Honest does not pay here ...

Honest does not pay here ...

[Andre Hedrick]

Well, all this goes to show you is that if you try to do the right thing
and you have something of value, you are attacked.

I have enjoyed begin called everything from a turncoat, backstabber,
cheater, liar, theif, weasle.

I guess I should not have said anything, and behaved like the rest.

You know the embedded, the appliance, etc ... resellers who we all know
close up the code and ship for commerial reasons.  Funny how they can do
it and nobody cares or they hide with a grin screaming NIMBY NIMBY.
Everyone is doing it and everyone looks away.

Best of all some of the worst name callers are the ones who use the code I
wrote to enable them to make money.  Yet if you have something which does
not exist in the kernel and you adopt an API to use kernel calls, you get
branded and hated.

It could not have happened to a nicer loser, "fill in the blank" ...

Well you all have gotten all kinds of goodie for free, and I just want to
keep one of my pieces of hard work that was created during the time I was
booted out.

Well I was thinking of giving part of it to the community after I
recovered my costs of development, now I think not.

At least I have the integrity to state clearly my intentions, while the
rest hide and cower in corners.  This reminds me of a bucket of crabs.

Well I really wanted to use every dirty word in the book, but it is not
worth it.

I will plan to put "linux-ide.org" and "linuxdiskcert.org" up for sale.
Additionally I will try to arrange for a legal transfer of the NDA's
attached to "Linux ATA Development" to the individual or group who wish to
purchase the access, pays all legal fees/work to to complete the transaction.
I wisely attached any and all NDA's to the fore mentioned organization.

If you are interested, please contact me offline.
Please also have the means to purchase the information to be transferred
which is not covered by any of the NDA's.  This will include various
pieces of IP which was scheduled to be transfered to the kernel, but now
will only be for sale as an entire package.

The transaction for purchase will be executed via a wire transfer of funds
to a specified account, once cleared it you will receive a manifest.

regards,

-ah

Re: Honest does not pay here ...

[Murray J. Root]

On Sat, Jan 04, 2003 at 06:12:29AM -0800, Andre Hedrick wrote:
> 
> Well, all this goes to show you is that if you try to do the right thing
> and you have something of value, you are attacked.
> 

I think you're taking the words of a few extremists a little too personal.
Judging from the responses I've seen on the threads Hell.Surfers has forked
the majority of the kernel hackers do not agree with the more offensive
"free software or die" crowd. Your efforts are appreciated also by those of
us who know better than to get into a flamewar with zealots. You don't see
our posts because we don't argue when the logic will be ignored.
I hope you change your mind, but if not - thanks for your contributions.

-- 
Murray J. Root
------------------------------------------------
DISCLAIMER: http://www.goldmark.org/jeff/stupid-disclaimers/
------------------------------------------------
Mandrake on irc.freenode.net:
  #mandrake & #mandrake-linux = help for newbies 
  #mdk-cooker = Mandrake Cooker
  #cooker = moderated Mandrake Cooker

Re: Honest does not pay here ...

[William Lee Irwin III]

On Sat, Jan 04, 2003 at 06:12:29AM -0800, Andre Hedrick wrote:
> Well, all this goes to show you is that if you try to do the right thing
> and you have something of value, you are attacked.
> I have enjoyed begin called everything from a turncoat, backstabber,
> cheater, liar, theif, weasle.
[(over?)reaction trimmed]

Any chance we could all just get along?


Bill

Re: Honest does not pay here ...

[Andrew McGregor]

--On Saturday, January 04, 2003 06:12:29 -0800 Andre Hedrick 
<andre@linux-ide.org> wrote:

>
> Well, all this goes to show you is that if you try to do the right thing
> and you have something of value, you are attacked.
>
> I have enjoyed begin called everything from a turncoat, backstabber,
> cheater, liar, theif, weasle.
>
> I guess I should not have said anything, and behaved like the rest.
>
> You know the embedded, the appliance, etc ... resellers who we all know
> close up the code and ship for commerial reasons.  Funny how they can do
> it and nobody cares or they hide with a grin screaming NIMBY NIMBY.
> Everyone is doing it and everyone looks away.

You know, people often only look at things in front of their noses.  So 
people notice ATA and video drivers because they have the hardware. 
Whereas, do you really know what is going on inside some appliance?  And on 
this list is definitely in front of the nose.

