[Qemu-devel] Summer of Code 2010

[Qemu-devel] Summer of Code 2010

[Luiz Capitulino]

 Hi there,

 Google has this wonderful program called Summer of Code, in which open source
projects like ours, suggest possible projects and provide mentors to help
selected students to do them.

 It's a great opportunity for students to get in touch with open source
development, also good for us to get some projects done and more people
involved (students are paid too, btw).

 The dead-line is a bit short: next friday (March, 12), more information
in the program's page:

http://socghop.appspot.com/

 I didn't read it fully yet, but I _guess_ the most important is to come
up with project ideas and mentors. Everything should be in a wiki.

PS: I have participated as a student some years ago, didn't produce anything
    useful, but was a great experience.

Re: [Qemu-devel] Summer of Code 2010

[Alexander Graf]

On 08.03.2010, at 21:20, Luiz Capitulino wrote:

> 
> Hi there,
> 
> Google has this wonderful program called Summer of Code, in which open source
> projects like ours, suggest possible projects and provide mentors to help
> selected students to do them.
> 
> It's a great opportunity for students to get in touch with open source
> development, also good for us to get some projects done and more people
> involved (students are paid too, btw).
> 
> The dead-line is a bit short: next friday (March, 12), more information
> in the program's page:
> 
> http://socghop.appspot.com/
> 
> I didn't read it fully yet, but I _guess_ the most important is to come
> up with project ideas and mentors. Everything should be in a wiki.

Nice :-). I'd love to mentor. We have a lot of open things to do in the PPC space, but I could just as well use help with finally getting x86 Mac OS X guest support upstream ;-).

So who's sending out the actual project application? I'd feel odd if I'd do it.


Alex

Re: [Qemu-devel] Summer of Code 2010

[Johannes Schindelin]

Hi,

On Mon, 8 Mar 2010, Luiz Capitulino wrote:

>  Google has this wonderful program called Summer of Code, in which open 
> source projects like ours, suggest possible projects and provide mentors 
> to help selected students to do them.
> 
>  It's a great opportunity for students to get in touch with open source 
> development, also good for us to get some projects done and more people 
> involved (students are paid too, btw).

Note that some students do not finish up their work, do not get properly 
involved with the project, get the pay check, and then go somewhere else. 
The time of the mentor is quite possibly just wasted in such a case. Quite 
frustrating experience, believe me.

Ciao,
Dscho

Re: [Qemu-devel] Summer of Code 2010

[Stefan Hajnoczi]

On Tue, Mar 9, 2010 at 9:31 AM, Johannes Schindelin
<Johannes.Schindelin@gmx.de> wrote:
> Note that some students do not finish up their work, do not get properly
> involved with the project, get the pay check, and then go somewhere else.
> The time of the mentor is quite possibly just wasted in such a case. Quite
> frustrating experience, believe me.

That was a negative experience, but there are many successful
projects.  Summer of Code has proven beneficial to organizations, just
look through the previous years' organization lists and see orgs
coming back year after year.

I was a mentor last year and a student before that.  I have seen a
project fail but most were successful.  As the mentor you have an
input into this process in the form of a mid-term review and a final
review.  If a student is not meeting their part of the deal, you can
fail them (in the worst case).

The GSoC wiki has more information that can help you decide whether to apply:

http://gsoc-wiki.osuosl.org/index.php/Main_Page

Stefan

Re: [Qemu-devel] Summer of Code 2010

[Luiz Capitulino]

On Mon, 8 Mar 2010 23:53:19 +0100
Alexander Graf <agraf@suse.de> wrote:

> 
> On 08.03.2010, at 21:20, Luiz Capitulino wrote:
> 
> > 
> > Hi there,
> > 
> > Google has this wonderful program called Summer of Code, in which open source
> > projects like ours, suggest possible projects and provide mentors to help
> > selected students to do them.
> > 
> > It's a great opportunity for students to get in touch with open source
> > development, also good for us to get some projects done and more people
> > involved (students are paid too, btw).
> > 
> > The dead-line is a bit short: next friday (March, 12), more information
> > in the program's page:
> > 
> > http://socghop.appspot.com/
> > 
> > I didn't read it fully yet, but I _guess_ the most important is to come
> > up with project ideas and mentors. Everything should be in a wiki.
> 
> Nice :-). I'd love to mentor. We have a lot of open things to do in the PPC space, but I could just as well use help with finally getting x86 Mac OS X guest support upstream ;-).
> 
> So who's sending out the actual project application? I'd feel odd if I'd do it.

