Re: multidistro grub2 idea

Re: multidistro grub2 idea

[BVK]

On 7/23/07, adrian15 <adrian15sgd@gmail.com> wrote:

> I think that if grub2 is going to have scripting and so many new
> features we should take advantage of them and change the way computers
> do boot.
>
> #1) All Linux installers should set or reuse a ext2 partition next to
> the windows one as a /boot one where grub2 is installed.
>
>
> What are your thoughts about this idea?
>

Can't grub2 merge menu.lst files from all grub2-readable partitions
and generate a menu dynamically? I dont know, but does this require
grub2 to load *all* filesystem modules on boot-up?

-- 
bvk-chaitanya

multidistro grub2 idea

[adrian15]

THE PROBLEM
=============

	The problem about boot loaders in a multi distribution environment is
the grub configurations being overlapped.
	Imagined this partition layout:
	part 1: windows
	part 2: ubuntu
	part 3: debian

	If you install first windows, then ubuntu and then debian is great
possible that debian makes its menu.lst be the default one.
It can also have the correct lines for booting ubuntu or it might have
not them.
	I suppose that there is more complication when you run the update-grub
command when a kernel has been updated.

THE DISCUSSION
================

	When there are multiple distros I've been regularly astonished of the
ones that advice of copy-and-paste lines from other menu.lst and add it
to your current one. And they are people that not even use
copy-and-paste and advice to add the lines by hand.
	I think the problem is here is that no one knows that a command called
configfile exists.
	In my computer I have 4 menu.lst and I have not used the configfile
approach. I have installed grub in the distros' partition and  also in
the mbr which is associated with a grub installed on a /boot partition.

Disk /dev/sda: 137.4 GB, 137437871104 bytes
255 heads, 63 sectors/track, 16709 cylinders
Units = cylinders of 16065 * 512 = 8225280 bytes

    Device Boot Start         End      Blocks   Id  System
/dev/sda1   *      1        1275    10241406    c  W95 FAT32 (LBA)
/dev/sda2       1276        1287       96390   83  Linux	(/BOOT)
/dev/sda3       1288        3719    19535040   83  Linux   (DEBIAN)
/dev/sda4       3720       16709   104342175    5  Extended
/dev/sda5       3720       15147    91795378+  83  Linux   (/HOME)
/dev/sda6      15148       16166     8185086   83  Linux   (FEDORA)
/dev/sda7      16167       16198      257008+  82  Linux swap / Solaris
/dev/sda8      16199       16709     4104576   83  Linux(TEST DISTROS)


THE SOLUTION
=============

I think that if grub2 is going to have scripting and so many new
features we should take advantage of them and change the way computers
do boot.

#1) All Linux installers should set or reuse a ext2 partition next to
the windows one as a /boot one where grub2 is installed.

#2) /boot/grub/

	will have a new folder called:

	/boot/grub/menu/

	which will be filled with .cfg files from the different distros that
are installed in a computer.

As an example ubuntu installed on /dev/sda2 should have a
ubuntu-sda2.cfg file in there.

#3) grub2 should include tools to deal with this .cfg files from the
linux environment.

#4) /boot/grub/grub2.cfg will be used for determining which of the .cfg
files inside /boot/grub/menu is the default one and which it is the
timeout for it.
(If only one .cfg file is found then timeout is 0).

#5) The problems that happened when a distro had been patched for doing
one thing or another one will not exist. Why? Because distros can take
advantage of the modules in order to add its own enhacements to grub2.

#6) /boot/grub/grub2.cfg security should be enhanced.

What are your thoughts about this idea?

adrian15

Re: multidistro grub2 idea

[adrian15]

BVK escribió:
> On 7/23/07, adrian15 <adrian15sgd@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
>> I think that if grub2 is going to have scripting and so many new
>> features we should take advantage of them and change the way computers
>> do boot.
>>
>> #1) All Linux installers should set or reuse a ext2 partition next to
>> the windows one as a /boot one where grub2 is installed.
>>
>>
>> What are your thoughts about this idea?
>>
> 
> Can't grub2 merge menu.lst files from all grub2-readable partitions
> and generate a menu dynamically? I dont know, but does this require
> grub2 to load *all* filesystem modules on boot-up?
> 

That's quite similar to how Super Grub Disk works when you try to boot
an existing linux and it seeks for all the menu.lst.

I am talking about changing the boot world. Having an unique boot
partition might make things much simpler.

