RE: Sanity? (was reiser freedom)

RE: Sanity? (was reiser freedom)

[Burnes, James]

As some of the people on this list have mentioned, it's really two
issues which should be addressed seperately.

1. The credits thing.  Probably handled better out of band then
quibbling over the license.

2. The "plagiarism" issue.  Apparently some distros (can someone name
names please.  This needs to be out in the open) are arbitrarily
renaming executable names for marketing reasons.  It's one thing to fork
a code base and make program changes, give it a new name or something
like that in the interest of preserving diversity etc...  But if it's
true that various distros are renaming programs and subsystems as
"rebadged" proprietary software environments, it's a pretty slimey
practice and I think that the best solution for it is to bring it out
into the light.

As Thomas Jefferson once said, the solution to the abuse of freedom is
more freedom.  Bring these issues out into the light and the cockroaches
will scatter.

Has this been brought up on Slashdot or some other high profile forum?

Lets put together a list of names and shame them into submission.  

Let's not monkey with the GPL or Debian.  That's like throwing the baby
out with the bathwater.


jim burnes
security engineer
great-west, denver
 

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Redeeman [mailto:redeeman@metanurb.dk]
> Sent: Wednesday, May 05, 2004 9:42 AM
> To: Reiserfs Mailinglist
> Subject: Re: Sanity?
> 
> On Wed, 2004-05-05 at 08:05, Rhyotte wrote:
> >    Hans, how do you retain any scrap of sanity? This whole thing is
> > getting so far outta sight it is crazy. What is wrong with them
simply
> > accrediting you and the Reiser Team??????? I believe I have seen you
say
> > that Credits at install time would be fine right? @ the rest of you:
> > What is wrong with that?? seems pretty unreasonable of all of you to
say
> > no to this. Now I will go on record as saying I definately do not
want
> > to see a list of credits every time i boot my system. That would be
> > totaly unreasonable. In my opinion you all really need to drop the
silly
> > and counter productive argument. Act like adults, make an agreement
then
> > shake hands and be friends again. Sheesh, SOME of us would like to
see
> > Reiser4 out in the public as a full release!!
> 
> i have absolutely no problem the way reiser4 works now, hell, i havent
> noticed a change. but now where you announce a "monster" big problem,
i
> tried follow the boot of a machine running reiser4, and i see fsck
tell
> "see credits for more info", or something like that, whats wrong with
> that? hell! remove the message from reiser4progs then! i believe they
> are GPL.
> 
> get real.
> 
> >
> > Peace
> > Gary Sheppard
> --
> Regards, Redeeman
> ()  ascii ribbon campaign - against html e-mail
> /\                        - against microsoft attachments

Re: Sanity? (was reiser freedom)

[Hans Reiser]

Burnes, James wrote:

>As some of the people on this list have mentioned, it's really two
>issues which should be addressed seperately.
>
>1. The credits thing.  Probably handled better out of band then
>quibbling over the license.
>
>2. The "plagiarism" issue.  Apparently some distros (can someone name
>names please.  This needs to be out in the open) are arbitrarily
>renaming executable names for marketing reasons.
>
RedHat renaming KDE programs.

>  It's one thing to fork
>a code base and make program changes, give it a new name or something
>like that in the interest of preserving diversity etc...  But if it's
>true that various distros are renaming programs and subsystems as
>"rebadged" proprietary software environments,
>
rebadged free software to be precise

> it's a pretty slimey
>practice and I think that the best solution for it is to bring it out
>into the light.
>
>As Thomas Jefferson once said, the solution to the abuse of freedom is
>more freedom.  Bring these issues out into the light and the cockroaches
>will scatter.
>
>Has this been brought up on Slashdot or some other high profile forum?
>  
>
It was slashdotted.

RedHat suffered not.

If they can do this to KDE, then surely reiser4 can and eventually will 
have that happen to it also.  Build something valuable, someone will try 
to steal it or the credit for it, that is the way the world works.

>Lets put together a list of names and shame them into submission.  
>  
>
Won't work.  Only license changes can work.  Thus GFDL, XFree86, and the 
Anti-Plagiarism License are coming into existence in the aftermath of that.

>Let's not monkey with the GPL or Debian.  That's like throwing the baby
>out with the bathwater.
>  
>
GPL is not some holy writ.  Don't treat it like one.  GPL is just one of 
many very valid choices of tradeoffs in licensing.

>
>jim burnes
>security engineer
>great-west, denver
> 
>
>  
>
>>-----Original Message-----
>>From: Redeeman [mailto:redeeman@metanurb.dk]
>>Sent: Wednesday, May 05, 2004 9:42 AM
>>To: Reiserfs Mailinglist
>>Subject: Re: Sanity?
>>
>>On Wed, 2004-05-05 at 08:05, Rhyotte wrote:
>>    
>>
>>>   Hans, how do you retain any scrap of sanity? This whole thing is
>>>getting so far outta sight it is crazy. What is wrong with them
>>>      
>>>
>simply
>  
>
>>>accrediting you and the Reiser Team??????? I believe I have seen you
>>>      
>>>
>say
>  
>
>>>that Credits at install time would be fine right? @ the rest of you:
>>>What is wrong with that?? seems pretty unreasonable of all of you to
>>>      
>>>
>say
>  
>
>>>no to this. Now I will go on record as saying I definately do not
>>>      
>>>
>want
>  
>
>>>to see a list of credits every time i boot my system. That would be
>>>totaly unreasonable. In my opinion you all really need to drop the
>>>      
>>>
>silly
>  
>
>>>and counter productive argument. Act like adults, make an agreement
>>>      
>>>
>then
>  
>
>>>shake hands and be friends again. Sheesh, SOME of us would like to
>>>      
>>>
>see
>  
>
>>>Reiser4 out in the public as a full release!!
>>>      
>>>
>>i have absolutely no problem the way reiser4 works now, hell, i havent
>>noticed a change. but now where you announce a "monster" big problem,
>>    
>>
>i
>  
>
>>tried follow the boot of a machine running reiser4, and i see fsck
>>    
>>
>tell
>  
>
>>"see credits for more info", or something like that, whats wrong with
>>that? hell! remove the message from reiser4progs then! i believe they
>>are GPL.
>>
>>get real.
>>
>>    
>>
>>>Peace
>>>Gary Sheppard
>>>      
>>>
>>--
>>Regards, Redeeman
>>()  ascii ribbon campaign - against html e-mail
>>/\                        - against microsoft attachments
>>    
>>
>
>
>
>  
>