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From: Peter Zijlstra <a.p.zijlstra@chello.nl>
To: Trond Myklebust <trond.myklebust@fys.uio.no>
Cc: Andrew Morton <akpm@osdl.org>,
	linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org, linux-mm@kvack.org
Subject: Re: [PATCH] nfs: fix congestion control
Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 15:29:46 +0100	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <1169044186.22935.122.camel@twins> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <1169041814.6102.3.camel@lade.trondhjem.org>

On Wed, 2007-01-17 at 08:50 -0500, Trond Myklebust wrote:
> On Wed, 2007-01-17 at 09:49 +0100, Peter Zijlstra wrote: 
> > > They are certainly _not_ dirty pages. They are pages that have been
> > > written to the server but are not yet guaranteed to have hit the disk
> > > (they were only written to the server's page cache). We don't care if
> > > they are paged in or swapped out on the local client.
> > > 
> > > \All the COMMIT does, is to ask the server to write the data from its
> > > page cache onto disk. Once that has been done, we can release the pages.
> > > If the commit fails, then we iterate through the whole writepage()
> > > process again. The commit itself does, however, not even look at the
> > > page data.
> > 
> > Thou art correct from an NFS point of view, however for the VM they are
> > (still) just dirty pages and we need shed them.
> > 
> > You talk of swapping them out, they are filecache pages not swapcache
> > pages. The writepage() process needs to complete and that entails
> > committing them.
> 
> My point is that we can and should collect as many of the little buggers
> as we can and treat them with ONE commit call. We don't look at the
> data, we don't lock the pages, we don't care what the VM is doing with
> them. Throttling is not only unnecessary, it is actually a bad idea
> since it slows up the rate at which we can free up the pages.

Ah, OK.

I was thinking that since the server needs to actually sync the page a
commit might be quite expensive (timewise), hence I didn't want to flush
too much, and interleave them with writing out some real pages to
utilise bandwidth.

But if you think I should just bulk commit I can do that.


WARNING: multiple messages have this Message-ID (diff)
From: Peter Zijlstra <a.p.zijlstra@chello.nl>
To: Trond Myklebust <trond.myklebust@fys.uio.no>
Cc: Andrew Morton <akpm@osdl.org>,
	linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org, linux-mm@kvack.org
Subject: Re: [PATCH] nfs: fix congestion control
Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 15:29:46 +0100	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <1169044186.22935.122.camel@twins> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <1169041814.6102.3.camel@lade.trondhjem.org>

On Wed, 2007-01-17 at 08:50 -0500, Trond Myklebust wrote:
> On Wed, 2007-01-17 at 09:49 +0100, Peter Zijlstra wrote: 
> > > They are certainly _not_ dirty pages. They are pages that have been
> > > written to the server but are not yet guaranteed to have hit the disk
> > > (they were only written to the server's page cache). We don't care if
> > > they are paged in or swapped out on the local client.
> > > 
> > > \All the COMMIT does, is to ask the server to write the data from its
> > > page cache onto disk. Once that has been done, we can release the pages.
> > > If the commit fails, then we iterate through the whole writepage()
> > > process again. The commit itself does, however, not even look at the
> > > page data.
> > 
> > Thou art correct from an NFS point of view, however for the VM they are
> > (still) just dirty pages and we need shed them.
> > 
> > You talk of swapping them out, they are filecache pages not swapcache
> > pages. The writepage() process needs to complete and that entails
> > committing them.
> 
> My point is that we can and should collect as many of the little buggers
> as we can and treat them with ONE commit call. We don't look at the
> data, we don't lock the pages, we don't care what the VM is doing with
> them. Throttling is not only unnecessary, it is actually a bad idea
> since it slows up the rate at which we can free up the pages.

Ah, OK.

I was thinking that since the server needs to actually sync the page a
commit might be quite expensive (timewise), hence I didn't want to flush
too much, and interleave them with writing out some real pages to
utilise bandwidth.

But if you think I should just bulk commit I can do that.

