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[109.43.176.151]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id t14-20020a508d4e000000b004fc01b0aa55sm3696935edt.4.2023.03.16.04.02.34 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Thu, 16 Mar 2023 04:02:34 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: Date: Thu, 16 Mar 2023 12:02:33 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:91.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/91.13.0 Content-Language: en-US To: Andrew Randrianasulu Cc: =?UTF-8?Q?Philippe_Mathieu-Daud=c3=a9?= , qemu-discuss@nongnu.org, QEMU Developers , Markus Armbruster References: <632e7256-34f5-ca87-ff60-a5c11aa1dd7f@redhat.com> From: Thomas Huth Subject: Re: dropping 32-bit host support In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received-SPF: pass client-ip=170.10.133.124; envelope-from=thuth@redhat.com; helo=us-smtp-delivery-124.mimecast.com X-Spam_score_int: -20 X-Spam_score: -2.1 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIMWL_WL_HIGH=-0.001, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, NICE_REPLY_A=-0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=unavailable autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: qemu-devel@nongnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: qemu-devel-bounces+qemu-devel=archiver.kernel.org@nongnu.org Sender: qemu-devel-bounces+qemu-devel=archiver.kernel.org@nongnu.org On 16/03/2023 11.22, Andrew Randrianasulu wrote: > > > чт, 16 мар. 2023 г., 12:17 Andrew Randrianasulu >: > > > > чт, 16 мар. 2023 г., 11:31 Thomas Huth >: > > On 16/03/2023 08.36, Philippe Mathieu-Daudé wrote: > > On 16/3/23 08:17, Andrew Randrianasulu wrote: > >> > >> чт, 16 мар. 2023 г., 10:05 Philippe Mathieu-Daudé > > >> >>: > >> > >>     Hi Andrew, > >> > >>     On 16/3/23 01:57, Andrew Randrianasulu wrote: > >>      > Looking at https://wiki.qemu.org/ChangeLog/8.0 > > >>     > > >>      > > >>     >> > >>      > > >>      > === > >>      > System emulation on 32-bit x86 and ARM hosts has been > deprecated. > >>     The > >>      > QEMU project no longer considers 32-bit x86 and ARM > support for > >>     system > >>      > emulation to be an effective use of its limited > resources, and thus > >>      > intends to discontinue. > >>      > > >>      >   == > >>      > > >>      > well, I guess arguing from memory-consuption point on 32 > bit x86 > >>     hosts > >>      > (like my machine where I run 32 bit userspace on 64 bit > kernel) > > All current PCs have multiple gigabytes of RAM, so using a 32-bit > userspace > to save some few bytes sounds weird. > > > I think difference more like in 20-30% (on disk and in ram), not *few > bytes*. > > > I stand (self) corrected on *on disk* binary size, this parameter tend to be > ~same between bash / php binaries from Slackware 15.0 i586/x86_64. I do not > have full identical x64 Slackware setup for measuring memory impact. > > > Still, pushing users into endless hw upgrade is no fun: > > https://hackaday.com/2023/02/28/repurposing-old-smartphones-when-reusing-makes-more-sense-than-recycling/ > > > note e-waste and energy consumption Now you're mixing things quite badly. That would be an argument in the years before 2010 maybe, when not everybody had a 64-bit processor in their PC yet, but it's been now more than 12 years that all recent Desktop processors feature 64-bit mode. So if QEMU stops supporting 32-bit x86 environments, this is not forcing you to buy a new hardware, since you're having a 64-bit hardware already anyway. If someone still has plain 32-bit x86 hardware around for their daily use, that's certainly not a piece of hardware you want to run QEMU on, since it's older than 12 years already, and thus not really strong enough to run a recent emulator in a recent way. Thomas