 The student.

 We (as a mentoring organization) will suggest some project ideas and
assign mentors. On a following phase, students will go through the
projects and submit the actual project application.

 Now, we need:

 1. More mentors. Mentoring is quite important, who wishes to be one has
    to have the time for it

 2. Organization Administrator. The person who will do the administrative
    stuff. I could do this role, but then I won't mentor

 3. Project ideas and wiki info

Re: [Qemu-devel] Summer of Code 2010

[Luiz Capitulino]

On Tue, 9 Mar 2010 10:31:23 +0100 (CET)
Johannes Schindelin <Johannes.Schindelin@gmx.de> wrote:

> Hi,
> 
> On Mon, 8 Mar 2010, Luiz Capitulino wrote:
> 
> >  Google has this wonderful program called Summer of Code, in which open 
> > source projects like ours, suggest possible projects and provide mentors 
> > to help selected students to do them.
> > 
> >  It's a great opportunity for students to get in touch with open source 
> > development, also good for us to get some projects done and more people 
> > involved (students are paid too, btw).
> 
> Note that some students do not finish up their work, do not get properly 
> involved with the project, get the pay check, and then go somewhere else. 
> The time of the mentor is quite possibly just wasted in such a case. Quite 
> frustrating experience, believe me.

 I think that the role of the mentor is close to that of a teacher, from
this pov, it's not just wasted time at all (even if the project 'fails').

 Now, I understand what you mean and I fell sorry (and slightly bad)
about it, as my project didn't take the right direction.

 That said, I think that _part_ of the problem is about having the right
expectations and realistic goals.

Re: [Qemu-devel] Summer of Code 2010

[Anthony Liguori]

On 03/08/2010 02:20 PM, Luiz Capitulino wrote:
>   Hi there,
>
>   Google has this wonderful program called Summer of Code, in which open source
> projects like ours, suggest possible projects and provide mentors to help
> selected students to do them.
>
>   It's a great opportunity for students to get in touch with open source
> development, also good for us to get some projects done and more people
> involved (students are paid too, btw).
>
>   The dead-line is a bit short: next friday (March, 12), more information
> in the program's page:
>
> http://socghop.appspot.com/
>    

I'd suggest creating a page on the qemu.org wiki and start collecting 
ideas.  I'd strongly suggest that all ideas are constructed like a 
release feature and have an appropriate wiki page.

I think the key to success with a student project is to have a wide 
range of success criteria.   If people post ideas to a common wiki page, 
we can review them and come up with a set of suggested items.

Regards,

Anthony Liguori

>   I didn't read it fully yet, but I _guess_ the most important is to come
> up with project ideas and mentors. Everything should be in a wiki.
>
> PS: I have participated as a student some years ago, didn't produce anything
>      useful, but was a great experience.
>
>
>    

Re: [Qemu-devel] Summer of Code 2010

[Johannes Schindelin]

Hi,

On Tue, 9 Mar 2010, Luiz Capitulino wrote:

> On Tue, 9 Mar 2010 10:31:23 +0100 (CET)
> Johannes Schindelin <Johannes.Schindelin@gmx.de> wrote:
> 
> > On Mon, 8 Mar 2010, Luiz Capitulino wrote:
> > 
> > >  Google has this wonderful program called Summer of Code, in which open 
> > > source projects like ours, suggest possible projects and provide mentors 
> > > to help selected students to do them.
> > > 
> > >  It's a great opportunity for students to get in touch with open source 
> > > development, also good for us to get some projects done and more people 
> > > involved (students are paid too, btw).
> > 
> > Note that some students do not finish up their work, do not get properly 
> > involved with the project, get the pay check, and then go somewhere else. 
> > The time of the mentor is quite possibly just wasted in such a case. Quite 
> > frustrating experience, believe me.
> 
>  I think that the role of the mentor is close to that of a teacher, from
> this pov, it's not just wasted time at all (even if the project 'fails').

