From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.0 (2014-02-07) on aws-us-west-2-korg-lkml-1.web.codeaurora.org Received: from lists.gnu.org (lists.gnu.org [209.51.188.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by smtp.lore.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4ADB1C433EF for ; Mon, 13 Dec 2021 18:09:41 +0000 (UTC) Received: from localhost ([::1]:58194 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mwplb-0004qi-TB for qemu-devel@archiver.kernel.org; Mon, 13 Dec 2021 13:09:39 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:46294) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mwpjr-0003zj-0B for qemu-devel@nongnu.org; Mon, 13 Dec 2021 13:07:51 -0500 Received: from us-smtp-delivery-124.mimecast.com ([170.10.129.124]:35520) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mwpjo-0001sG-73 for qemu-devel@nongnu.org; Mon, 13 Dec 2021 13:07:49 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=redhat.com; s=mimecast20190719; t=1639418867; h=from:from:reply-to:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date: message-id:message-id:to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version: content-type:content-type:in-reply-to:in-reply-to: references:references; bh=XvE05KRtOIjpaxAUjwZUgo/8jNmKBSMcYlndcMQstW4=; b=dVSzCiYVFfjkBREn+fdbAVPGxu7/KnBzCMymU8GyI3lr9uwDzTk+4Axb/yCYxypgwuIkiF ayHb8qltn38zEh5odlZSCiJgmMAsqiJe2L9mjQV5TP2Ke65exwLct/gUN86yw4LNWSJdMZ 5yS8e+TpsVpie/1w545tEZIiNuyhDlA= Received: from mimecast-mx01.redhat.com (mimecast-mx01.redhat.com [209.132.183.4]) by relay.mimecast.com with ESMTP with STARTTLS (version=TLSv1.2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384) id us-mta-551-9Khayhr5Or63kPme-A7n_Q-1; Mon, 13 Dec 2021 13:07:46 -0500 X-MC-Unique: 9Khayhr5Or63kPme-A7n_Q-1 Received: from smtp.corp.redhat.com (int-mx03.intmail.prod.int.phx2.redhat.com [10.5.11.13]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mimecast-mx01.redhat.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id D442C10144E3; Mon, 13 Dec 2021 18:07:44 +0000 (UTC) Received: from redhat.com (unknown [10.39.194.52]) by smtp.corp.redhat.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 157B94ABA2; Mon, 13 Dec 2021 18:07:42 +0000 (UTC) Date: Mon, 13 Dec 2021 18:07:40 +0000 From: Daniel =?utf-8?B?UC4gQmVycmFuZ8Op?= To: Paolo Bonzini Subject: Re: Redesign of QEMU startup & initial configuration Message-ID: References: <87lf13cx3x.fsf@dusky.pond.sub.org> <87mtl88t0j.fsf@dusky.pond.sub.org> <878rwozfqm.fsf@dusky.pond.sub.org> <16cd5683-4f97-d24c-dd19-24febcab7ba8@redhat.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <16cd5683-4f97-d24c-dd19-24febcab7ba8@redhat.com> User-Agent: Mutt/2.1.3 (2021-09-10) X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.79 on 10.5.11.13 Authentication-Results: relay.mimecast.com; auth=pass smtp.auth=CUSA124A263 smtp.mailfrom=berrange@redhat.com X-Mimecast-Spam-Score: 0 X-Mimecast-Originator: redhat.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Disposition: inline Received-SPF: pass client-ip=170.10.129.124; envelope-from=berrange@redhat.com; helo=us-smtp-delivery-124.mimecast.com X-Spam_score_int: -34 X-Spam_score: -3.5 X-Spam_bar: --- X-Spam_report: (-3.5 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIMWL_WL_HIGH=-0.713, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: qemu-devel@nongnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Reply-To: Daniel =?utf-8?B?UC4gQmVycmFuZ8Op?= Cc: Damien Hedde , Mark Burton , Markus Armbruster , qemu-devel@nongnu.org, Mirela Grujic , "Edgar E. Iglesias" , =?utf-8?Q?Marc-Andr=C3=A9?= Lureau Errors-To: qemu-devel-bounces+qemu-devel=archiver.kernel.org@nongnu.org Sender: "Qemu-devel" On Mon, Dec 13, 2021 at 06:37:44PM +0100, Paolo Bonzini wrote: > On 12/13/21 16:28, Markus Armbruster wrote: > > Would you object to me expanding the CLI here to the point where I think > > we can deprecate the old binary? > > > > If yes, why? > > Yes, for two reasons. > > First, because there will be usually differences between the command lines > as mentioned elsewhere in the thread. qemu-system-* is a good name, but one > that is already taken by 15 years of docs using the existing command line. T Lets pick naming to make it clearer who/what each binary is targetted towards. e.g. - /usr/bin/qemu-buildvm-$TARGET for the low level binary that just speaks QMP on stdio / passed in pre-opened socket, targetted at mgmt apps and needs a series of commands to build a VM up from scratch - /usr/bin/qemu (or /usr/bin/qemu-vm) - for a high level binary that targets humans and uses a templating system to expose a friendly simple config, that internally invokes whichever target specific /usr/bin/qemu-buildvm-$TARGET is implied, plus any other vhost-user backends, or whatever other helper processes it needs > Second, because a command line is really hard to get right as complexity > increases. QMP is the way to go to get as clean as possible a configuration > mechanism. There *will* be a second set of warts layered on top of the > above code, and I don't want that. Turning the high level / short config into a general purpose templating problem, strictly separated from the low level binary using QMP, means gives us a more flexible way to live with the warts IMHO. Regards, Daniel -- |: https://berrange.com -o- https://www.flickr.com/photos/dberrange :| |: https://libvirt.org -o- https://fstop138.berrange.com :| |: https://entangle-photo.org -o- https://www.instagram.com/dberrange :|