> Best of all some of the worst name callers are the ones who use the code I
> wrote to enable them to make money.  Yet if you have something which does
> not exist in the kernel and you adopt an API to use kernel calls, you get
> branded and hated.

Guys, you know who you are.  Apologise.  Please?

You know that this kind of thing just makes the community and its goals 
weaker.  All its varied goals.  Freedom, zealatrous, pragmatic, 
intellectual, business in the presence of freedom, even just business that 
isn't a huge corporate.  Whatever.

No-one is served by alienating people, except perhaps the corporate 
hegemony, and that indirectly.

> It could not have happened to a nicer loser, "fill in the blank" ...
>
> Well you all have gotten all kinds of goodie for free, and I just want to
> keep one of my pieces of hard work that was created during the time I was
> booted out.
>
> Well I was thinking of giving part of it to the community after I
> recovered my costs of development, now I think not.
>
> At least I have the integrity to state clearly my intentions, while the
> rest hide and cower in corners.  This reminds me of a bucket of crabs.

Andre was not trolling.  Really.

Andre, I hope you change your mind.

> Well I really wanted to use every dirty word in the book, but it is not
> worth it.
>
> I will plan to put "linux-ide.org" and "linuxdiskcert.org" up for sale.
> Additionally I will try to arrange for a legal transfer of the NDA's
> attached to "Linux ATA Development" to the individual or group who wish to
> purchase the access, pays all legal fees/work to to complete the
> transaction. I wisely attached any and all NDA's to the fore mentioned
> organization.
>
> If you are interested, please contact me offline.
> Please also have the means to purchase the information to be transferred
> which is not covered by any of the NDA's.  This will include various
> pieces of IP which was scheduled to be transfered to the kernel, but now
> will only be for sale as an entire package.
>
> The transaction for purchase will be executed via a wire transfer of funds
> to a specified account, once cleared it you will receive a manifest.
>
> regards,
>
> -ah

Re: Honest does not pay here ...

[Rik van Riel]

On Sat, 4 Jan 2003, Andre Hedrick wrote:

> Well, all this goes to show you is that if you try to do the right thing
> and you have something of value, you are attacked.

Attacked by (mostly) a bunch of wankers who don't seem to do much
useful themselves.  People who do useful work once in a while know
how much effort you are putting into Linux drivers and appreciate
the work you're doing.

> Well you all have gotten all kinds of goodie for free,

And I thank you for that.

> Well I was thinking of giving part of it to the community after I
> recovered my costs of development, now I think not.

That's a real shame.  I like your business model of recovering the
development costs before releasing the software since it's a way
to fund your work on the kernel pretty much full-time, which seems
to have resulted in really good free drivers.

To be honest I don't understand why people are complaining about
the fact that your model keeps some drivers closed for 18 months,
while a completely free model wouldn't even start development of
the drivers for 18 months, until after the hardware became generally
available.

regards,

Rik
-- 
Bravely reimplemented by the knights who say "NIH".
http://www.surriel.com/		http://guru.conectiva.com/
Current spamtrap:  <a href=mailto:"october@surriel.com">october@surriel.com</a>

RE: Honest does not pay here ...

[Steve Lee]

Andre, are you sure you didn't mean to post this April 1?  Unfortunately
I think not, and so this marks a truly sad day for every current and
future Linux user.  One of my favorite past times is programming.  I
guess I read the linux-kernel daily because it's like reading from the
book of Programming God's.  I have such great respect for you and so
many others here.  There is only so much whining a person can take, I
understand that.  I assume you do this because you enjoy doing it.
Please don't listen to the whiner's; they don't speak for those of us
that really care.  I know you don't know me, and I rarely post here
(because I have nothing to contribute usually), but I am someone that
has truly appreciated the work you've done.

Steve


-----Original Message-----
From: linux-kernel-owner@vger.kernel.org
[mailto:linux-kernel-owner@vger.kernel.org] On Behalf Of Andre Hedrick
Sent: Saturday, January 04, 2003 8:12 AM
To: linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org
Subject: Honest does not pay here ...


Well, all this goes to show you is that if you try to do the right thing
and you have something of value, you are attacked.