If you think that mentoring is fun, then you are seriously mistaken. It is 
first, and foremost, and probably only, work.

And if you do not get something back in return for all that work, it is 
awful.

Hth,
Dscho

Re: [Qemu-devel] Summer of Code 2010

[Natalia Portillo]

>
> Nice :-). I'd love to mentor. We have a lot of open things to do in  
> the PPC space, but I could just as well use help with finally  
> getting x86 Mac OS X guest support upstream ;-).
>
> So who's sending out the actual project application? I'd feel odd if  
> I'd do it.

I hope that with native EFI and Mac's memory space, not just a PCI PC  
booting a hacked OS X (we do not want Apple to see QEMU as a piracy  
movement, watching what happened to Psystar)

Re: [Qemu-devel] Summer of Code 2010

[Alexander Graf]

On 09.03.2010, at 16:44, Natalia Portillo wrote:

>> 
>> Nice :-). I'd love to mentor. We have a lot of open things to do in the PPC space, but I could just as well use help with finally getting x86 Mac OS X guest support upstream ;-).
>> 
>> So who's sending out the actual project application? I'd feel odd if I'd do it.
> 
> I hope that with native EFI and Mac's memory space, not just a PCI PC booting a hacked OS X (we do not want Apple to see QEMU as a piracy movement, watching what happened to Psystar)

I was talking about my work that tried to model Qemu towards what xnu expects. There's quite some work left to do to get it upstream, slowly moving us towards a real -M mac machine type. Using EFI or not is the least of our problems IMHO.

Hacked OS X version should work already, but I don't care about those.


Alex

Re: [Qemu-devel] Summer of Code 2010

[Natalia Portillo]

"Qemu towards what xnu expects" --> that's what I called "Mac's memory  
space".

Of course is not only memory, the SMU, TPM module, anything it will  
search for without hacking.

(If you need testing comment me I have every x86 versions that is  
outside of Apple and nVidia, and hardware access to all in-sell  
Macintosh models)

El 09/03/2010, a las 15:46, Alexander Graf escribió:

>
> On 09.03.2010, at 16:44, Natalia Portillo wrote:
>
>>>
>>> Nice :-). I'd love to mentor. We have a lot of open things to do  
>>> in the PPC space, but I could just as well use help with finally  
>>> getting x86 Mac OS X guest support upstream ;-).
>>>
>>> So who's sending out the actual project application? I'd feel odd  
>>> if I'd do it.
>>
>> I hope that with native EFI and Mac's memory space, not just a PCI  
>> PC booting a hacked OS X (we do not want Apple to see QEMU as a  
>> piracy movement, watching what happened to Psystar)
>
> I was talking about my work that tried to model Qemu towards what  
> xnu expects. There's quite some work left to do to get it upstream,  
> slowly moving us towards a real -M mac machine type. Using EFI or  
> not is the least of our problems IMHO.
>
> Hacked OS X version should work already, but I don't care about those.
>
>
> Alex

Re: [Qemu-devel] Summer of Code 2010

[Natalia Portillo]

http://wiki.qemu.org/Google_Summer_of_Code_2010

This is a start.

