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From: "Sebastian Herbszt" <herbszt@gmx.de>
To: Gleb Natapov <gleb@redhat.com>
Cc: Kevin O'Connor <kevin@koconnor.net>,
	Gerd Hoffmann <kraxel@redhat.com>,
	qemu-devel@nongnu.org
Subject: [Qemu-devel] Re: [SeaBIOS] [PATCH 0/8] option rom loadingoverhaul.
Date: Mon, 21 Dec 2009 21:16:17 +0100	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <D2CFABEDFE7F45C88CDDD343B1E6BE15@FSCPC> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <20091221195331.GH21163@redhat.com>

Gleb Natapov wrote:
> On Mon, Dec 21, 2009 at 08:39:03PM +0100, Sebastian Herbszt wrote:
>> Anthony Liguori wrote:
>> >On 12/21/2009 12:24 PM, Sebastian Herbszt wrote:
>> >>As stated before i don't like the idea of automagically
>> >>upgrading the firmware
>> >>on reset, e.g. after a live migration to a newer qemu version.
>> >>You have explained
>> >>that qemu-kvm needs this in order to work with live migration
>> >>and changed hw
>> >>support because of bug fixes. Is this only needed in the kvm case?
>> >
>> >It's not "needed", it's desired.  The same case can be made for
>> >real hardware (automated firmware updates).
>> 
>> Tho on real hardware those updates are initiated by someone and not
>> automagic.
>> 
> Because on real hardware it is impossible to do it differently may be?
> My cable TV provider upgrades FW on my set-top-box automatically.

Your cable TV provider does likely also control what beside the FW (if anything)
runs on your set-top-box. So he can verify the FW upgrade doesn't break anything
in the field. That pre-deployment verification is not possible in non closed
environments.

>> >>Does any OS (Windows?) depend on the tables the bios creates
>> >>(e.g. smbios)
>> >>for licensing? It would be ugly if Windows wants you to
>> >>re-activate after a reboot
>> >>following a migration to newer qemu version and therefore
>> >>possibly changed tables
>> >>due to newer bios.
>> >
>> >Yes, and this is a good point.  ACPI table changes can absolutely
>> >cause re-activation.  If we migrate from 0.12 -> 0.13 and make
>> >major changes to the ACPI tables in 0.13, then it's very likely
>> >that will result in problems for Windows guests.
>> 
>> Another problem could be on guest resume from S3 after migration if the
>> bios or acpi tables change.
> On resume from S3 BIOS doesn't recreate ACPI tables. ACPI tables are not
> part of a BIOS image and in fact OS can reuse memory ACPI tables reside
> in. So such problem definitely does not exist.

If the OS recycles the whole memory which holds the ACPI tables i am not sure how
the BIOS will find the firmware_waking_vector. Maybe the OS can only use the memory
which holds the DSDT? Anyway, will the guest even resume from S3 if the hw changed
on migration and the bios doesn't know how to init it?