I have enjoyed begin called everything from a turncoat, backstabber,
cheater, liar, theif, weasle.

I guess I should not have said anything, and behaved like the rest.

You know the embedded, the appliance, etc ... resellers who we all know
close up the code and ship for commerial reasons.  Funny how they can do
it and nobody cares or they hide with a grin screaming NIMBY NIMBY.
Everyone is doing it and everyone looks away.

Best of all some of the worst name callers are the ones who use the code
I
wrote to enable them to make money.  Yet if you have something which
does
not exist in the kernel and you adopt an API to use kernel calls, you
get
branded and hated.

It could not have happened to a nicer loser, "fill in the blank" ...

Well you all have gotten all kinds of goodie for free, and I just want
to
keep one of my pieces of hard work that was created during the time I
was
booted out.

Well I was thinking of giving part of it to the community after I
recovered my costs of development, now I think not.

At least I have the integrity to state clearly my intentions, while the
rest hide and cower in corners.  This reminds me of a bucket of crabs.

Well I really wanted to use every dirty word in the book, but it is not
worth it.

I will plan to put "linux-ide.org" and "linuxdiskcert.org" up for sale.
Additionally I will try to arrange for a legal transfer of the NDA's
attached to "Linux ATA Development" to the individual or group who wish
to
purchase the access, pays all legal fees/work to to complete the
transaction.
I wisely attached any and all NDA's to the fore mentioned organization.

If you are interested, please contact me offline.
Please also have the means to purchase the information to be transferred
which is not covered by any of the NDA's.  This will include various
pieces of IP which was scheduled to be transfered to the kernel, but now
will only be for sale as an entire package.

The transaction for purchase will be executed via a wire transfer of
funds
to a specified account, once cleared it you will receive a manifest.

regards,

-ah

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More majordomo info at  http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html
Please read the FAQ at  http://www.tux.org/lkml/

Re: Honest does not pay here ...

[Andrew Walrond]

It seems you are very well regarded by those that matter, Andre.
And out voted, so pipe down and get back to work. (Please?)
Ignore the idiots, or flick them a smiley. Works for me ;)

Re: Honest does not pay here ...

[Andre Hedrick]

On Sat, 4 Jan 2003, Rik van Riel wrote:

> On Sat, 4 Jan 2003, Andre Hedrick wrote:
> 
> > Well, all this goes to show you is that if you try to do the right thing
> > and you have something of value, you are attacked.
> 
> Attacked by (mostly) a bunch of wankers who don't seem to do much
> useful themselves.  People who do useful work once in a while know
> how much effort you are putting into Linux drivers and appreciate
> the work you're doing.

No, people like "Hell.Surfers" do not bother me and had nothing to do with
this decision.  It is what came from my former peers, who do exactly what
I proposed, yet hide.

Harper Valley PTA come to mind.

Since that lot seems so worth to destroy my model, I am not sure if or
what I will do to force their hand of stealing from the cookie jar.

Never mind ...

--ah

Re: Honest does not pay here ...

[Mark Rutherford]

I for one, would very much like for you to continue your work with Linux
there are a lot of people that do not appreciate your work, or dont care.
Thank you for for doing what you have done.
I hope you reconsider.


Andre Hedrick wrote:

> On Sat, 4 Jan 2003, Rik van Riel wrote:
>
> > On Sat, 4 Jan 2003, Andre Hedrick wrote:
> >
> > > Well, all this goes to show you is that if you try to do the right thing
> > > and you have something of value, you are attacked.
> >
> > Attacked by (mostly) a bunch of wankers who don't seem to do much
> > useful themselves.  People who do useful work once in a while know
> > how much effort you are putting into Linux drivers and appreciate
> > the work you're doing.
>
> No, people like "Hell.Surfers" do not bother me and had nothing to do with
> this decision.  It is what came from my former peers, who do exactly what
> I proposed, yet hide.
>
> Harper Valley PTA come to mind.
>
> Since that lot seems so worth to destroy my model, I am not sure if or
> what I will do to force their hand of stealing from the cookie jar.
>
> Never mind ...
>
> --ah
>
> -
> To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in
> the body of a message to majordomo@vger.kernel.org
> More majordomo info at  http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html
> Please read the FAQ at  http://www.tux.org/lkml/

--
Regards,
Mark Rutherford
mark@justirc.net


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Re: Honest does not pay here ...

