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From: Benjamin Herrenschmidt <benh@kernel.crashing.org>
To: Linus Torvalds <torvalds@linux-foundation.org>
Cc: linuxppc-dev@ozlabs.org, akpm@linux-foundation.org,
	Herbert Xu <herbert@gondor.apana.org.au>,
	linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org
Subject: Re: [PATCH] synchronize_irq needs a barrier
Date: Fri, 19 Oct 2007 09:17:29 +1000	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <1192749449.7367.51.camel@pasglop> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <alpine.LFD.0.999.0710181549330.26902@woody.linux-foundation.org>


On Thu, 2007-10-18 at 15:52 -0700, Linus Torvalds wrote:
> 
> On Fri, 19 Oct 2007, Benjamin Herrenschmidt wrote:
> > 
> > The barrier would guarantee that ioc->active (and in fact the write to
> > the chip too above) are globally visible
> 
> No, it doesn't really guarantee that.
> 
> The thing is, there is no such thing as "globally visible".
> 
> There is a "ordering of visibility wrt CPU's", but it's not global, it's 
> quite potentially per-CPU. So a barrier on one CPU doesn't guarantee 
> anything at all without a barrier on the *other* CPU.
> 
> That said, the interrupt handling itself contains various barriers on the 
> CPU's that receive interrupts, thanks to the spinlocking. But I do agree 
> with Herbert that adding a "smb_mb()" is certainly in no way "obviously 
> correct", because it doesn't talk about what the other side does wrt 
> barriers and that word in memory.

I agree and you can see that in fact, we don't have enough barrier on
the other side since spin_unlock doesn't prevent subsequent loads from
crossing a previous store...

I wonder if that's worth trying to address, adding a barrier in
handle_IRQ_event for example, or we can continue ignoring the barrier
and let some drivers do their own fixes in fancy ways.

Ben.

WARNING: multiple messages have this Message-ID (diff)
From: Benjamin Herrenschmidt <benh@kernel.crashing.org>
To: Linus Torvalds <torvalds@linux-foundation.org>
Cc: Herbert Xu <herbert@gondor.apana.org.au>,
	akpm@linux-foundation.org, linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org,
	linuxppc-dev@ozlabs.org
Subject: Re: [PATCH] synchronize_irq needs a barrier
Date: Fri, 19 Oct 2007 09:17:29 +1000	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <1192749449.7367.51.camel@pasglop> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <alpine.LFD.0.999.0710181549330.26902@woody.linux-foundation.org>


On Thu, 2007-10-18 at 15:52 -0700, Linus Torvalds wrote:
> 
> On Fri, 19 Oct 2007, Benjamin Herrenschmidt wrote:
> > 
> > The barrier would guarantee that ioc->active (and in fact the write to
> > the chip too above) are globally visible
> 
> No, it doesn't really guarantee that.
> 
> The thing is, there is no such thing as "globally visible".
> 
> There is a "ordering of visibility wrt CPU's", but it's not global, it's 
> quite potentially per-CPU. So a barrier on one CPU doesn't guarantee 
> anything at all without a barrier on the *other* CPU.
> 
> That said, the interrupt handling itself contains various barriers on the 
> CPU's that receive interrupts, thanks to the spinlocking. But I do agree 
> with Herbert that adding a "smb_mb()" is certainly in no way "obviously 
> correct", because it doesn't talk about what the other side does wrt 
> barriers and that word in memory.

I agree and you can see that in fact, we don't have enough barrier on
the other side since spin_unlock doesn't prevent subsequent loads from
crossing a previous store...

I wonder if that's worth trying to address, adding a barrier in
handle_IRQ_event for example, or we can continue ignoring the barrier
and let some drivers do their own fixes in fancy ways.

Ben.