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  reply	other threads:[~2007-01-17 14:32 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 220+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2007-01-16  5:47 [RFC 0/8] Cpuset aware writeback Christoph Lameter
2007-01-16  5:47 ` Christoph Lameter
2007-01-16  5:47 ` [RFC 1/8] Convert higest_possible_node_id() into nr_node_ids Christoph Lameter
2007-01-16  5:47   ` Christoph Lameter
2007-01-16 22:05   ` Andi Kleen
2007-01-16 22:05     ` Andi Kleen
2007-01-17  3:14     ` Christoph Lameter
2007-01-17  3:14       ` Christoph Lameter
2007-01-17  4:15       ` Andi Kleen
2007-01-17  4:15         ` Andi Kleen
2007-01-17  4:23         ` Christoph Lameter
2007-01-17  4:23           ` Christoph Lameter
2007-01-16  5:47 ` [RFC 2/8] Add a map to inodes to track dirty pages per node Christoph Lameter
2007-01-16  5:47   ` Christoph Lameter
2007-01-16  5:47 ` [RFC 3/8] Add a nodemask to pdflush functions Christoph Lameter
2007-01-16  5:47   ` Christoph Lameter
2007-01-16  5:48 ` [RFC 4/8] Per cpuset dirty ratio handling and writeout Christoph Lameter
2007-01-16  5:48   ` Christoph Lameter
2007-01-16  5:48 ` [RFC 5/8] Make writeout during reclaim cpuset aware Christoph Lameter
2007-01-16  5:48   ` Christoph Lameter
2007-01-16 22:07   ` Andi Kleen
2007-01-16 22:07     ` Andi Kleen
2007-01-17  4:20     ` Paul Jackson
2007-01-17  4:20       ` Paul Jackson
2007-01-17  4:28       ` Andi Kleen
2007-01-17  4:28         ` Andi Kleen
2007-01-17  4:36         ` Paul Jackson
2007-01-17  4:36           ` Paul Jackson
2007-01-17  5:59           ` Andi Kleen
2007-01-17  5:59             ` Andi Kleen
2007-01-17  6:19             ` Christoph Lameter
2007-01-17  6:19               ` Christoph Lameter
2007-01-17  4:23     ` Christoph Lameter
2007-01-17  4:23       ` Christoph Lameter
2007-01-16  5:48 ` [RFC 6/8] Throttle vm writeout per cpuset Christoph Lameter
2007-01-16  5:48   ` Christoph Lameter
2007-01-16  5:48 ` [RFC 7/8] Exclude unreclaimable pages from dirty ration calculation Christoph Lameter
2007-01-16  5:48   ` Christoph Lameter
2007-01-18 15:48   ` Nikita Danilov
2007-01-18 15:48     ` Nikita Danilov
2007-01-18 19:56     ` Christoph Lameter
2007-01-18 19:56       ` Christoph Lameter
2007-01-16  5:48 ` [RFC 8/8] Reduce inode memory usage for systems with a high MAX_NUMNODES Christoph Lameter
2007-01-16  5:48   ` Christoph Lameter
2007-01-16 19:52   ` Paul Menage
2007-01-16 19:52     ` Paul Menage
2007-01-16 20:00     ` Christoph Lameter
2007-01-16 20:00       ` Christoph Lameter
2007-01-16 20:06       ` Paul Menage
2007-01-16 20:06         ` Paul Menage
2007-01-16 20:51         ` Christoph Lameter
2007-01-16 20:51           ` Christoph Lameter
2007-01-16  7:38 ` [RFC 0/8] Cpuset aware writeback Peter Zijlstra
2007-01-16  7:38   ` Peter Zijlstra
2007-01-16 20:10   ` Christoph Lameter
2007-01-16 20:10     ` Christoph Lameter
2007-01-16  9:25 ` Paul Jackson
2007-01-16  9:25   ` Paul Jackson
2007-01-16 17:13   ` Christoph Lameter
2007-01-16 17:13     ` Christoph Lameter
2007-01-16 21:53 ` Andrew Morton
2007-01-16 21:53   ` Andrew Morton
2007-01-16 22:08   ` [PATCH] nfs: fix congestion control Peter Zijlstra
2007-01-16 22:08     ` [PATCH] nfs: fix congestion control, " Peter Zijlstra
2007-01-16 22:27     ` [PATCH] " Trond Myklebust
2007-01-16 22:27       ` Trond Myklebust
2007-01-17  2:41       ` Peter Zijlstra
2007-01-17  2:41         ` Peter Zijlstra
2007-01-17  6:15         ` Trond Myklebust
2007-01-17  6:15           ` Trond Myklebust
2007-01-17  8:49           ` Peter Zijlstra
2007-01-17  8:49             ` Peter Zijlstra
2007-01-17 13:50             ` Trond Myklebust
2007-01-17 13:50               ` Trond Myklebust
2007-01-17 14:29               ` Peter Zijlstra [this message]
2007-01-17 14:29                 ` Peter Zijlstra
2007-01-17 14:45                 ` Trond Myklebust
2007-01-17 14:45                   ` Trond Myklebust
