From mboxrd@z Thu Jan  1 00:00:00 1970
Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43)
	id 1My8iL-00062r-Kd
	for qemu-devel@nongnu.org; Wed, 14 Oct 2009 14:36:45 -0400
Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43)
	id 1My8iH-00062O-1k
	for qemu-devel@nongnu.org; Wed, 14 Oct 2009 14:36:45 -0400
Received: from [199.232.76.173] (port=35662 helo=monty-python.gnu.org)
	by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1My8iG-00062L-U8
	for qemu-devel@nongnu.org; Wed, 14 Oct 2009 14:36:40 -0400
Received: from fg-out-1718.google.com ([72.14.220.154]:11872)
	by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.60)
	(envelope-from <anthony@codemonkey.ws>) id 1My8iG-0002vn-Ih
	for qemu-devel@nongnu.org; Wed, 14 Oct 2009 14:36:40 -0400
Received: by fg-out-1718.google.com with SMTP id d23so63075fga.10
	for <qemu-devel@nongnu.org>; Wed, 14 Oct 2009 11:36:39 -0700 (PDT)
Message-ID: <4AD61A31.1080109@codemonkey.ws>
Date: Wed, 14 Oct 2009 13:36:33 -0500
From: Anthony Liguori <anthony@codemonkey.ws>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Subject: Re: [Qemu-devel] Re: [PATCH-updated] qemu/net: add raw backend
References: <20091014143415.GA29937@redhat.com>
	<4AD5E449.9070301@codemonkey.ws>
	<20091014151406.GA17062@shareable.org>
	<4AD5F51E.7040907@codemonkey.ws>
	<20091014161424.GA30308@redhat.com>
In-Reply-To: <20091014161424.GA30308@redhat.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
List-Id: qemu-devel.nongnu.org
List-Unsubscribe: <http://lists.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/qemu-devel>,
	<mailto:qemu-devel-request@nongnu.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://lists.gnu.org/pipermail/qemu-devel>
List-Post: <mailto:qemu-devel@nongnu.org>
List-Help: <mailto:qemu-devel-request@nongnu.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <http://lists.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/qemu-devel>,
	<mailto:qemu-devel-request@nongnu.org?subject=subscribe>
To: "Michael S. Tsirkin" <mst@redhat.com>
Cc: Or Gerlitz <ogerlitz@voltaire.com>, Arnd Bergmann <arndbergmann@googlemail.com>, qemu-devel@nongnu.org

Michael S. Tsirkin wrote:
> I keep hearing this. But why wait? Some users can be helped
> by raw today. Those that can't will have to wait for a better bridge
> or spend time setting it up properly.
>   

Because for every user who understands the limitations of the raw socket 
interface and is willing to accept them in order to avoid setting up a 
bridge, there will be a dozen who's experience will be worse because 
they tried the raw socket interface and it behaved in a way that they 
didn't expect.

We aren't talking about adding a feature here.  We're talking about 
adding something that's supposed to be "easier" but I'm arguing that 
it's not easier unless you're a kernel hacker and deeply understand the 
limitations of the implementation.

Regards,

Anthony Liguori