El 09/03/2010, a las 14:14, Anthony Liguori escribió:

> On 03/08/2010 02:20 PM, Luiz Capitulino wrote:
>>  Hi there,
>>
>>  Google has this wonderful program called Summer of Code, in which  
>> open source
>> projects like ours, suggest possible projects and provide mentors  
>> to help
>> selected students to do them.
>>
>>  It's a great opportunity for students to get in touch with open  
>> source
>> development, also good for us to get some projects done and more  
>> people
>> involved (students are paid too, btw).
>>
>>  The dead-line is a bit short: next friday (March, 12), more  
>> information
>> in the program's page:
>>
>> http://socghop.appspot.com/
>>
>
> I'd suggest creating a page on the qemu.org wiki and start  
> collecting ideas.  I'd strongly suggest that all ideas are  
> constructed like a release feature and have an appropriate wiki page.
>
> I think the key to success with a student project is to have a wide  
> range of success criteria.   If people post ideas to a common wiki  
> page, we can review them and come up with a set of suggested items.
>
> Regards,
>
> Anthony Liguori
>
>>  I didn't read it fully yet, but I _guess_ the most important is to  
>> come
>> up with project ideas and mentors. Everything should be in a wiki.
>>
>> PS: I have participated as a student some years ago, didn't produce  
>> anything
>>     useful, but was a great experience.
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>

Re: [Qemu-devel] Summer of Code 2010

[Alexander Graf]

On 09.03.2010, at 16:50, Natalia Portillo wrote:

> "Qemu towards what xnu expects" --> that's what I called "Mac's memory space".
> 
> Of course is not only memory, the SMU, TPM module, anything it will search for without hacking.
> 
> (If you need testing comment me I have every x86 versions that is outside of Apple and nVidia, and hardware access to all in-sell Macintosh models)

No worries - I'd rather need someone implementing an ICH-7 PCI bridge, LPC and AHCI controller :-).


Alex

Re: [Qemu-devel] Summer of Code 2010

[Natalia Portillo]

El 09/03/2010, a las 15:56, Alexander Graf escribió:

>
> On 09.03.2010, at 16:50, Natalia Portillo wrote:
>
>> "Qemu towards what xnu expects" --> that's what I called "Mac's  
>> memory space".
>>
>> Of course is not only memory, the SMU, TPM module, anything it will  
>> search for without hacking.
>>
>> (If you need testing comment me I have every x86 versions that is  
>> outside of Apple and nVidia, and hardware access to all in-sell  
>> Macintosh models)
>
> No worries - I'd rather need someone implementing an ICH-7 PCI  
> bridge, LPC and AHCI controller :-).

I'd love to know how to do that.

Documenting QEMU's hardware model may be also a good idea for  
GSoC2010, as most complains about contributing QEMU are precisely  
that, having to study the whole code to know how to make anything new.

Re: [Qemu-devel] Summer of Code 2010

[Brian Jackson]

On Tuesday 09 March 2010 09:55:39 am Natalia Portillo wrote:
> http://wiki.qemu.org/Google_Summer_of_Code_2010


I added a section for possible mentors and added myself to it.


> 
> This is a start.
> 
> El 09/03/2010, a las 14:14, Anthony Liguori escribió:
> > On 03/08/2010 02:20 PM, Luiz Capitulino wrote:
> >>  Hi there,
> >>  
> >>  Google has this wonderful program called Summer of Code, in which
> >> 
> >> open source
> >> projects like ours, suggest possible projects and provide mentors
> >> to help
> >> selected students to do them.
> >> 
> >>  It's a great opportunity for students to get in touch with open
> >> 
> >> source
> >> development, also good for us to get some projects done and more
> >> people
> >> involved (students are paid too, btw).
> >> 
> >>  The dead-line is a bit short: next friday (March, 12), more
> >> 
> >> information
> >> in the program's page:
> >> 
> >> http://socghop.appspot.com/
> > 
> > I'd suggest creating a page on the qemu.org wiki and start
> > collecting ideas.  I'd strongly suggest that all ideas are
> > constructed like a release feature and have an appropriate wiki page.
> > 
> > I think the key to success with a student project is to have a wide
> > range of success criteria.   If people post ideas to a common wiki
> > page, we can review them and come up with a set of suggested items.
> > 
> > Regards,
> > 
> > Anthony Liguori
> > 
> >>  I didn't read it fully yet, but I _guess_ the most important is to
> >> 
> >> come
> >> up with project ideas and mentors. Everything should be in a wiki.
> >> 
> >> PS: I have participated as a student some years ago, didn't produce
> >> anything
> >> 
> >>     useful, but was a great experience.

