From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from mail-lf1-f51.google.com (mail-lf1-f51.google.com [209.85.167.51]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by smtp.subspace.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 98AC41C69D for ; Mon, 6 Jan 2025 14:39:22 +0000 (UTC) Authentication-Results: smtp.subspace.kernel.org; arc=none smtp.client-ip=209.85.167.51 ARC-Seal:i=1; a=rsa-sha256; d=subspace.kernel.org; s=arc-20240116; t=1736174365; cv=none; b=QzlRVElRDX/+ukvULo0uIwvwIHLD2fhaJgGOwrNUVJX7xzpxFBFMvX0ZhRNsFL2v6Pr6uoLLg1uw9rOkyapFVQUR7CRM+vgDSpgdx3CGBjp/YvpvlfS9Du/JfATGNf/D2wKmmiW+gk45mNEW+54AsyugRxZq93gaTCnmc1w7Mh0= ARC-Message-Signature:i=1; a=rsa-sha256; d=subspace.kernel.org; s=arc-20240116; t=1736174365; c=relaxed/simple; bh=0MwAaiKZvtWvZA8vqVSveS1BCAORPxilApk9BlQQfec=; h=From:To:Cc:Subject:In-Reply-To:References:Date:Message-ID: MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=dQz1YSBQ30cWcaOdQajRQP/DRDZzqe8Ss3NwMs7RbUkM+6TccdfldnBOn8/ZRPSiygD9+x0gUt2jV4yH3O2gyeSfpJJbi4ax1thieWIHyzB4uYYpbTQZEPbiKk8QJyUAHBU3iAv2cQXgiHdxhO3iP/ZL489eYEjRmeRvicFnaL0= ARC-Authentication-Results:i=1; smtp.subspace.kernel.org; dmarc=none (p=none dis=none) header.from=waldekranz.com; spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=waldekranz.com; dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=waldekranz-com.20230601.gappssmtp.com header.i=@waldekranz-com.20230601.gappssmtp.com header.b=tn6Ebh3/; arc=none smtp.client-ip=209.85.167.51 Authentication-Results: smtp.subspace.kernel.org; dmarc=none (p=none dis=none) header.from=waldekranz.com Authentication-Results: smtp.subspace.kernel.org; spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=waldekranz.com Authentication-Results: smtp.subspace.kernel.org; dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=waldekranz-com.20230601.gappssmtp.com header.i=@waldekranz-com.20230601.gappssmtp.com header.b="tn6Ebh3/" Received: by mail-lf1-f51.google.com with SMTP id 2adb3069b0e04-53f757134cdso15306160e87.2 for ; Mon, 06 Jan 2025 06:39:21 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=waldekranz-com.20230601.gappssmtp.com; s=20230601; t=1736174360; x=1736779160; darn=vger.kernel.org; h=content-transfer-encoding:mime-version:message-id:date:references :in-reply-to:subject:cc:to:from:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id :reply-to; bh=tpOH+Vk42pIySfwZc+3b4dkxw9D5HiZHSYRzJLEA65U=; b=tn6Ebh3/hT9v76PI6H9CPUpNMAKtyCBpOYHuNSq6+57Jp5bzM5FfJyQJdDh2SseuI8 foAKy/D1bBsR4OexSMeBUb/aUD1CDB3w7L9FLWKMU9tJDoqDI+h53DGLk7kFi5WMai0L QNgQD0Zld4+NqDrq+FQjHNFTTI9zdX+WZaMDni2Ous2/gUI5qLgaD3oIVKDqgssb0SJf 2aLYBM8fEfqigs4xyqu6c2rtxZSI9U6CKMJJcAvZrsQISPnYvp0fgq/Co8uOrcBY5TTp kVEiwkswMq4L37iJWC1G/wZgXSuG+AjSCIM7NnWJEDXe5zRjvNsOcxLMv6Hce804O4rN YmLQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20230601; t=1736174360; x=1736779160; h=content-transfer-encoding:mime-version:message-id:date:references :in-reply-to:subject:cc:to:from:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc :subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=tpOH+Vk42pIySfwZc+3b4dkxw9D5HiZHSYRzJLEA65U=; b=VMZcJMDS8DlRfCpxAgHhdY2sSrz+vuVyHcYIstQt2DTyGvN0CMFIdjDrKOr47VsLw8 LoMakEsas5/tkSjzEv3tjAi7U1KZDsdvG6ivpsjvjlb5aSN4ztq9j97Iv/l0Ltr+w3+h G1kpgLN4qb/EKGptMNjFjs0lbJyJ9/vSXLq9bhdon5t8vU18yKHMHUvLrx07E0rmZobj /QMT3RrMFR3zU+H1NYEvkFLohn7qs1CAXhGOEaJSXj363XacVAk+YfC3f/nEuuq/jXj1 KGDwr+cuC6UvlSHS5v03XGiLjV70/OhHF5RUeIwEvy6Y5+RFAxDPpyWYBKkUNRrgy5zm 0TKA== X-Forwarded-Encrypted: i=1; AJvYcCXBwd5hhrxBJsIqvvw1bl7MmBRFyE9FYmL0or8m24NgdIEphu2Q6BxOj3mYPhqBkGvqHY7lULE=@vger.kernel.org X-Gm-Message-State: AOJu0YyJlHl39KHFFoFoYWLfcwM3FEzG6SuJ0SqgEQMvUjGVre2XZ71m p8vR5Zotsqp15Av4F5v77R6xQWZaseI+WZGz0/9BJ3SzOZ51871+faLhOvyokk4= X-Gm-Gg: ASbGncv23RDMa68g4xgqRvpWqZTWJYRRNQQX/KvyXghMt+pkz52WG8ofOiD8u5JL109 kEjbLUlAv980tloQg7oAMjruAa5YDAUBvDoLzjn35kvLsId2PGR4tPPqNGT3VhPsvRF2GanMV1c Z31ub/tTHnz1Raqj1hOJyFbjQiDqBt4dmvVmBwCm9I/pl8MHYQoO+WL2KP7CeXMKvfVVSafxRxe 9L/Nj06eQ0ovA9YQTxChP8if4I4RRZmrnZjMs0CbyNvvtZ1qY7+LxwdTTnAgkSVOqwqKsmmQzjP wds8KQYoAaT7Rw== X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGHT+IEYzNYgLYbNCqVK31QCisG2QOUTZWpQ9q4gXe3TiI0tZs8IBbhEvEaYATDqHS4yDof7nDwF2w== X-Received: by 2002:a05:6512:2399:b0:53e:395c:688e with SMTP id 2adb3069b0e04-54229524737mr18573340e87.10.1736174360058; Mon, 06 Jan 2025 06:39:20 -0800 (PST) Received: from wkz-x13 (h-176-10-159-15.NA.cust.bahnhof.se. [176.10.159.15]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id 2adb3069b0e04-542238138fbsm4852529e87.159.2025.01.06.06.39.17 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Mon, 06 Jan 2025 06:39:19 -0800 (PST) From: Tobias Waldekranz To: "Russell King (Oracle)" Cc: davem@davemloft.net, kuba@kernel.org, andrew@lunn.ch, f.fainelli@gmail.com, olteanv@gmail.com, netdev@vger.kernel.org, chris.packham@alliedtelesis.co.nz, pabeni@redhat.com, marek.behun@nic.cz Subject: Re: [PATCH v2 net 3/4] net: dsa: mv88e6xxx: Never force link on in-band managed MACs In-Reply-To: References: <20241219123106.730032-1-tobias@waldekranz.com> <20241219123106.730032-4-tobias@waldekranz.com> <87zfk974br.fsf@waldekranz.com> <87pll26z2b.fsf@waldekranz.com> <87msg66uh4.fsf@waldekranz.com> <87h66c7sa6.fsf@waldekranz.com> Date: Mon, 06 Jan 2025 15:39:17 +0100 Message-ID: <87ed1g6m7e.fsf@waldekranz.com> Precedence: bulk X-Mailing-List: netdev@vger.kernel.org List-Id: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On m=C3=A5n, jan 06, 2025 at 08:20, "Russell King (Oracle)" wrote: > On Mon, Jan 06, 2025 at 12:30:25AM +0100, Tobias Waldekranz wrote: >> On s=C3=B6n, jan 05, 2025 at 10:41, "Russell King (Oracle)" wrote: >> > On Sun, Jan 05, 2025 at 12:16:07AM +0100, Tobias Waldekranz wrote: >> >> On l=C3=B6r, jan 04, 2025 at 22:09, "Russell King (Oracle)" wrote: >> >> > Host system: >> >> > >> >> > ---------------------------+ >> >> > NIC (or DSA switch port) | >> >> > +-------+ +-------+ | >> >> > | | | | | >> >> > | MAC <----> PCS <-----------------------> PHY, SFP or med= ia >> >> > | | | | | ^ >> >> > +-------+ +-------+ | | >> >> > | phy