From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from list by monty-python.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.24) id 1AtOEm-0007cY-EY for qemu-devel@nongnu.org; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 04:43:24 -0500 Received: from mail by monty-python.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.24) id 1AtOEC-0006j6-V6 for qemu-devel@nongnu.org; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 04:43:20 -0500 Received: from [62.210.158.41] (helo=moscou.magic.fr) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.24) id 1AtOEA-0006fZ-Op for qemu-devel@nongnu.org; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 04:42:46 -0500 Received: from 10.0.0.2 (ppp-181.net-555.magic.fr [62.210.255.181]) by moscou.magic.fr (8.11.6/8.10.1) with ESMTP id i1I9ggb11571 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 10:42:42 +0100 (CET) Subject: Re: [Qemu-devel] PPC emulation on Qemu From: "J. Mayer" In-Reply-To: <1076915377.6957.222.camel@gaston> References: <1076854076.25228.1309.camel@rapid> <1076855825.14624.5.camel@localhost> <1076861194.25360.1433.camel@rapid> <1076885041.6959.113.camel@gaston> <1076902475.28421.2137.camel@rapid> <1076904537.6960.193.camel@gaston> <1076905652.25228.2193.camel@rapid> <1076915377.6957.222.camel@gaston> Content-Type: text/plain Message-Id: <1077097365.30204.7.camel@rapid> Mime-Version: 1.0 Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2004 10:42:45 +0100 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Reply-To: qemu-devel@nongnu.org List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , To: qemu-devel@nongnu.org On Mon, 2004-02-16 at 08:09, Benjamin Herrenschmidt wrote: > > > What is OpenPPC standard ? So far, the most "standard" PPCs are > > > PowerMacs ;) > > > > Well, G4 Macs are close to OpenPPC standard, which is an open platform > > which has been described by IBM. I like it has a reference because it's > > nearly Macs and because AIX, MacOS (X I suppose) and Linux should be > > able to run on it. > > You mean CHRP ? Hrm... AIX ? hehe, I wouldn't bet on that :) OS X > neither. But at least for OS X, you can write your own drivers, > like MOL does. > No, I meant OpenPPC, but it seems that IBM doesn't promote it anymore: the pages disapeared from their site.... So maybe it's now another virtual standard platform :-( > > Yes I know it can run Linux, but what I wanted to point is that (if I'm > > not wrong) it's not able to run any OS (ie AIX or pegasos or, why not > > (?), BeOS or AmigaOS) like a real machine would. > > It could. All depends on which HW you emulate. Yes, I'd like qemu to be able to emulate the largest combination of hw... I don't really know if I will ever try to emulate Amiga, but as the main use of PPC is embedded hardwares, it sounds good to have an easily "hw" tunable emulator... > > I agree that MOL exactly intend to do this, and does it well, but I > > think qemu should really emulate the whole execution environment... > > > > Does the OSI calls mechanism needs patched OS and/or firmware ? > > It's an addition. MOL can run without it, it's just an optimisation > so you can load special drivers into the host OS to makes things > much faster / more useable. All right, it seems to me that you can not always patch the emulated system for different reasons... > On MacOS, it makes a lot of sense since the drivers can be provided > by the bootloader at boot or even in the ROM of some PCI cards, so > MOL can transparently get those loaded into the host operating > system when it's MacOS 9 or X. OK, seems a good way for proceeding. > Also, for OS X, MOL actually loads a special kext that patches the > kernel to remove it's use of MMU split mode, which isn't necessary > under emulation and actually very slow to emulate. This, I'd like to avoid, as I'd like to keep the system in the state it is... But I may change my mind. I just rsync'ed the latest mol, and it appears to me that openbios isn't inside. It seems that it's only available through proprietary bk software... Is there a way to get it using a standard open mechanism (ie rsync or CVS ?). It would be glad, as I cannot and never want to use any proprietary software on my linux boxes... -- J. Mayer Never organized