Re: [Qemu-devel] CFP: 1st International QEMU Users Forum

Re: [Qemu-devel] CFP: 1st International QEMU Users Forum

[François Revol]

>> the people we are addressing and we would like to bring together is from the QEMU emulation community.
>> We are interested in running different ISAs mainly under Linux and Windows versions. There is a huge additional
> 
> You're about the first person in 1/2 year that actually said you care about Windows hosts. Windows support for example is currently on the verge of getting deprecated, because we're lacking a maintainer.

I suppose windows users are not as much used/interested/involved into free software development workflows, and probably don't bother even lurking on the developer mailing lists. They only shout when something breaks :p

>> interest from industry for this part to QEMU for embedded systems/SW development. The focus we have chosen
>> for the DATE conference is SystemC integration with QEMU emulation since the embedded systems and SystemC
>> community meets at DATE so that we expect several people from them to attend. However, as already written, we
>> basically failed to find any indication for contact point for the emulation community. Any pointers are highly appreciated.
> 
> What audience and talks do you expect to receive? I'm still trying to get a full picture on what topics people would be interested in the most.

From what I understood, since it's part of a scientific event, it's mostly toward the CS scientific community, where conferences have quite specific rules.

> The main contact point for any qemu discussions is the qemu-devel mailing list. We're a community, so these things should happen as open as possible.

The scientific "community" is only starting to grasp the idea of open work, they are more used to do things in their lab and only reveal stuff when it's time to publish, and often do not even talk about what doesn't concern their direct subject research, so often they use/contribute/write software without others knowing.
(it was one of the main subjects of the fOSSa conference this month btw <http://fossa2010.inrialpes.fr/>)

> It's very hard to draw a clean line. A lot of people from the "KVM community" are active maintainers of several layers in qemu these days. For example the block layer, PCI devices, PowerPC. The communities are merging. In the mid-term, there shouldn't even be a qemu-kvm fork of qemu anymore. Everybody who does device emulation would just work on upstream qemu, regardless of the intents. The same is happening for the Xen folks too btw. They're slowly moving back towards upstream qemu as well.

That's good to hear, I only found out about the beagleboard qemu fork months after having to stick to the verdex target while having a overo gumstix hardware :p

As long as patches do not take 3 years to get in like my wacom-tablet fixes ;)

> So according to my calendar, I should be free on that week. So if you're eager to have a keynote/session from "upstream qemu folks", I'd certainly be interested in doing this. Getting people to contribute back would be so awesome. I'm still getting sad to see qemu getting forked so often (android, vbox, ...).
> 
> If however, we find a better candidate (ideas, suggestions anyone?) to give a general session, I'll gladly step back.

As I said to them, I'd be happy to talk about our usage patterns and needs with Haiku development, but I don't know enough of QEMU's internals to detail this.

> The one thing I am not willing to do however, is to pay a 400 € registration fee to have the honor of giving a talk. That just doesn't seem right to me.

As I said, scientific conferences have a quite specific set of rules, one being you pay to talk :p
Usually the labs handle the expense for the attendees, because this gives them exposure.
It's quite different from the FOSDEM or RMLL confs with free entry and best effort speaker reimbursement by sponsors :D

>> What about doing some kind of QEMU-focussed meeting at FOSDEM 2011? That event is much more open to actual users than some academic/commercial conference with registration.
> 
> From the fosdem homepage:
> 
>  We would like to inform all interested parties that the call for devrooms is running at its end.
>  Coming Saturday, 16 October at 23.59 the call for devrooms closes.

Again, the virtualization devroom should give quite a lot of opportunities.

François.