interface type >> >> > ---------------------------+ also in-band signalling >> >> > which managed =3D "in-band-status" >> >> > applies to >> >>=20 >> >> This part is 100% clear >> > >> > Apparently it isn't, because... >> > >> >> In other words, my question is: >> >>=20 >> >> For a NIC driver to properly support the `managed` property, how shou= ld >> >> the setup and/or runtime behavior of the hardware and/or the driver >> >> differ with the two following configs? >> >>=20 >> >> ð0 { >> >> phy-connection-type =3D "sgmii"; >> >> managed =3D "auto"; >> >> }; >> >>=20 >> >> vs. >> >>=20 >> >> ð0 { >> >> phy-connection-type =3D "sgmii"; >> >> managed =3D "in-band-status"; >> >> }; >> > >> > if it were, you wouldn't be asking this question. >> > >> > Once again. The "managed" property defines whether in-band signalling >> > is used over the "phy-connection-type" link, which for SGMII will be >> > between the PCS and PHY, as shown in my diagram above that you claim >> > to understand 100%, but by the fact you are again asking this question, >> > you do not understand it AT ALL. >> > >> > I don't know how to better explain it to you, because I think I've been >> > absolutely clear at every stage what the "managed" property describes. >> > I now have nothing further to add if you still can't understand it, so, >> > sorry, I'm giving up answering your emails on this topic, because it's >> > just too frustrating to me to continue if you still don't "get it". >>=20 >> I agree that you have clearly explained what it describes, many times. >>=20 >> My remaining question - which you acknowledge that I asked twice, yet >> chose not to answer - was how software is supposed to _act_ on that > > I *have* answered it. Every time. > >> description; presuming that the property is not in the DT merely for >> documentation purposes. > > Utter claptap. Total rubbish. Completely wrong. It is acted on. It I have _never_ said that is was not. In the very sentence you are quoting I stated my presumption that it was _not_ merely there as documentation. I simply wanted to _how_ the kernel acts on it - the thing you summerize with the following sentence... > causes phylink to enter in-band mode, and use the PCS to obtain the > in-band data instead of the PHY. ..._this_ is the process I wanted to learn more about. How phylink operates in the two different modes, what the responsibilites of the NIC driver are, of the PHY driver (if applicable), etc. > YOU are the one refusing to listen to what I'm saying, yet you claim > my explanations are clear and you understand them. You parently do > not. I am sure that there are several points you have made that I ought to have groked sooner, and that I could have stated my questions more clearly. I am only human. Let me assure you that I have read each of your replies many times over, each time wanting nothing more than to have that light bulb moment. Sincerely, I am thankful that you have taken the time to try to help me, and I never meant to cause any distress.