Re: [Qemu-devel] Summer of Code 2010

[malc]

On Tue, 9 Mar 2010, Alexander Graf wrote:

> 
> On 09.03.2010, at 16:50, Natalia Portillo wrote:
> 
> > "Qemu towards what xnu expects" --> that's what I called "Mac's memory space".
> > 
> > Of course is not only memory, the SMU, TPM module, anything it will search for without hacking.
> > 
> > (If you need testing comment me I have every x86 versions that is outside of Apple and nVidia, and hardware access to all in-sell Macintosh models)
> 
> No worries - I'd rather need someone implementing an ICH-7 PCI bridge, LPC and AHCI controller :-).

Huh? What's there to implement for LPC, ACPI table that describes what's
already there?

-- 
mailto:av1474@comtv.ru

Re: [Qemu-devel] Summer of Code 2010

[Alexander Graf]

On 09.03.2010, at 17:48, malc wrote:

> On Tue, 9 Mar 2010, Alexander Graf wrote:
> 
>> 
>> On 09.03.2010, at 16:50, Natalia Portillo wrote:
>> 
>>> "Qemu towards what xnu expects" --> that's what I called "Mac's memory space".
>>> 
>>> Of course is not only memory, the SMU, TPM module, anything it will search for without hacking.
>>> 
>>> (If you need testing comment me I have every x86 versions that is outside of Apple and nVidia, and hardware access to all in-sell Macintosh models)
>> 
>> No worries - I'd rather need someone implementing an ICH-7 PCI bridge, LPC and AHCI controller :-).
> 
> Huh? What's there to implement for LPC, ACPI table that describes what's
> already there?

The ICH-7 hides a lot of chipset configuration in their LPC PCI device config space. For example the address of the HPET ;-). Mac OS X relies on that.


Alex

[Qemu-devel] Re: Summer of Code 2010

[Paolo Bonzini]

On 03/09/2010 05:01 PM, Natalia Portillo wrote:
> Documenting QEMU's hardware model may be also a good idea for GSoC2010,
> as most complains about contributing QEMU are precisely that, having to
> study the whole code to know how to make anything new.

Unfortunately, documentation-only projects are outside the scope of GSoC 
(though of course it's fine if the project includes a documentation step).

Paolo

Re: [Qemu-devel] Re: Summer of Code 2010

[Johannes Schindelin]

Hi,

On Tue, 9 Mar 2010, Paolo Bonzini wrote:

> On 03/09/2010 05:01 PM, Natalia Portillo wrote:
> > Documenting QEMU's hardware model may be also a good idea for GSoC2010,
> > as most complains about contributing QEMU are precisely that, having to
> > study the whole code to know how to make anything new.
> 
> Unfortunately, documentation-only projects are outside the scope of GSoC
> (though of course it's fine if the project includes a documentation step).

No, they are not. I personally know mentors (cute ones) for documentation 
projects.

Ciao,
Dscho

Re: [Qemu-devel] Summer of Code 2010

[Jamie Lokier]

Johannes Schindelin wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> On Tue, 9 Mar 2010, Luiz Capitulino wrote:
> 
> > On Tue, 9 Mar 2010 10:31:23 +0100 (CET)
> > Johannes Schindelin <Johannes.Schindelin@gmx.de> wrote:
> > 
> > > On Mon, 8 Mar 2010, Luiz Capitulino wrote:
> > > 
> > > >  Google has this wonderful program called Summer of Code, in which open 
> > > > source projects like ours, suggest possible projects and provide mentors 
> > > > to help selected students to do them.
> > > > 
> > > >  It's a great opportunity for students to get in touch with open source 
> > > > development, also good for us to get some projects done and more people 
> > > > involved (students are paid too, btw).
> > > 
> > > Note that some students do not finish up their work, do not get properly 
> > > involved with the project, get the pay check, and then go somewhere else. 
> > > The time of the mentor is quite possibly just wasted in such a case. Quite 
> > > frustrating experience, believe me.
> > 
> >  I think that the role of the mentor is close to that of a teacher, from
> > this pov, it's not just wasted time at all (even if the project 'fails').
> 
> If you think that mentoring is fun, then you are seriously mistaken. It is 
> first, and foremost, and probably only, work.
> 
> And if you do not get something back in return for all that work, it is 
> awful.

