually you see "Warning" only when it is replaying log on
> >fs mounted readonly.
> 
> Yes, that's the warning I see.
> 
> >I wander though why you see it only "occasionally"..
> >Normally it replays log every time and you shouldnt bother.
> 
> Does it? I know next to nothing about these issues, but I thought that I had
> read somewhere that log replays only occurred after a system crashed and
> couldn't be shutdown properly.
> 
> Thank you both,
> 
> Mack S.
> 
> _________________________________________________________________
> Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp

Re: Basic reiserfs question

[Bob McElrath]

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Hans Reiser [reiser@namesys.com] wrote:
> Of course, now that the distros have turned off all those annoying messages from
> the kernel, most users will never see this, sigh.  I think it is a real problem
> that the distros have turned off the messages at boot time....

Heh, there are *so* many of them and they scroll by *so* fast.  I'm not
surprised they turned them off.  They should just put a message at the
very end "run the 'dmesg' command to read the preceeding boot messages.

Why is my cat pawing the desk next to my coffee like he's trying to
cover my coffee with cat litter?!?!?!  It's good coffee!!!

Cheers,
-- Bob

Bob McElrath (rsmcelrath@students.wisc.edu) 
Univ. of Wisconsin at Madison, Department of Physics

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Re: Basic reiserfs question

[Chris Mason]

On Thursday, September 06, 2001 04:56:59 PM +0400 Hans Reiser
<reiser@namesys.com> wrote:

> It seems that we should put something in journal replay that says:
> 
> "Warning: replaying a non-empty journal, this means that either your
> system crashed, or its shutdown scripts need fixing (a common distro
> failing at the moment), or you pushed the power button.  Don't use the
> hardware power button to turn your computer off before telling the
> operating system software to halt (there exists a 'halt' command you can
> use), the risk in doing so is that the files you or your software were
> writing to at the time you pushed the button can have garbage added to
> them."
> 
> Chris, do you agree?  Edward, please make this change and create a patch.

Sorry, I'm a bit slow this week, I caught a cold at linux world (apparently
the users are contagious).

Anyway, the text above is great for a man page.  kernel messages don't take
more than one line ;-)

-chris

Re[2]: Basic reiserfs question

[Nerijus Baliunas]

On Thu, 06 Sep 2001 16:56:59 +0400 Hans Reiser <reiser@namesys.com> wrote:

HR> It seems that we should put something in journal replay that says:
HR> 
HR> "Warning: replaying a non-empty journal, this means that either your system
HR> crashed, or its shutdown scripts need fixing (a common distro failing at the
HR> moment)

If you think it's RedHat, you probably are wrong - I use RH with reiserfs
a long time (more than a year - 6.2, now 7.1), and never got a message about
replaying journal if system was shut down correctly.

Regards,
Nerijus

replaying reiserfs journal and bad blocks (was: Re[3]: Basic reiserfs question)

[Nerijus Baliunas]

NB> If you think it's RedHat, you probably are wrong - I use RH with reiserfs
NB> a long time (more than a year - 6.2, now 7.1), and never got a message about
NB> replaying journal if system was shut down correctly.

After just written that, I got a real problem. There was a power loss a few minutes ago,
and I think when hdd was active. Trying to boot 2.4.7 kernel I got a message about
replaying journal, then hdd error:

hdd: dma_intr: status=0x51 { DriveReady SeekComplete Error }                    
hdd: dma_intr: error=0x40 { UncorrectableError }, LBAsect=84415, sector=36216  

and kernel panic. Please note that I mount root read-write with this kernel.

Then I rebooted 2.2.19 kernel (which mounts root as read-only if that matters):

Checking ReiserFS transaction log (device 16:42) ...
Warning, log recovery starting on readonly filesystem
hdd: dma_intr: status=0x51 { DriveReady SeekComplete Error }
hdd: dma_intr: error=0x40 { UncorrectableError }, LBAsect=84415, sector=36216
end_request: I/O error, dev 16:42 (hdd), sector 36216
Replayed 33 transactions in 6 seconds
Using r5 hash to sort names
...
ReiserFS version 3.5.32
VFS: Mounted root (reiserfs filesystem) readonly.

and system booted normally.
Now I rebooted back to 2.4.7 and everything seems to be OK.
So what to do now? Run badblocks? Change disk? Any suggestions?

