From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from pandora.armlinux.org.uk (pandora.armlinux.org.uk [78.32.30.218]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by smtp.subspace.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 3EC651AF0AF for ; Fri, 7 Feb 2025 22:24:49 +0000 (UTC) Authentication-Results: smtp.subspace.kernel.org; arc=none smtp.client-ip=78.32.30.218 ARC-Seal:i=1; a=rsa-sha256; d=subspace.kernel.org; s=arc-20240116; t=1738967092; cv=none; b=cR03E1cG8KtpOwJCLBq0siSX+TpCmB+rn9QagARW0DX9iJFR+xMAu4JPrQhWCwdWLpKgFS7eTkIgZs3nhAjrgwC1kY158eYmDjq2gWlmHU6P3pQQlwi3FjNjEiucrooab0s1jpPqLWKrT191P01815i/YAQRMCkDGuDoeskw4wI= ARC-Message-Signature:i=1; a=rsa-sha256; d=subspace.kernel.org; s=arc-20240116; t=1738967092; c=relaxed/simple; bh=gP0q6CW5UZzio7Hn7Euqlgiwc60rYoIrIPkdrG0VrM4=; h=Date:From:To:Cc:Subject:Message-ID:References:MIME-Version: Content-Type:Content-Disposition:In-Reply-To; b=IYQ99xw38FhfLHEAMNL8BxOp1/M7GKpEjyBbiNLoeIqdAUmQQ894I1i5hSgXJ8m9fBOQODC0wLWLMYHJ7VzaaWLj1+6hPN+OAOgiVSgFz4vEJyIAUZ0v/bU3Cj2I6WWds/mb1ilkDsnKQjORE2UHq+FWjOk+lQlwYE3TShYKjQE= ARC-Authentication-Results:i=1; smtp.subspace.kernel.org; dmarc=pass (p=none dis=none) header.from=armlinux.org.uk; spf=none smtp.mailfrom=armlinux.org.uk; dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=armlinux.org.uk header.i=@armlinux.org.uk header.b=0EwlWid4; arc=none smtp.client-ip=78.32.30.218 Authentication-Results: smtp.subspace.kernel.org; dmarc=pass (p=none dis=none) header.from=armlinux.org.uk Authentication-Results: smtp.subspace.kernel.org; spf=none smtp.mailfrom=armlinux.org.uk Authentication-Results: smtp.subspace.kernel.org; dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=armlinux.org.uk header.i=@armlinux.org.uk header.b="0EwlWid4" DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=armlinux.org.uk; s=pandora-2019; h=Sender:In-Reply-To:Content-Type: MIME-Version:References:Message-ID:Subject:Cc:To:From:Date:Reply-To: Content-Transfer-Encoding:Content-ID:Content-Description:Resent-Date: Resent-From:Resent-Sender:Resent-To:Resent-Cc:Resent-Message-ID:List-Id: List-Help:List-Unsubscribe:List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=Ucl/GOWiAbFSVtfu4fuiBKlLWVdkIuebAW+pzGN/cWQ=; b=0EwlWid4ktr90Dkzk/x4n56Lde 5e9qMNBwVHipCinIIpY8zIZrMqh0Bmp8qp3lFauwxNpRChQIKvy9nLM9KFyHFHb2HnjUUHKNnmDcj tSL0cz+8Y/TeVV5xuIA++gMJKOz7dK7LztAoddAl9HE5UirHc/786tEfkG3+Jb4j8Rdpx0ZeGqRLL qDFdVfYElp0kdtCUCAbEvB4g6L+rGp/OGFglOFUxs83jt7fliek64uHU7eQesiizQiIOInFfiI+2T DkXFrRa/QRSOVJBIgtHTSUdDrvuUOEOrSDovdc1eHQZwgFpmvy+wePFZo3NFLplkvfcnMLbcu48+1 IdskfqXA==; Received: from shell.armlinux.org.uk ([fd8f:7570:feb6:1:5054:ff:fe00:4ec]:47456) by pandora.armlinux.org.uk with esmtpsa (TLS1.3) tls TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (Exim 4.96) (envelope-from ) id 1tgWm1-0007Ay-1q; Fri, 07 Feb 2025 22:24:33 +0000 Received: from linux by shell.armlinux.org.uk with local (Exim 4.96) (envelope-from ) id 1tgWlw-0004oo-0L; Fri, 07 Feb 2025 22:24:28 +0000 Date: Fri, 7 Feb 2025 22:24:27 +0000 From: "Russell King (Oracle)" To: Vladimir Oltean Cc: Andrew Lunn , Heiner Kallweit , AngeloGioacchino Del Regno , "Chester A. Unal" , Daniel Golle , "David S. Miller" , DENG Qingfang , Eric Dumazet , Jakub Kicinski , linux-arm-kernel@lists.infradead.org, linux-mediatek@lists.infradead.org, Matthias Brugger , netdev@vger.kernel.org, Paolo Abeni , Sean Wang , Simon Horman Subject: Re: [PATCH net-next v2 2/3] net: dsa: allow use of phylink managed EEE support Message-ID: References: <20250207151959.jab2c36oejmdhf3k@skbuf> <20250207213823.2uofelxulqxpdtka@skbuf> Precedence: bulk X-Mailing-List: netdev@vger.kernel.org List-Id: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20250207213823.2uofelxulqxpdtka@skbuf> Sender: Russell King (Oracle) On Fri, Feb 07, 2025 at 11:38:23PM +0200, Vladimir Oltean wrote: > On Fri, Feb 07, 2025 at 03:33:46PM +0000, Russell King (Oracle) wrote: > > Bah - actually I _did_ update the patch, but in a different tree: > > I'm glad there's a reasonable explanation for what appears to be an > oversight on your part, and I wish to make nothing more out of the event > in itself. > > I just want you to know that it was really hard for me, looking back in > that thread to make sure I'm not misremembering that I asked for this > change, to get reminded how quick you were to jump to an insulting and > sarcastic conclusion in that same reply. It was a shit reaction and it > really didn't sit well with me then, and it still doesn't sit any better > re-reading it 3 weeks later either. It was not intended to be insulting and sarcastic. It was based on a general observation from a whole raft of patch series that has led me to the conclusion that cover messages are basically completely ignored. Many times, I've posed questions in cover messages... and have _never_ got a response to those questions. I'd even started experimenting putting stuff in the cover messages to provoke some kind of a response... and got nothing. I had got to the point of wondering why I'm bothering to write expansive and detailed cover messages. Everything was pointing towards cover messages being wholesale ignored - and it was a complete waste of time writing them. Having got to that point, to then get asked, basically, "why are you including this patch" when I already said in the cover message for the _RFC_ series (requesting comments - obviously not a submission) that the 10th patch was preparatory for DSA, and would be included along with a user when it's submitted - that all suggested to me that, yet again, the cover message hadn't been read. You've said that you do read them (thanks) but I think you're probably the only one, and I still question their value given the lack of engagement with cover messages. This is a serious point. What use are cover messages on patch series beyond providing an anchor to tie a patch series to and provide a diffstat? Given my observations over the last year, I don't think including very much else adds any value. Certainly not asking pertinent questions. Certainly not describing the patches in the series. Certainly not describing the overall rationale, nor (apparently) the plan for the patches. You may have noticed that I'm no longer putting as much effort into cover messages - and this is precisely why. I honestly don't see that there's any point in spending much time on cover messages anymore. -- RMK's Patch system: https://www.armlinux.org.uk/developer/patches/ FTTP is here! 80Mbps down 10Mbps up. Decent connectivity at last!