[brian]

On Sat, Jan 04, 2003 at 06:12:29AM -0800, Andre Hedrick wrote:
> 
> Well, all this goes to show you is that if you try to do the right thing
> and you have something of value, you are attacked.
> 
> I have enjoyed begin called everything from a turncoat, backstabber,
> cheater, liar, theif, weasle.

Microsloth sure does have it easy.  A word here, a word there...

-- 
Brian Litzinger

no hotplugging support (FIXME)

[Todd and Margo Chester]

Hi Jeff,

I am having a nasty problem with hot swapping a removable (not
eSATA) drive I use for backup on several servers.  It is reported
over on
http://bugs.centos.org/view.php?id=3391

Trying to help me find a work around to the problem at
http://www.centos.org/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=18608&start=0#forumpost68783
Alan posted your ata_piix.c code at
http://centos.toracat.org/ajb/tmp/toddandmargo/ata_piix.c
He pointed out

1483 /* no hotplugging support (FIXME) */
1484 if (!in_module_init)
1485 return -ENODEV;

What do you mean by the comment in line 1483?  Is there some
know issue with hot swapping SATA drives?

Many thanks,
-T

Re: no hotplugging support (FIXME)

[Alan Cox]

> 1483 /* no hotplugging support (FIXME) */
> 1484 if (!in_module_init)
> 1485 return -ENODEV;

The old code does not support PIIX controller hot plug - it does support
drive plugging

Re: no hotplugging support (FIXME)

[Robert Hancock]

Todd and Margo Chester wrote:
> Hi Jeff,
> 
> I am having a nasty problem with hot swapping a removable (not
> eSATA) drive I use for backup on several servers.  It is reported
> over on
> http://bugs.centos.org/view.php?id=3391
> 
> Trying to help me find a work around to the problem at
> http://www.centos.org/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=18608&start=0#forumpost68783 
> 
> Alan posted your ata_piix.c code at
> http://centos.toracat.org/ajb/tmp/toddandmargo/ata_piix.c
> He pointed out
> 
> 1483 /* no hotplugging support (FIXME) */
> 1484 if (!in_module_init)
> 1485 return -ENODEV;
> 
> What do you mean by the comment in line 1483?  Is there some
> know issue with hot swapping SATA drives?

If you're using the ata_piix driver then it means your motherboard is 
not in AHCI mode, so hotplugging is not supported by either the driver 
or controller. You have to enable AHCI for SATA hotplug to work on Intel 
controllers.

Re: no hotplugging support (FIXME)

[Todd and Margo Chester]

Robert Hancock wrote:
> Todd and Margo Chester wrote:
>> Robert Hancock wrote:
>>> Todd and Margo Chester wrote:
>>>> Hi Jeff,
>>>>
>>>> I am having a nasty problem with hot swapping a removable (not
>>>> eSATA) drive I use for backup on several servers.  It is reported
>>>> over on
>>>> http://bugs.centos.org/view.php?id=3391
>>>>
>>>> Trying to help me find a work around to the problem at
>>>> http://www.centos.org/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=18608&start=0#forumpost68783 
>>>>
>>>> Alan posted your ata_piix.c code at
>>>> http://centos.toracat.org/ajb/tmp/toddandmargo/ata_piix.c
>>>> He pointed out
>>>>
>>>> 1483 /* no hotplugging support (FIXME) */
>>>> 1484 if (!in_module_init)
>>>> 1485 return -ENODEV;
>>>>
>>>> What do you mean by the comment in line 1483?  Is there some
>>>> know issue with hot swapping SATA drives?
>>>
>>> If you're using the ata_piix driver then it means your motherboard is 
>>> not in AHCI mode, so hotplugging is not supported by either the 
>>> driver or controller. You have to enable AHCI for SATA hotplug to 
>>> work on Intel controllers.
>>>
>>
>> Hi Robers,
>>
>>    As far as I can tell, ACHI is turned on on my motherboard.
>> I have tried all variation in bios (one of them turns /dev/sdb
>> into /dev/hda).   Does not mean ACHI is working right.
>>
>>    Do you know of any reason why my kernel
>> (CentOS 5.2: 2.6.18-92.1.22.el5) would not support
>> (bugs, etc.) hotplugging?
>>
>>    Also, do you know of a utility that I can use to
>> ask ACHI what is has for me (give me a report)?
>>
>> Many thanks,
>> -T
> 
> If the device is in AHCI mode then the ata_piix driver won't load for it 
> - at least it won't in current kernels, I can't say for sure that it 
> won't in the CentOS 5 version.. You do need to get it using the ahci 
> driver instead of ata_piix or hotplug definitely won't work.
> 
> You can try changing the boot initrd to try to load the AHCI driver 
> instead by changing the scsi_hostadapter entry in /etc/modprobe.conf to 
> be ahci instead of ata_piix, then rebuilding the initrd or reinstalling 
> the kernel RPM. However, if the BIOS isn't set up properly for AHCI mode 
> to work, you'll have to either boot up in rescue mode and fix it, or 
> boot up from a different kernel entry in grub.