- Sebastian

  reply	other threads:[~2009-12-21 20:16 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 84+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2009-12-18 11:01 [Qemu-devel] [PATCH 0/8] option rom loading overhaul Gerd Hoffmann
2009-12-18 11:01 ` [Qemu-devel] [PATCH 1/8] Support PCI based option rom loading Gerd Hoffmann
2009-12-19 10:57   ` Blue Swirl
2009-12-20 15:34     ` Anthony Liguori
2009-12-20 17:02       ` Blue Swirl
2009-12-20 17:18         ` Alexander Graf
2009-12-20 17:55           ` Anthony Liguori
2009-12-20 18:01             ` Alexander Graf
2009-12-20 18:24               ` Andreas Färber
2009-12-20 18:53                 ` Blue Swirl
2009-12-20 21:24                   ` Benjamin Herrenschmidt
2009-12-20 21:23               ` Benjamin Herrenschmidt
2009-12-18 11:01 ` [Qemu-devel] [PATCH 2/8] pci romfiles: add property, add default to PCIDeviceInfo Gerd Hoffmann
2010-01-11 21:18   ` [Qemu-devel] [RFC] New naming rules for GPXE romfiles Stefan Weil
2010-01-11 21:34     ` Anthony Liguori
2010-01-12 10:23     ` Kevin Wolf
2009-12-18 11:01 ` [Qemu-devel] [PATCH 3/8] fw_cfg: make calls typesafe Gerd Hoffmann
2009-12-18 11:01 ` [Qemu-devel] [PATCH 4/8] fw_cfg: add API for file transfer Gerd Hoffmann
2009-12-19 12:06   ` Blue Swirl
2009-12-20  8:42   ` [Qemu-devel] Re: [SeaBIOS] " Gleb Natapov
2009-12-18 11:01 ` [Qemu-devel] [PATCH 5/8] roms: use new fw_cfg file xfer support Gerd Hoffmann
2009-12-20  8:45   ` [Qemu-devel] Re: [SeaBIOS] " Gleb Natapov
2009-12-18 11:01 ` [Qemu-devel] [PATCH 6/8] roms: remove option rom packing logic Gerd Hoffmann
2009-12-18 11:01 ` [Qemu-devel] [PATCH 7/8] updated seabios binary for testing convinience Gerd Hoffmann
2009-12-18 11:01 ` [Qemu-devel] [PATCH 8/8] debug: enable bios messages Gerd Hoffmann
2009-12-18 14:35 ` [Qemu-devel] Re: [SeaBIOS] [PATCH 0/8] option rom loading overhaul Anthony Liguori
2009-12-18 16:34   ` Gerd Hoffmann
2009-12-18 16:42     ` Anthony Liguori
2009-12-18 17:03       ` Gerd Hoffmann
2009-12-18 17:12         ` Anthony Liguori
2009-12-19  1:48           ` Kevin O'Connor
2009-12-19  3:07             ` Anthony Liguori
2009-12-18 17:14         ` Anthony Liguori
2009-12-18 18:04           ` Gerd Hoffmann
2009-12-18 19:41         ` Sebastian Herbszt
2009-12-18 19:53           ` Anthony Liguori
2009-12-18 20:10             ` Sebastian Herbszt
2009-12-20  8:38 ` Gleb Natapov
2009-12-20 14:43   ` Anthony Liguori
2009-12-20 14:52     ` Gleb Natapov
2009-12-20 14:58       ` Anthony Liguori
2009-12-20 15:07         ` Gleb Natapov
2009-12-20 15:11           ` Anthony Liguori
2009-12-20 15:20             ` Avi Kivity
2009-12-20 15:31               ` Anthony Liguori
2009-12-20 15:35                 ` Avi Kivity
2009-12-22 13:04               ` Paul Brook
2009-12-22 13:09                 ` Avi Kivity
2009-12-22 15:11                 ` Anthony Liguori
2009-12-22 15:54                   ` Paul Brook
2009-12-22 16:16                     ` Anthony Liguori
2009-12-20 15:23             ` Gleb Natapov
2009-12-20 15:28               ` Anthony Liguori
2009-12-20 15:33                 ` Gleb Natapov
2009-12-20 15:39                   ` Anthony Liguori
2009-12-20 15:52                     ` Gleb Natapov
2009-12-20 16:08                       ` Blue Swirl
2009-12-20 16:15                         ` Gleb Natapov
2009-12-20 16:23                           ` Blue Swirl
2009-12-20 17:48                       ` Anthony Liguori
2009-12-21  1:59                         ` Kevin O'Connor
2009-12-21  7:32                           ` Gleb Natapov
2009-12-21 16:40                             ` Anthony Liguori
2009-12-21 16:43                               ` Gleb Natapov
2009-12-21 17:26                                 ` Anthony Liguori
2009-12-21 17:43                                   ` Gleb Natapov
2009-12-21 18:24                                     ` [Qemu-devel] Re: Re: [SeaBIOS] [PATCH 0/8] option rom loadingoverhaul Sebastian Herbszt
2009-12-21 18:36                                       ` Gleb Natapov
2009-12-21 19:28                                         ` Sebastian Herbszt
2009-12-21 19:57                                           ` Gleb Natapov
2009-12-21 19:17                                       ` [Qemu-devel] " Anthony Liguori
2009-12-21 19:39                                         ` Sebastian Herbszt
2009-12-21 19:53                                           ` Gleb Natapov
2009-12-21 20:16                                             ` Sebastian Herbszt [this message]
2009-12-22  7:58                                               ` Gleb Natapov
2009-12-22 14:57                                                 ` Anthony Liguori
2009-12-21 19:48                                         ` Gleb Natapov
2009-12-21 19:13                                     ` [Qemu-devel] Re: [SeaBIOS] [PATCH 0/8] option rom loading overhaul Anthony Liguori
2009-12-21 19:43                                       ` Gleb Natapov
2009-12-21 23:54                                         ` Anthony Liguori
2009-12-22 20:50                                           ` [Qemu-devel] Re: Re: [SeaBIOS] [PATCH 0/8] option rom loadingoverhaul Sebastian Herbszt
2009-12-21  7:40                         ` [Qemu-devel] Re: [SeaBIOS] [PATCH 0/8] option rom loading overhaul Gleb Natapov
2009-12-21 17:27                           ` Michael S. Tsirkin
2010-01-12  4:48                   ` Jamie Lokier

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