Windows host support [was: Re: [Qemu-devel] CFP: 1st International QEMU Users Forum]

[Nathan Froyd]

On Fri, Nov 26, 2010 at 01:26:31AM +0100, François Revol wrote:
> >> the people we are addressing and we would like to bring together is from the QEMU emulation community.
> >> We are interested in running different ISAs mainly under Linux and Windows versions. There is a huge additional
> > 
> > You're about the first person in 1/2 year that actually said you
> > care about Windows hosts. Windows support for example is currently
> > on the verge of getting deprecated, because we're lacking a
> > maintainer.
> 
> I suppose windows users are not as much used/interested/involved into
> free software development workflows, and probably don't bother even
> lurking on the developer mailing lists. They only shout when something
> breaks :p

We (CodeSourcery) are very interested in Windows host support.  (We
distribute QEMU with our commerical development products for
ARM/PowerPC/MIPS/SH/ColdFire/x86.)  Unfortunately, we've mostly been
backporting patches lately and haven't done a full merge from upstream
in some time, so we haven't noticed any potential breakage.  If somebody
wanted to point out to me what the (potential) Windows issues are, we
could take a look.

-Nathan

Re: Windows host support [was: Re: [Qemu-devel] CFP: 1st International QEMU Users Forum]

[Alexander Graf]

On 28.11.2010, at 01:17, Nathan Froyd wrote:

> On Fri, Nov 26, 2010 at 01:26:31AM +0100, François Revol wrote:
>>>> the people we are addressing and we would like to bring together is from the QEMU emulation community.
>>>> We are interested in running different ISAs mainly under Linux and Windows versions. There is a huge additional
>>> 
>>> You're about the first person in 1/2 year that actually said you
>>> care about Windows hosts. Windows support for example is currently
>>> on the verge of getting deprecated, because we're lacking a
>>> maintainer.
>> 
>> I suppose windows users are not as much used/interested/involved into
>> free software development workflows, and probably don't bother even
>> lurking on the developer mailing lists. They only shout when something
>> breaks :p
> 
> We (CodeSourcery) are very interested in Windows host support.  (We
> distribute QEMU with our commerical development products for
> ARM/PowerPC/MIPS/SH/ColdFire/x86.)  Unfortunately, we've mostly been
> backporting patches lately and haven't done a full merge from upstream
> in some time, so we haven't noticed any potential breakage.  If somebody
> wanted to point out to me what the (potential) Windows issues are, we
> could take a look.

Redirecting you to Anthony here for the specifics. The main problem is that we don't have anyone who takes the lead on Windows support. _If_ something breaks of _if_ we need someone to take over the windows specific parts, there's this huge gap.

So if you're willing to play that role, please send a patch to the MAINTAINERS file and add yourself :)

Btw Anthony, what happened to the really well done MAINTAINERS file overhaul?


Alex

Re: Windows host support [was: Re: [Qemu-devel] CFP: 1st International QEMU Users Forum]

[Anthony Liguori]

On 11/28/2010 04:56 AM, Alexander Graf wrote:
> On 28.11.2010, at 01:17, Nathan Froyd wrote:
>
>    
>> On Fri, Nov 26, 2010 at 01:26:31AM +0100, François Revol wrote:
>>      
>>>>> the people we are addressing and we would like to bring together is from the QEMU emulation community.
>>>>> We are interested in running different ISAs mainly under Linux and Windows versions. There is a huge additional
>>>>>            
>>>> You're about the first person in 1/2 year that actually said you
>>>> care about Windows hosts. Windows support for example is currently
>>>> on the verge of getting deprecated, because we're lacking a
>>>> maintainer.
>>>>          
>>> I suppose windows users are not as much used/interested/involved into
>>> free software development workflows, and probably don't bother even
>>> lurking on the developer mailing lists. They only shout when something
>>> breaks :p
>>>        
>> We (CodeSourcery) are very interested in Windows host support.  (We
>> distribute QEMU with our commerical development products for
>> ARM/PowerPC/MIPS/SH/ColdFire/x86.)  Unfortunately, we've mostly been
>> backporting patches lately and haven't done a full merge from upstream
>> in some time, so we haven't noticed any potential breakage.  If somebody
>> wanted to point out to me what the (potential) Windows issues are, we
>> could take a look.
>>      
> Redirecting you to Anthony here for the specifics. The main problem is that we don't have anyone who takes the lead on Windows support. _If_ something breaks of _if_ we need someone to take over the windows specific parts, there's this huge gap.
>    

Uh, Windows system simulation has never worked reliably.  It doesn't 
even have proper AIO support.