Hi Robert,

    Thank you.  I take it there is no probe of the AHCI module.  Rats!

My /etc/modprobe.conf (BIOS: Enhanced SATA Mode):

alias scsi_hostadapter sata_sil
alias eth1 e1000e
alias scsi_hostadapter1 megaraid_mbox
alias scsi_hostadapter2 ata_piix
alias snd-card-0 snd-intel8x0
options snd-card-0 index=0
options snd-intel8x0 index=0
remove snd-intel8x0 { /usr/sbin/alsactl store 0 >/dev/null 2>&1 || : ; 
}; /sbin/modprobe -r --ignore-remove snd-intel8x0

While fooling around with my BIOS, trying to see what happens
in the various SATA modes, the one called "ACHI Compatibility mode"
changed my removable drive from /dev/sdb to /dev/hda.  ("mount /dev/hda"
still hangs for two minutes, then the kernel freezes.)

I am wondering if there is a clue here.  Does the ACHI module load
drives as /dev/sd* or /dev/hd*?

Many thanks,
-T

p.s., just of curiosity, what would the ACHI module look
like in my modprobe.conf?

Re: no hotplugging support (FIXME)

[Robert Hancock]

Todd and Margo Chester wrote:
> Robert Hancock wrote:
>> Todd and Margo Chester wrote:
>>> Robert Hancock wrote:
>>>> Todd and Margo Chester wrote:
>>>>> Hi Jeff,
>>>>>
>>>>> I am having a nasty problem with hot swapping a removable (not
>>>>> eSATA) drive I use for backup on several servers.  It is reported
>>>>> over on
>>>>> http://bugs.centos.org/view.php?id=3391
>>>>>
>>>>> Trying to help me find a work around to the problem at
>>>>> http://www.centos.org/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=18608&start=0#forumpost68783 
>>>>>
>>>>> Alan posted your ata_piix.c code at
>>>>> http://centos.toracat.org/ajb/tmp/toddandmargo/ata_piix.c
>>>>> He pointed out
>>>>>
>>>>> 1483 /* no hotplugging support (FIXME) */
>>>>> 1484 if (!in_module_init)
>>>>> 1485 return -ENODEV;
>>>>>
>>>>> What do you mean by the comment in line 1483?  Is there some
>>>>> know issue with hot swapping SATA drives?
>>>>
>>>> If you're using the ata_piix driver then it means your motherboard 
>>>> is not in AHCI mode, so hotplugging is not supported by either the 
>>>> driver or controller. You have to enable AHCI for SATA hotplug to 
>>>> work on Intel controllers.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Hi Robers,
>>>
>>>    As far as I can tell, ACHI is turned on on my motherboard.
>>> I have tried all variation in bios (one of them turns /dev/sdb
>>> into /dev/hda).   Does not mean ACHI is working right.
>>>
>>>    Do you know of any reason why my kernel
>>> (CentOS 5.2: 2.6.18-92.1.22.el5) would not support
>>> (bugs, etc.) hotplugging?
>>>
>>>    Also, do you know of a utility that I can use to
>>> ask ACHI what is has for me (give me a report)?
>>>
>>> Many thanks,
>>> -T
>>
>> If the device is in AHCI mode then the ata_piix driver won't load for 
>> it - at least it won't in current kernels, I can't say for sure that 
>> it won't in the CentOS 5 version.. You do need to get it using the 
>> ahci driver instead of ata_piix or hotplug definitely won't work.
>>
>> You can try changing the boot initrd to try to load the AHCI driver 
>> instead by changing the scsi_hostadapter entry in /etc/modprobe.conf 
>> to be ahci instead of ata_piix, then rebuilding the initrd or 
>> reinstalling the kernel RPM. However, if the BIOS isn't set up 
>> properly for AHCI mode to work, you'll have to either boot up in 
>> rescue mode and fix it, or boot up from a different kernel entry in grub.
> 
> Hi Robert,
> 
>    Thank you.  I take it there is no probe of the AHCI module.  Rats!
> 
> My /etc/modprobe.conf (BIOS: Enhanced SATA Mode):
> 
> alias scsi_hostadapter sata_sil
> alias eth1 e1000e
> alias scsi_hostadapter1 megaraid_mbox
> alias scsi_hostadapter2 ata_piix
> alias snd-card-0 snd-intel8x0
> options snd-card-0 index=0
> options snd-intel8x0 index=0
> remove snd-intel8x0 { /usr/sbin/alsactl store 0 >/dev/null 2>&1 || : ; 
> }; /sbin/modprobe -r --ignore-remove snd-intel8x0

