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From: Florian Weimer <fweimer@redhat.com>
To: Linus Torvalds <torvalds@linux-foundation.org>
Cc: Nick Desaulniers <ndesaulniers@google.com>,
	 "H. Peter Anvin" <hpa@zytor.com>,
	 Bill Wendling <morbo@google.com>,
	 Thomas Gleixner <tglx@linutronix.de>,
	 Ingo Molnar <mingo@redhat.com>,  Borislav Petkov <bp@alien8.de>,
	 Dave Hansen <dave.hansen@linux.intel.com>,
	"maintainer:X86 ARCHITECTURE (32-BIT AND 64-BIT)"
	<x86@kernel.org>, Nathan Chancellor <nathan@kernel.org>,
	 Juergen Gross <jgross@suse.com>,
	Peter Zijlstra <peterz@infradead.org>,
	 Andy Lutomirski <luto@kernel.org>,
	 llvm@lists.linux.dev,  LKML <linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org>,
	 linux-toolchains <linux-toolchains@vger.kernel.org>
Subject: Re: [PATCH v5] x86: use builtins to read eflags
Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2022 21:13:05 +0100	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <878rt8gwxa.fsf@oldenburg.str.redhat.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <CAHk-=whJfKN8Jag=8DS=pbZR3TY90znUOP6Km+TLRJ9dZEgNqw@mail.gmail.com> (Linus Torvalds's message of "Thu, 17 Mar 2022 11:52:26 -0700")

* Linus Torvalds:

> You can actually operate on EFLAGS at multiple granularities.
>
>  - normal pushf/popf. Don't do it unless you are doing system software.

There's one exception: PUSHF/twiddle/POPF/PUSHF/compare is the
recommended sequence to detect CPUID support on i386 (in userspace and
elsewhere).

>  - you can use lahf/sahc to load/store only the arithmetic flags
> into/from AH. Deprecated, and going away, but historically supported.

And these instructions were missing from the original long mode, but
they were added back.

> Yes, yes, that complete mental breakdown with pushf/popf did get
> fixed, but it really makes me very wary of thinking that we should
> ever use a built-in that compiler writers really fundamentally got so
> wrong before.
>
> What would make me think that you'd get it right now? In user space,
> you'll basically never actually see the whole system flags issues, so
> your test-cases would never work or be very contrieved. You'd have to
> really work at it to see the problems.

I think as the result of the nature of that kind of bug it does not
matter whether you use a compiler builtin to access the flags (to put
their combined value into a general-purpose register).

GCC doesn't have barriers in the built-ins (if we are talking about
__builtin_ia32_readeflags_u64 and __builtin_ia32_writeeflags_u64).  I
expect they are actually pretty useless, and were merely added for
completeness of the intrinsics headers.

It's not that you can write

  unsigned a, b, c;
  // …
  c = a + b;

and examine __builtin_ia32_readeflags_u64() to see if there was an
overflow.  Neither GCC nor Clang model the EFLAGS register and
arithmetic expression side effects to make this possible.

Thanks,
Florian


  parent reply	other threads:[~2022-03-17 20:13 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 68+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2021-12-15 21:18 [PATCH] x86: use builtins to read eflags Bill Wendling
2021-12-15 22:46 ` Nathan Chancellor
2021-12-15 23:26 ` Peter Zijlstra
2021-12-16 20:00   ` Bill Wendling
2021-12-16 20:07     ` Nick Desaulniers
2021-12-16  0:57 ` Thomas Gleixner
2021-12-16 19:55   ` Bill Wendling
2021-12-17 12:48     ` Peter Zijlstra
2021-12-17 19:39     ` Thomas Gleixner
2022-03-14 23:09     ` H. Peter Anvin
2022-03-15  0:08       ` Bill Wendling
2021-12-16 19:58   ` Nick Desaulniers
2021-12-29  2:12 ` [PATCH v2] " Bill Wendling
2022-01-27 20:56   ` Bill Wendling
2022-02-04  0:16   ` Thomas Gleixner
2022-02-04  0:58     ` Bill Wendling
2022-02-04  0:57   ` [PATCH v3] " Bill Wendling
2022-02-07 22:11     ` Nick Desaulniers
2022-02-08  9:14       ` David Laight
2022-02-08 23:18         ` Bill Wendling
2022-02-14 23:53         ` Nick Desaulniers
2022-02-10 22:31     ` [PATCH v4] " Bill Wendling
2022-02-11 16:40       ` David Laight
2022-02-11 19:25         ` Bill Wendling
2022-02-11 22:09           ` David Laight
2022-02-11 23:33             ` Bill Wendling
2022-02-12  0:24           ` Nick Desaulniers
2022-02-12  9:23             ` Bill Wendling
2022-02-15  0:33               ` Nick Desaulniers
2022-03-01 20:19       ` [PATCH v5] " Bill Wendling
2022-03-14 23:07         ` Bill Wendling
     [not found]           ` <AC3D873E-A28B-41F1-8BF4-2F6F37BCEEB4@zytor.com>
2022-03-15  7:19             ` Bill Wendling
2022-03-17 15:43               ` H. Peter Anvin
2022-03-17 18:00                 ` Nick Desaulniers
2022-03-17 18:52                   ` Linus Torvalds
2022-03-17 19:45                     ` Bill Wendling
2022-03-17 20:13                       ` Linus Torvalds
2022-03-17 21:10                         ` Bill Wendling
2022-03-17 21:21                           ` Linus Torvalds
2022-03-17 21:45                             ` Bill Wendling
2022-03-17 22:51                               ` Linus Torvalds
2022-03-17 23:14                                 ` Linus Torvalds
2022-03-17 23:19                                 ` Segher Boessenkool
2022-03-17 23:31                                   ` Linus Torvalds
2022-03-18  0:05                                     ` Segher Boessenkool
2022-03-17 22:37                       ` Segher Boessenkool
2022-03-17 20:13                     ` Florian Weimer [this message]
2022-03-17 20:36                       ` Linus Torvalds
2022-03-18  0:25                         ` Segher Boessenkool
2022-03-18  1:21                           ` Linus Torvalds
2022-03-18  1:50                             ` Linus Torvalds
2022-03-17 21:05                     ` Andrew Cooper
2022-03-17 21:39                       ` Linus Torvalds
2022-03-18 17:59                         ` Andy Lutomirski
2022-03-18 18:19                           ` Linus Torvalds
2022-03-18 21:48                             ` Andrew Cooper
2022-03-18 23:10                               ` Linus Torvalds
2022-03-18 23:42                                 ` Segher Boessenkool
2022-03-19  1:13                                   ` Linus Torvalds
2022-03-19 23:15                                   ` Andy Lutomirski
2022-03-18 22:09                             ` Segher Boessenkool
2022-03-18 22:33                               ` H. Peter Anvin
2022-03-18 22:36                               ` David Laight
2022-03-18 22:47                                 ` H. Peter Anvin
2022-03-18 22:43                             ` David Laight
2022-03-18 23:03                               ` H. Peter Anvin
2022-03-18 23:04                         ` Segher Boessenkool
2022-03-18 23:52                           ` David Laight

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