2007-01-17 20:05     ` Christoph Lameter
2007-01-17 20:05       ` Christoph Lameter
2007-01-17 21:52       ` Peter Zijlstra
2007-01-17 21:52         ` Peter Zijlstra
2007-01-17 21:54         ` Trond Myklebust
2007-01-17 21:54           ` Trond Myklebust
2007-01-18 13:27           ` Peter Zijlstra
2007-01-18 13:27             ` Peter Zijlstra
2007-01-18 15:49             ` Trond Myklebust
2007-01-18 15:49               ` Trond Myklebust
2007-01-19  9:33               ` Peter Zijlstra
2007-01-19  9:33                 ` Peter Zijlstra
2007-01-19 13:07                 ` Peter Zijlstra
2007-01-19 13:07                   ` Peter Zijlstra
2007-01-19 16:51                   ` Trond Myklebust
2007-01-19 16:51                     ` Trond Myklebust
2007-01-19 17:54                     ` Peter Zijlstra
2007-01-19 17:54                       ` Peter Zijlstra
2007-01-19 17:20                   ` Christoph Lameter
2007-01-19 17:20                     ` Christoph Lameter
2007-01-19 17:57                     ` Peter Zijlstra
2007-01-19 17:57                       ` Peter Zijlstra
2007-01-19 18:02                       ` Christoph Lameter
2007-01-19 18:02                         ` Christoph Lameter
2007-01-19 18:26                       ` Trond Myklebust
2007-01-19 18:26                         ` Trond Myklebust
2007-01-19 18:27                         ` Christoph Lameter
2007-01-19 18:27                           ` Christoph Lameter
2007-01-20  7:01                         ` [PATCH] nfs: fix congestion control -v3 Peter Zijlstra
2007-01-20  7:01                           ` [PATCH] nfs: fix congestion control -v3, nfs: fix congestion control Peter Zijlstra
2007-01-22 16:12                           ` [PATCH] nfs: fix congestion control -v3 Trond Myklebust
2007-01-22 16:12                             ` Trond Myklebust
2007-01-25 15:32                             ` [PATCH] nfs: fix congestion control -v4 Peter Zijlstra
2007-01-25 15:32                               ` Peter Zijlstra
2007-01-26  5:02                               ` Andrew Morton
2007-01-26  5:02                                 ` Andrew Morton
2007-01-26  8:00                                 ` Peter Zijlstra
2007-01-26  8:00                                   ` Peter Zijlstra
2007-01-26  8:50                                   ` Peter Zijlstra
2007-01-26  8:50                                     ` Peter Zijlstra
2007-01-26  5:09                               ` Andrew Morton
2007-01-26  5:09                                 ` Andrew Morton
2007-01-26  5:31                                 ` Christoph Lameter
2007-01-26  5:31                                   ` Christoph Lameter
2007-01-26  6:04                                   ` Andrew Morton
2007-01-26  6:04                                     ` Andrew Morton
2007-01-26  6:53                                     ` Christoph Lameter
2007-01-26  6:53                                       ` Christoph Lameter
2007-01-26  8:03                                     ` Peter Zijlstra
2007-01-26  8:03                                       ` Peter Zijlstra
2007-01-26  8:51                                       ` Andrew Morton
2007-01-26  8:51                                         ` Andrew Morton
2007-01-26  9:01                                         ` Peter Zijlstra
2007-01-26  9:01                                           ` Peter Zijlstra
2007-02-20 12:59                                         ` Peter Zijlstra
2007-02-20 12:59                                           ` Peter Zijlstra
2007-01-22 17:59                           ` [PATCH] nfs: fix congestion control -v3 Christoph Lameter
2007-01-22 17:59                             ` Christoph Lameter
2007-01-17 23:15     ` [PATCH] nfs: fix congestion control Christoph Hellwig
2007-01-17 23:15       ` Christoph Hellwig
2007-01-16 22:15   ` [RFC 0/8] Cpuset aware writeback Christoph Lameter
