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From: Joe Damato <jdamato@fastly.com>
To: Willem de Bruijn <willemdebruijn.kernel@gmail.com>
Cc: Martin Karsten <mkarsten@uwaterloo.ca>,
	Samiullah Khawaja <skhawaja@google.com>,
	Jakub Kicinski <kuba@kernel.org>,
	"David S . Miller" <davem@davemloft.net>,
	Eric Dumazet <edumazet@google.com>,
	Paolo Abeni <pabeni@redhat.com>,
	almasrymina@google.com, willemb@google.com,
	netdev@vger.kernel.org
Subject: Re: [PATCH net-next v5 0/4] Add support to do threaded napi busy poll
Date: Mon, 28 Apr 2025 10:39:52 -0700	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <aA-9aEokobuckLtV@LQ3V64L9R2> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <680fb23bb1953_23f881294d9@willemb.c.googlers.com.notmuch>

On Mon, Apr 28, 2025 at 12:52:11PM -0400, Willem de Bruijn wrote:
> Martin Karsten wrote:
> > On 2025-04-24 16:02, Samiullah Khawaja wrote:

> Ack on documentation of the pros/cons.

In my mind this includes documenting CPU usage which I know is
considered as "non-goal" of this series. It can be a "non-goal" but
it is still very relevant to the conversation and documentation.

> There is also a functional argument for this feature. It brings
> parity with userspace network stacks like DPDK and Google's SNAP [1].
> These also run packet (and L4+) network processing on dedicated cores,
> and by default do so in polling mode. An XDP plane currently lacks
> this well understood configuration. This brings it closer to parity.

It would be good if this could also be included in the cover letter,
I think, possibly with example use cases.

> Users of such advanced environments can be expected to be well
> familiar with the cost of polling. The cost/benefit can be debated
> and benchmarked for individual applications. But there clearly are
> active uses for polling, so I think it should be an operating system
> facility.

You mention users of advanced environments, but I think it's
important to consider the average user who is not necessarily a
kernel programmer.

Will that user understand that not all apps support this? Or will
they think that they can simply run a few YNL commands burning CPUs at
100% for apps that don't even support this thinking they are making
their networking faster?

I think providing a mechanism to burn CPU cores at 100% CPU by
enabling threaded busy poll has serious consequences on power
consumption, cooling requirements, and, errr, earth. I don't think
it's a decision to be taken lightly.

  reply	other threads:[~2025-04-28 17:39 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 23+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2025-04-24 20:02 [PATCH net-next v5 0/4] Add support to do threaded napi busy poll Samiullah Khawaja
2025-04-24 20:02 ` [PATCH net-next v5 1/4] net: Create separate gro_flush helper function Samiullah Khawaja
2025-04-24 23:21   ` Joe Damato
2025-04-24 20:02 ` [PATCH net-next v5 2/4] net: define an enum for the napi threaded state Samiullah Khawaja
2025-04-24 23:40   ` Joe Damato
2025-04-26  1:36   ` Jakub Kicinski
2025-04-26  3:54     ` Samiullah Khawaja
2025-04-24 20:02 ` [PATCH net-next v5 3/4] Extend napi threaded polling to allow kthread based busy polling Samiullah Khawaja
2025-04-24 23:42   ` Joe Damato
2025-04-24 20:02 ` [PATCH net-next v5 4/4] selftests: Add napi threaded busy poll test in `busy_poller` Samiullah Khawaja
2025-04-28 13:50 ` [PATCH net-next v5 0/4] Add support to do threaded napi busy poll Martin Karsten
2025-04-28 16:52   ` Willem de Bruijn
2025-04-28 17:39     ` Joe Damato [this message]
2025-04-28 17:59       ` Willem de Bruijn
2025-04-28 18:05         ` Martin Karsten
2025-04-30 12:37           ` David Laight
2025-04-30 16:47             ` Samiullah Khawaja
2025-04-28 18:05     ` Martin Karsten
2025-04-28 18:20       ` Willem de Bruijn
2025-04-30 15:23   ` Martin Karsten
2025-04-30 16:58     ` Samiullah Khawaja
2025-04-30 19:57       ` Martin Karsten
2025-04-30 20:33         ` Samiullah Khawaja

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