In CentOS 5 this file mainly gets set up by the installer. If you change 
your BIOS settings you'd have to change it manually and rebuild the 
initrd for the changes to take effect.

> 
> While fooling around with my BIOS, trying to see what happens
> in the various SATA modes, the one called "ACHI Compatibility mode"
> changed my removable drive from /dev/sdb to /dev/hda.  ("mount /dev/hda"
> still hangs for two minutes, then the kernel freezes.)

Yeah, compatbility mode likely isn't what you want. It likely sets up 
the controller for IDE mode.

Motherboard makers are sometimes pretty bad about labelling the settings 
properly. Often AHCI is labelled as RAID mode or something.

> 
> I am wondering if there is a clue here.  Does the ACHI module load
> drives as /dev/sd* or /dev/hd*?

It will be sd*

> 
> Many thanks,
> -T
> 
> p.s., just of curiosity, what would the ACHI module look
> like in my modprobe.conf?

You would change:

alias scsi_hostadapter2 ata_piix

to

alias scsi_hostadapter2 ahci

Re: no hotplugging support (FIXME)

[Todd and Margo Chester]

Robert Hancock wrote:
>> p.s., just of curiosity, what would the ACHI module look
>> like in my modprobe.conf?
> 
> You would change:
> 
> alias scsi_hostadapter2 ata_piix
> 
> to
> 
> alias scsi_hostadapter2 ahci
> 
Thank you!

Question: would that be in addition to or a substitute
for?  (I am concerned that my SATA DVD/CD burner would
stop working.)

Also, I downloaded the recent manual for my motherboard.
The section has a new option not on my BIOS (1.2a)
called "SATA ACHI Mode: on|off".  The current BIOS is
2.1a -- I think it is time I ordered a new BIOS chip
(I don't flash.  I remove and replace the chip.  That way
I can go back if things go wrong, which has happened to
me before.)

Many thanks,
-T

Re: no hotplugging support (FIXME)

[Robert Hancock]

Todd and Margo Chester wrote:
> Robert Hancock wrote:
>>> p.s., just of curiosity, what would the ACHI module look
>>> like in my modprobe.conf?
>>
>> You would change:
>>
>> alias scsi_hostadapter2 ata_piix
>>
>> to
>>
>> alias scsi_hostadapter2 ahci
>>
> Thank you!
> 
> Question: would that be in addition to or a substitute
> for?  (I am concerned that my SATA DVD/CD burner would
> stop working.)

Normally all the ports are AHCI if it's switched into that mode, so it 
shouldn't be an issue. However, you could leave in ata_piix as the third 
entry, so that the system will still boot if it's not in AHCI mode 
properly. There's no real harm in having unnecessary drivers in there..