  reply	other threads:[~2007-10-18 23:18 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 96+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2007-10-18  1:25 [PATCH] synchronize_irq needs a barrier Benjamin Herrenschmidt
2007-10-18  1:25 ` Benjamin Herrenschmidt
2007-10-18  1:45 ` Andrew Morton
2007-10-18  1:45   ` Andrew Morton
2007-10-18  1:55   ` Benjamin Herrenschmidt
2007-10-18  1:55     ` Benjamin Herrenschmidt
2007-10-18  2:12 ` Linus Torvalds
2007-10-18  2:12   ` Linus Torvalds
2007-10-18  2:40   ` Benjamin Herrenschmidt
2007-10-18  2:40     ` Benjamin Herrenschmidt
2007-10-18  2:57     ` Benjamin Herrenschmidt
2007-10-18  2:57       ` Benjamin Herrenschmidt
2007-10-18 14:56       ` Herbert Xu
2007-10-18 14:56         ` Herbert Xu
2007-10-18 22:05         ` Benjamin Herrenschmidt
2007-10-18 22:05           ` Benjamin Herrenschmidt
2007-10-18 22:52           ` Linus Torvalds
2007-10-18 22:52             ` Linus Torvalds
2007-10-18 23:17             ` Benjamin Herrenschmidt [this message]
2007-10-18 23:17               ` Benjamin Herrenschmidt
2007-10-18 23:39               ` Linus Torvalds
2007-10-18 23:39                 ` Linus Torvalds
2007-10-18 23:52                 ` Benjamin Herrenschmidt
2007-10-18 23:52                   ` Benjamin Herrenschmidt
2007-10-19  2:32                 ` Herbert Xu
2007-10-19  2:32                   ` Herbert Xu
2007-10-19  2:52                   ` Nick Piggin
2007-10-19  2:52                     ` Nick Piggin
2007-10-19  3:28                     ` Herbert Xu
2007-10-19  3:28                       ` Herbert Xu
2007-10-19  4:49                       ` Nick Piggin
2007-10-19  4:49                         ` Nick Piggin
2007-10-19  2:55                   ` Linus Torvalds
2007-10-19  2:55                     ` Linus Torvalds
2007-10-19  3:26                     ` Linus Torvalds
2007-10-19  3:26                       ` Linus Torvalds
2007-10-19  4:11                       ` Benjamin Herrenschmidt
2007-10-19  4:11                         ` Benjamin Herrenschmidt
2007-10-19  4:26                         ` Benjamin Herrenschmidt
2007-10-19  4:26                           ` Benjamin Herrenschmidt
2007-10-19  5:53                           ` Herbert Xu
2007-10-19  5:53                             ` Herbert Xu
2007-10-19  4:20                       ` Herbert Xu
2007-10-19  4:20                         ` Herbert Xu
2007-10-19  4:29                         ` Benjamin Herrenschmidt
2007-10-19  4:29                           ` Benjamin Herrenschmidt
2007-10-19  4:35                         ` Benjamin Herrenschmidt
2007-10-19  4:35                           ` Benjamin Herrenschmidt
2007-10-19  4:48                         ` Herbert Xu
2007-10-19  4:48                           ` Herbert Xu
2007-10-19  4:58                           ` Benjamin Herrenschmidt
2007-10-19  4:58                             ` Benjamin Herrenschmidt
2007-10-21 21:10                             ` Benjamin Herrenschmidt
2007-10-21 21:10                               ` Benjamin Herrenschmidt
2007-10-23  3:26                               ` [IRQ]: Fix synchronize_irq races with IRQ handler Herbert Xu
2007-10-23  3:26                                 ` Herbert Xu
2007-10-19  5:36                         ` [NET]: Fix possible dev_deactivate race condition Herbert Xu
2007-10-19  5:36                           ` Herbert Xu
2007-10-19  5:38                           ` David Miller
2007-10-19  5:38                             ` David Miller
2007-10-19  7:35                           ` Peter Zijlstra
2007-10-19  7:35                             ` Peter Zijlstra
2007-10-19  9:29                             ` Herbert Xu
2007-10-19  9:29                               ` Herbert Xu
2007-10-18 14:35     ` [PATCH] synchronize_irq needs a barrier Herbert Xu
2007-10-18 14:35       ` Herbert Xu
2007-10-18 21:35       ` Benjamin Herrenschmidt
2007-10-18 21:35         ` Benjamin Herrenschmidt
2007-10-20  2:02 ` Maxim Levitsky
2007-10-20  2:02   ` Maxim Levitsky
2007-10-20  2:25   ` Linus Torvalds
2007-10-20  2:25     ` Linus Torvalds
2007-10-20  3:10     ` Maxim Levitsky
2007-10-20  3:10       ` Maxim Levitsky
2007-10-20  4:06       ` Benjamin Herrenschmidt
2007-10-20  4:06         ` Benjamin Herrenschmidt
2007-10-20  4:04     ` Benjamin Herrenschmidt
2007-10-20  4:04       ` Benjamin Herrenschmidt
2007-10-20  4:09       ` Benjamin Herrenschmidt
2007-10-20  4:09         ` Benjamin Herrenschmidt
2007-10-20  3:37   ` Herbert Xu
2007-10-20  3:37     ` Herbert Xu
2007-10-20  3:56   ` Benjamin Herrenschmidt
2007-10-20  3:56     ` Benjamin Herrenschmidt
2007-10-20  4:24     ` Maxim Levitsky
2007-10-20  4:24       ` Maxim Levitsky
2007-10-20  5:04       ` Benjamin Herrenschmidt
2007-10-20  5:04         ` Benjamin Herrenschmidt
2007-10-20  5:36         ` Maxim Levitsky
2007-10-20  5:36           ` Maxim Levitsky
2007-10-20  5:46           ` Benjamin Herrenschmidt
2007-10-20  5:46             ` Benjamin Herrenschmidt
2007-10-20  6:06             ` Maxim Levitsky
2007-10-20  6:06               ` Maxim Levitsky
2007-10-20  6:13               ` Benjamin Herrenschmidt
2007-10-20  6:13                 ` Benjamin Herrenschmidt

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