I take Luiz's view: If the student has learned something, that _is_ a
return for the work.  Even if it's not fun to do, it's a result.

Useful code is a desirable bonus of course, but that can't be assumed
even if everyone works hard anyway.

If you don't find that sufficient motivation to mentor, fair enough.
It's always a good idea to make your expectations clear, and ensure
they are understood before committing to anything.

But don't be too disappointed that not every student will see it the
same way, and neither will some other mentors.

I agree strongly with Anthony's note that the best outcomes are likely
to come from having a broad range of success criteria.

-- Jamie

Re: [Qemu-devel] Re: Summer of Code 2010

[Paolo Bonzini]

On 03/09/2010 07:36 PM, Johannes Schindelin wrote:
> Hi,
>
> On Tue, 9 Mar 2010, Paolo Bonzini wrote:
>
>> On 03/09/2010 05:01 PM, Natalia Portillo wrote:
>>> Documenting QEMU's hardware model may be also a good idea for GSoC2010,
>>> as most complains about contributing QEMU are precisely that, having to
>>> study the whole code to know how to make anything new.
>>
>> Unfortunately, documentation-only projects are outside the scope of GSoC
>> (though of course it's fine if the project includes a documentation step).
>
> No, they are not. I personally know mentors (cute ones) for documentation
> projects.

http://code.google.com/opensource/gsoc/2008/faqs.html

12. Are proposals for documentation work eligible for Google Summer of Code?

While we greatly appreciate the value of documentation, this program is 
an exercise in developing code; we can't accept proposals for 
documentation-only work at this time.

Paolo

Re: [Qemu-devel] Summer of Code 2010

[Jes Sorensen]

On 03/09/10 16:56, Alexander Graf wrote:
>
> On 09.03.2010, at 16:50, Natalia Portillo wrote:
>
>> "Qemu towards what xnu expects" -->  that's what I called "Mac's memory space".
>>
>> Of course is not only memory, the SMU, TPM module, anything it will search for without hacking.
>>
>> (If you need testing comment me I have every x86 versions that is outside of Apple and nVidia, and hardware access to all in-sell Macintosh models)
>
> No worries - I'd rather need someone implementing an ICH-7 PCI bridge, LPC and AHCI controller :-).

Well it seems to me you have an excellent and very specific 3 stage
project there already? Getting AHCI support in QEMU would be *really*
useful, and it seems what you are asking for should be easy to propose
for the summer of code. It's got a clear end target :-)

Cheers,
Jes

Re: [Qemu-devel] Summer of Code 2010

[Alexander Graf]

On 10.03.2010, at 12:23, Jes Sorensen wrote:

> On 03/09/10 16:56, Alexander Graf wrote:
>> 
>> On 09.03.2010, at 16:50, Natalia Portillo wrote:
>> 
>>> "Qemu towards what xnu expects" -->  that's what I called "Mac's memory space".
>>> 
>>> Of course is not only memory, the SMU, TPM module, anything it will search for without hacking.
>>> 
>>> (If you need testing comment me I have every x86 versions that is outside of Apple and nVidia, and hardware access to all in-sell Macintosh models)
>> 
>> No worries - I'd rather need someone implementing an ICH-7 PCI bridge, LPC and AHCI controller :-).
> 
> Well it seems to me you have an excellent and very specific 3 stage
> project there already? Getting AHCI support in QEMU would be *really*
> useful, and it seems what you are asking for should be easy to propose
> for the summer of code. It's got a clear end target :-)

True - AHCI is the big chunk too. Once that's there I can probably handle the rest myself in a few days :-). (famous last words)


Alex

Re: [Qemu-devel] Re: Summer of Code 2010

[Johannes Schindelin]

Hi,

On Wed, 10 Mar 2010, Paolo Bonzini wrote:

> On 03/09/2010 07:36 PM, Johannes Schindelin wrote:
>
> > On Tue, 9 Mar 2010, Paolo Bonzini wrote:
> >
> > > On 03/09/2010 05:01 PM, Natalia Portillo wrote:
> > > > Documenting QEMU's hardware model may be also a good idea for 
> > > > GSoC2010, as most complains about contributing QEMU are precisely 
> > > > that, having to study the whole code to know how to make anything 
> > > > new.
> > >
> > > Unfortunately, documentation-only projects are outside the scope of 
> > > GSoC (though of course it's fine if the project includes a 
> > > documentation step).
> >
> > No, they are not. I personally know mentors (cute ones) for documentation
> > projects.
> 
> http://code.google.com/opensource/gsoc/2008/faqs.html
> 
> 12. Are proposals for documentation work eligible for Google Summer of Code?
> 
> While we greatly appreciate the value of documentation, this program is an
> exercise in developing code; we can't accept proposals for documentation-only
> work at this time.

So accompany the project with the task of writing example code.

Why so uncreative?
Dscho

Re: [Qemu-devel] Summer of Code 2010

[Luiz Capitulino]

On Tue, 9 Mar 2010 15:53:15 +0100 (CET)
Johannes Schindelin <Johannes.Schindelin@gmx.de> wrote:

> Hi,
> 
> On Tue, 9 Mar 2010, Luiz Capitulino wrote:
> 
> > On Tue, 9 Mar 2010 10:31:23 +0100 (CET)
> > Johannes Schindelin <Johannes.Schindelin@gmx.de> wrote:
> > 
> > > On Mon, 8 Mar 2010, Luiz Capitulino wrote:
> > > 
> > > >  Google has this wonderful program called Summer of Code, in which open 
> > > > source projects like ours, suggest possible projects and provide mentors 
> > > > to help selected students to do them.
> > > > 
> > > >  It's a great opportunity for students to get in touch with open source 
> > > > development, also good for us to get some projects done and more people 
> > > > involved (students are paid too, btw).
> > > 
> > > Note that some students do not finish up their work, do not get properly 
> > > involved with the project, get the pay check, and then go somewhere else. 
> > > The time of the mentor is quite possibly just wasted in such a case. Quite 
> > > frustrating experience, believe me.
> > 
> >  I think that the role of the mentor is close to that of a teacher, from
> > this pov, it's not just wasted time at all (even if the project 'fails').
> 
> If you think that mentoring is fun, then you are seriously mistaken. It is 
> first, and foremost, and probably only, work.

 I've never been a mentor, so I won't refute that.

> And if you do not get something back in return for all that work, it is 
> awful.

 You've done a great job as a git hacker and as a mentor (as far as I
could see), so I feel sorry if you feel like that.

Re: [Qemu-devel] Summer of Code 2010

[Luiz Capitulino]

On Tue, 9 Mar 2010 15:55:39 +0000
Natalia Portillo <claunia@claunia.com> wrote:

> http://wiki.qemu.org/Google_Summer_of_Code_2010
> 
> This is a start.

 Thanks a lot Natalia, I've edited the whole page and created a common
template for all projects.

 I will talk more about this in a separate email.

Re: [Qemu-devel] Summer of Code 2010

[Natalia Portillo]

I've expanded my suggestions to the new template with description :p

El 10/03/2010, a las 20:11, Luiz Capitulino escribió:

> On Tue, 9 Mar 2010 15:55:39 +0000
> Natalia Portillo <claunia@claunia.com> wrote:
>
>> http://wiki.qemu.org/Google_Summer_of_Code_2010
>>
>> This is a start.
>
> Thanks a lot Natalia, I've edited the whole page and created a common
> template for all projects.
>
> I will talk more about this in a separate email.

[Qemu-devel] Re: Summer of Code 2010

[Paolo Bonzini]

On 03/10/2010 07:31 PM, Johannes Schindelin wrote:
> So accompany the project with the task of writing example code.
>
> Why so uncreative?

You win. :-)

Paolo