If someone is building a product based on it, I'm amazed.

> So if you're willing to play that role, please send a patch to the MAINTAINERS file and add yourself :)
>
> Btw Anthony, what happened to the really well done MAINTAINERS file overhaul?
>    

I think I just forgot to commit it.  Unfortunately, Savannah's now down :-(

Regards,

Anthony Liguori

> Alex
>
>    

Re: Windows host support [was: Re: [Qemu-devel] CFP: 1st International QEMU Users Forum]

[Nathan Froyd]

On Mon, Nov 29, 2010 at 08:34:28AM -0600, Anthony Liguori wrote:
> On 11/28/2010 04:56 AM, Alexander Graf wrote:
>> On 28.11.2010, at 01:17, Nathan Froyd wrote:
>>> We (CodeSourcery) are very interested in Windows host support.  (We
>>> distribute QEMU with our commerical development products for
>>> ARM/PowerPC/MIPS/SH/ColdFire/x86.)  Unfortunately, we've mostly been
>>> backporting patches lately and haven't done a full merge from upstream
>>> in some time, so we haven't noticed any potential breakage.  If somebody
>>> wanted to point out to me what the (potential) Windows issues are, we
>>> could take a look.
>>>      
>> Redirecting you to Anthony here for the specifics. The main problem
>> is that we don't have anyone who takes the lead on Windows
>> support. _If_ something breaks of _if_ we need someone to take over
>> the windows specific parts, there's this huge gap.
>
> Uh, Windows system simulation has never worked reliably.  It doesn't  
> even have proper AIO support.
>
> If someone is building a product based on it, I'm amazed.

Well, technically we only support QEMU as a simple instruction set
simulator in our products, and the bits present work well enough for
that.  (It is of course possible those bits have been broken in the time
since our last upstream merge.)  If you want to venture into system
simulation and it breaks, then you get to keep both pieces.

It would, however, be better to eventually support full system
simulation, and making Windows hosts work right would be a necessary
precondition to that.

-Nathan

[Qemu-devel] X86 Debian <== guest ... ARM based Linux <== host ?

[AGSCalabrese]

Is it possible to run X86 Debian as a guest where ARM based Linux is the host ?

I have a GuruPlug ( ARM based ) running Ubuntu.
http://www.globalscaletechnologies.com/t-guruplugdetails.aspx

I would like to run RealBasic software ( Linux version ) which only runs on the X86 architecture.
http://www.realsoftware.com/realstudio/

Is this possible ?

Thanx
Gus in Denver  99gus

Re: [Qemu-devel] X86 Debian <== guest ... ARM based Linux <== host ?

[Aurelien Jarno]

Hi,

On Fri, Jan 28, 2011 at 11:45:29AM -0700, AGSCalabrese wrote:
> Is it possible to run X86 Debian as a guest where ARM based Linux is the host ?
> 
> I have a GuruPlug ( ARM based ) running Ubuntu.
> http://www.globalscaletechnologies.com/t-guruplugdetails.aspx
> 
> I would like to run RealBasic software ( Linux version ) which only runs on the X86 architecture.
> http://www.realsoftware.com/realstudio/
> 
> Is this possible ?
> 

Yes, it is possible to run a x86 guest on an ARM platform thanks to
QEMU. You have to expect something quite slow though. Note that there
are some bug in host ARM support in previous released versions, so I
advise you to use either the current git version, or the just release
0.14-rc0 pre-version.

Aurelien

-- 
Aurelien Jarno                          GPG: 1024D/F1BCDB73
aurelien@aurel32.net                 http://www.aurel32.net