2007-01-16 22:15     ` Christoph Lameter
2007-01-16 23:40     ` Andrew Morton
2007-01-16 23:40       ` Andrew Morton
2007-01-17  0:16       ` Christoph Lameter
2007-01-17  0:16         ` Christoph Lameter
2007-01-17  1:07         ` Andrew Morton
2007-01-17  1:07           ` Andrew Morton
2007-01-17  1:30           ` Christoph Lameter
2007-01-17  1:30             ` Christoph Lameter
2007-01-17  2:34             ` Andrew Morton
2007-01-17  2:34               ` Andrew Morton
2007-01-17  3:40               ` Christoph Lameter
2007-01-17  3:40                 ` Christoph Lameter
2007-01-17  4:02                 ` Paul Jackson
2007-01-17  4:02                   ` Paul Jackson
2007-01-17  4:05                 ` Andrew Morton
2007-01-17  4:05                   ` Andrew Morton
2007-01-17  6:27                   ` Christoph Lameter
2007-01-17  6:27                     ` Christoph Lameter
2007-01-17  7:00                     ` Andrew Morton
2007-01-17  7:00                       ` Andrew Morton
2007-01-17  8:01                       ` Paul Jackson
2007-01-17  8:01                         ` Paul Jackson
2007-01-17  9:57                         ` Andrew Morton
2007-01-17  9:57                           ` Andrew Morton
2007-01-17 19:43                       ` Christoph Lameter
2007-01-17 19:43                         ` Christoph Lameter
2007-01-17 22:10                         ` Andrew Morton
2007-01-17 22:10                           ` Andrew Morton
2007-01-18  1:10                           ` Christoph Lameter
2007-01-18  1:10                             ` Christoph Lameter
2007-01-18  1:25                             ` Andrew Morton
2007-01-18  1:25                               ` Andrew Morton
2007-01-18  5:21                               ` Christoph Lameter
2007-01-18  5:21                                 ` Christoph Lameter
2007-01-16 23:44   ` David Chinner
2007-01-16 23:44     ` David Chinner
2007-01-16 22:01 ` Andi Kleen
2007-01-16 22:01   ` Andi Kleen
2007-01-16 22:18   ` Christoph Lameter
2007-01-16 22:18     ` Christoph Lameter
2007-02-02  1:38 ` Ethan Solomita
2007-02-02  1:38   ` Ethan Solomita
2007-02-02  2:16   ` Christoph Lameter
2007-02-02  2:16     ` Christoph Lameter
2007-02-02  4:03     ` Andrew Morton
2007-02-02  4:03       ` Andrew Morton
2007-02-02  5:29       ` Christoph Lameter
2007-02-02  5:29         ` Christoph Lameter
2007-02-02  6:02         ` Neil Brown
2007-02-02  6:02           ` Neil Brown
2007-02-02  6:17           ` Christoph Lameter
2007-02-02  6:17             ` Christoph Lameter
2007-02-02  6:41             ` Neil Brown
2007-02-02  6:41               ` Neil Brown
2007-02-02  7:12         ` Andrew Morton
2007-02-02  7:12           ` Andrew Morton
2007-03-21 21:11     ` Ethan Solomita
2007-03-21 21:11       ` Ethan Solomita
2007-03-21 21:29       ` Christoph Lameter
2007-03-21 21:29         ` Christoph Lameter
2007-03-21 21:52         ` Andrew Morton
2007-03-21 21:52           ` Andrew Morton
2007-03-21 21:57           ` Christoph Lameter
2007-03-21 21:57             ` Christoph Lameter
2007-04-19  2:07         ` Ethan Solomita
2007-04-19  2:07           ` Ethan Solomita
2007-04-19  2:55           ` Christoph Lameter
2007-04-19  2:55             ` Christoph Lameter
2007-04-19  7:52             ` Ethan Solomita
2007-04-19  7:52               ` Ethan Solomita
2007-04-19 16:03               ` Christoph Lameter
2007-04-19 16:03                 ` Christoph Lameter
2007-04-21  1:37             ` Ethan Solomita
2007-04-21  1:37               ` Ethan Solomita
2007-04-21  1:48               ` Christoph Lameter
2007-04-21  1:48                 ` Christoph Lameter
2007-04-21  8:15                 ` Ethan Solomita
2007-04-21  8:15                   ` Ethan Solomita
2007-04-21 15:40                   ` Christoph Lameter
2007-04-21 15:40                     ` Christoph Lameter

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