Regards,
Nerijus

Re: Basic reiserfs question

[Hans Reiser]

Nerijus Baliunas wrote:
> 
> On Thu, 06 Sep 2001 16:56:59 +0400 Hans Reiser <reiser@namesys.com> wrote:
> 
> HR> It seems that we should put something in journal replay that says:
> HR>
> HR> "Warning: replaying a non-empty journal, this means that either your system
> HR> crashed, or its shutdown scripts need fixing (a common distro failing at the
> HR> moment)
> 
> If you think it's RedHat, you probably are wrong - I use RH with reiserfs
> a long time (more than a year - 6.2, now 7.1), and never got a message about
> replaying journal if system was shut down correctly.
> 
> Regards,
> Nerijus
> 
> -
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I only have secondhand reports from users who patch RedHat boot scripts as
described at the end of www.namesys.com/faq.html, so your statement leaves me
puzzled as to whether the secondhand reports were from persons who didn't
understand the boot scripts.  Comments are welcome.

Hans

Re[2]: Basic reiserfs question

[Nerijus Baliunas]

On Fri, 07 Sep 2001 11:50:06 +0400 Hans Reiser <reiser@namesys.com> wrote:

HR> Nerijus Baliunas wrote:
HR> > 
HR> > On Thu, 06 Sep 2001 16:56:59 +0400 Hans Reiser <reiser@namesys.com> wrote:
HR> > 
HR> > HR> It seems that we should put something in journal replay that says:
HR> > HR>
HR> > HR> "Warning: replaying a non-empty journal, this means that either your system
HR> > HR> crashed, or its shutdown scripts need fixing (a common distro failing at the
HR> > HR> moment)
HR> > 
HR> > If you think it's RedHat, you probably are wrong - I use RH with reiserfs
HR> > a long time (more than a year - 6.2, now 7.1), and never got a message about
HR> > replaying journal if system was shut down correctly.
HR> > 
HR> I only have secondhand reports from users who patch RedHat boot scripts as
HR> described at the end of www.namesys.com/faq.html, so your statement leaves me
HR> puzzled as to whether the secondhand reports were from persons who didn't
HR> understand the boot scripts.  Comments are welcome.

I didn't patch any boot scripts at all - they are pure RH ones.

Regards,
Nerijus

Re: Re[2]: Basic reiserfs question

[Henning P. Schmiedehausen]

Nerijus Baliunas <nerijus@users.sourceforge.net> writes:

>HR> I only have secondhand reports from users who patch RedHat boot scripts as
>HR> described at the end of www.namesys.com/faq.html, so your statement leaves me
>HR> puzzled as to whether the secondhand reports were from persons who didn't
>HR> understand the boot scripts.  Comments are welcome.

>I didn't patch any boot scripts at all - they are pure RH ones.

It's true, that the RH 6.2 scripts only remount the root-FS read-only
before rebooting if it is on ext2. This is only true for the root-FS
(not any other FS), and I could check this only on RH 6.2 (Don't know
about RH 7.x, I'd guess that they fixed it). If you don't have your
root-FS on Reiser / XFS / JFS, you have no problem with RH 6.x

The FAQ entry from namesys is just misleading. 