Although I also think that if you loose this partition you are in
trouble so there should be a backup of this partiton somewhere on the
root partitions. :)

adrian15

Re: multidistro grub2 idea

[Mani A]

On 7/23/07, adrian15 <adrian15sgd@gmail.com> wrote:
> THE PROBLEM
> =============
>
>         The problem about boot loaders in a multi distribution environment is
> the grub configurations being overlapped.

>         I think the problem is here is that no one knows that a command called
> configfile exists.
>         In my computer I have 4 menu.lst and I have not used the configfile
> approach. I have installed grub in the distros' partition and  also in
> the mbr which is associated with a grub installed on a /boot partition.
>
> Disk /dev/sda: 137.4 GB, 137437871104 bytes
> 255 heads, 63 sectors/track, 16709 cylinders
> Units = cylinders of 16065 * 512 = 8225280 bytes
>
>     Device Boot Start         End      Blocks   Id  System
> /dev/sda1   *      1        1275    10241406    c  W95 FAT32 (LBA)
> /dev/sda2       1276        1287       96390   83  Linux        (/BOOT)
> /dev/sda3       1288        3719    19535040   83  Linux   (DEBIAN)
> /dev/sda4       3720       16709   104342175    5  Extended
> /dev/sda5       3720       15147    91795378+  83  Linux   (/HOME)
> /dev/sda6      15148       16166     8185086   83  Linux   (FEDORA)
> /dev/sda7      16167       16198      257008+  82  Linux swap / Solaris
> /dev/sda8      16199       16709     4104576   83  Linux(TEST DISTROS)
>
>
> THE SOLUTION
> =============
>
> I think that if grub2 is going to have scripting and so many new
> features we should take advantage of them and change the way computers
> do boot.
>
> #1) All Linux installers should set or reuse a ext2 partition next to
> the windows one as a /boot one where grub2 is installed.
.. . if the dreaded OS exists. But a single /boot partition is not
preferable over 'but from anywhere' principle.

>
> #2) /boot/grub/
>
>         will have a new folder called:
>
>         /boot/grub/menu/
>
>         which will be filled with .cfg files from the different distros that
> are installed in a computer.

It will be a good thing if, if grub2 is installed to the mbr of the
active partition and  if a new OS is going to be installed, then we
must be able to tell grub2 about it and accordingly it must be able to
update the .cfg, when the new OS tries to write to the MBR of any of
the partitions.

Best

A. Mani

-- 
A. Mani
Member, Cal. Math. Soc

Re: multidistro grub2 idea

[Mani A]

On 8/12/07, adrian15 <adrian15sgd@gmail.com> wrote:
> Mani A escribió:
<snip>
> >
> > It will be a good thing if, if grub2 is installed to the mbr of the
> > active partition and  if a new OS is going to be installed, then we
> > must be able to tell grub2 about it and accordingly it must be able to
> > update the .cfg, when the new OS tries to write to the MBR of any of
> > the partitions.
> How would you detects this partition boot records changes? Saving a
> backup somewhere in the linux system and running an utility on the boot
> that compares backup to real partition boot sectors and asks you if you
> want to update cfg?

Yes that would be one way to implement it. The way current hardware
is, an extra utility on boot will be natural, safer and user friendly.

Best

A. Mani


-- 
A. Mani
Member, Cal. Math. Soc

Re: multidistro grub2 idea

[adrian15]

Mani A escribió:
>> #1) All Linux installers should set or reuse a ext2 partition next to
>> the windows one as a /boot one where grub2 is installed.
> .. . if the dreaded OS exists. But a single /boot partition is not
> preferable over 'but from anywhere' principle.
Well.. this is the old discussion: Centrality versus Redundancy and its
problems.
> 
>> #2) /boot/grub/
>>
>>         will have a new folder called:
>>
>>         /boot/grub/menu/
>>
>>         which will be filled with .cfg files from the different distros that
>> are installed in a computer.
> 
> It will be a good thing if, if grub2 is installed to the mbr of the
> active partition and  if a new OS is going to be installed, then we
> must be able to tell grub2 about it and accordingly it must be able to
> update the .cfg, when the new OS tries to write to the MBR of any of
> the partitions.
How would you detects this partition boot records changes? Saving a
backup somewhere in the linux system and running an utility on the boot
that compares backup to real partition boot sectors and asks you if you
want to update cfg?

That's your idea?

adrian15