	Regards
		Henning

-- 
Dipl.-Inf. (Univ.) Henning P. Schmiedehausen       -- Geschaeftsfuehrer
INTERMETA - Gesellschaft fuer Mehrwertdienste mbH     hps@intermeta.de

Am Schwabachgrund 22  Fon.: 09131 / 50654-0   info@intermeta.de
D-91054 Buckenhof     Fax.: 09131 / 50654-20   

Re: Basic reiserfs question

[Nerijus Baliunas]

On Fri, 07 Sep 2001 11:50:06 +0400 Hans Reiser <reiser@namesys.com> wrote:

HR> I only have secondhand reports from users who patch RedHat boot scripts as
HR> described at the end of www.namesys.com/faq.html, so your statement leaves me
HR> puzzled as to whether the secondhand reports were from persons who didn't
HR> understand the boot scripts.  Comments are welcome.

Hello,

I took time to read FAQ, and here are few comments.

1 - I understand you don't like RedHat, but instead of ranting, you could
just say that gcc-2.96 from RH updates or RH 7.1 is OK (Alan Cox even
recommends it for compiling recent 2.4 kernels).

16 - also "df -i" shows that there are no used inodes on reiserfs partitions.

36 - Can I use /sbin/badblocks -b <reiserfs-block-size> on existing
reiserfs partition?

39 - a link to "I'm not using RedHat's special release of a buggy compiler"
(http://www.namesys.com/gcc-2.96) is not found.

40 - spelling error "ResierFS".

41 - there is nothing about how to solve it.

Regards,
Nerijus

Re: replaying reiserfs journal and bad blocks (was: Re[3]: Basic reiserfs question)

[Hans Reiser]

Nerijus Baliunas wrote:
> 
> NB> If you think it's RedHat, you probably are wrong - I use RH with reiserfs
> NB> a long time (more than a year - 6.2, now 7.1), and never got a message about
> NB> replaying journal if system was shut down correctly.
> 
> After just written that, I got a real problem. There was a power loss a few minutes ago,
> and I think when hdd was active. Trying to boot 2.4.7 kernel I got a message about
> replaying journal, then hdd error:
> 
> hdd: dma_intr: status=0x51 { DriveReady SeekComplete Error }
> hdd: dma_intr: error=0x40 { UncorrectableError }, LBAsect=84415, sector=36216
> 
> and kernel panic. Please note that I mount root read-write with this kernel.
> 
> Then I rebooted 2.2.19 kernel (which mounts root as read-only if that matters):
> 
> Checking ReiserFS transaction log (device 16:42) ...
> Warning, log recovery starting on readonly filesystem
> hdd: dma_intr: status=0x51 { DriveReady SeekComplete Error }
> hdd: dma_intr: error=0x40 { UncorrectableError }, LBAsect=84415, sector=36216
> end_request: I/O error, dev 16:42 (hdd), sector 36216
> Replayed 33 transactions in 6 seconds
> Using r5 hash to sort names
> ...
> ReiserFS version 3.5.32
> VFS: Mounted root (reiserfs filesystem) readonly.
> 
> and system booted normally.
> Now I rebooted back to 2.4.7 and everything seems to be OK.
> So what to do now? Run badblocks? Change disk? Any suggestions?
> 
> Regards,
> Nerijus
My guess is turn off UDMA, I think we have a www.namesys.com/faq.html entry on
that which you can read and see if my memory of the typical symptoms of flaky
udma are correct.  Commenting on the cause of flaky udma I will leave to others
familiar with your mob's interaction with Linux, except to say that one should
always check cables at a time like this.

Hans

Re: replaying reiserfs journal and bad blocks (was: Re[3]: Basic

[Alan Cox]

> > hdd: dma_intr: status=0x51 { DriveReady SeekComplete Error }
> > hdd: dma_intr: error=0x40 { UncorrectableError }, LBAsect=84415, sector=36216

Thats the drive deciding it cant read the block. 

> My guess is turn off UDMA, I think we have a www.namesys.com/faq.html entry on
> that which you can read and see if my memory of the typical symptoms of flaky
> udma are correct.  Commenting on the cause of flaky udma I will leave to others
> familiar with your mob's interaction with Linux, except to say that one should> always check cables at a time like this.

You'd expect CRC errors then. It looks like the 2.2 log replay code worked
but the 2.4 log replay code failed on the error, or the layers below it in
the IDE got stuck.