> 
> Also, I downloaded the recent manual for my motherboard.
> The section has a new option not on my BIOS (1.2a)
> called "SATA ACHI Mode: on|off".  The current BIOS is
> 2.1a -- I think it is time I ordered a new BIOS chip
> (I don't flash.  I remove and replace the chip.  That way
> I can go back if things go wrong, which has happened to
> me before.)
> 
> Many thanks,
> -T

Re: no hotplugging support (FIXME)

[Todd and Margo Chester]

Robert Hancock wrote:

> Normally all the ports are AHCI if it's switched into that mode, so it 
> shouldn't be an issue. However, you could leave in ata_piix as the third 
> entry, so that the system will still boot if it's not in AHCI mode 
> properly. There's no real harm in having unnecessary drivers in there..

Sorry for the thousand questions.  Thank you for being so gracious.

Question: once I boot up, is there a way to tell which drive
is using which driver?

Many thanks,
-T

Re: no hotplugging support (FIXME)

[Robert Hancock]

Todd and Margo Chester wrote:
> Robert Hancock wrote:
> 
>> Normally all the ports are AHCI if it's switched into that mode, so it 
>> shouldn't be an issue. However, you could leave in ata_piix as the 
>> third entry, so that the system will still boot if it's not in AHCI 
>> mode properly. There's no real harm in having unnecessary drivers in 
>> there..
> 
> Sorry for the thousand questions.  Thank you for being so gracious.
> 
> Question: once I boot up, is there a way to tell which drive
> is using which driver?

You should be able to tell from the bootup dmesg output which driver 
ends up detecting the ports..

Re: no hotplugging support (FIXME)

[Todd and Margo Chester]

Robert Hancock wrote:
> Todd and Margo Chester wrote:
>> Robert Hancock wrote:
>>>> p.s., just of curiosity, what would the ACHI module look
>>>> like in my modprobe.conf?
>>>
>>> You would change:
>>>
>>> alias scsi_hostadapter2 ata_piix
>>>
>>> to
>>>
>>> alias scsi_hostadapter2 ahci
>>>
>> Thank you!
>>
>> Question: would that be in addition to or a substitute
>> for?  (I am concerned that my SATA DVD/CD burner would
>> stop working.)
> 
> Normally all the ports are AHCI if it's switched into that mode, so it 
> shouldn't be an issue. However, you could leave in ata_piix as the third 
> entry, so that the system will still boot if it's not in AHCI mode 
> properly. There's no real harm in having unnecessary drivers in there..

Once I get the achi module all loaded up correctly, would
I be able to get away with

alias scsi_hostadapter2 ahci
alias scsi_hostadapter3 ata_piix

in my /etc/modprobe.conf?

Re: no hotplugging support (FIXME)

[Todd and Margo Chester]

Robert Hancock wrote:
> Todd and Margo Chester wrote:
>> Robert Hancock wrote:
>>> Todd and Margo Chester wrote:
>>>> Hi Jeff,
>>>>
>>>> I am having a nasty problem with hot swapping a removable (not
>>>> eSATA) drive I use for backup on several servers.  It is reported
>>>> over on
>>>> http://bugs.centos.org/view.php?id=3391
>>>>
>>>> Trying to help me find a work around to the problem at
>>>> http://www.centos.org/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=18608&start=0#forumpost68783 
>>>>
>>>> Alan posted your ata_piix.c code at
>>>> http://centos.toracat.org/ajb/tmp/toddandmargo/ata_piix.c
>>>> He pointed out
>>>>
>>>> 1483 /* no hotplugging support (FIXME) */
>>>> 1484 if (!in_module_init)
>>>> 1485 return -ENODEV;
>>>>
>>>> What do you mean by the comment in line 1483?  Is there some
>>>> know issue with hot swapping SATA drives?
>>>
>>> If you're using the ata_piix driver then it means your motherboard is 
>>> not in AHCI mode, so hotplugging is not supported by either the 
>>> driver or controller. You have to enable AHCI for SATA hotplug to 
>>> work on Intel controllers.
>>>
>>
>> Hi Robers,
>>
>>    As far as I can tell, ACHI is turned on on my motherboard.
>> I have tried all variation in bios (one of them turns /dev/sdb
>> into /dev/hda).   Does not mean ACHI is working right.
>>
>>    Do you know of any reason why my kernel
>> (CentOS 5.2: 2.6.18-92.1.22.el5) would not support
>> (bugs, etc.) hotplugging?
>>
>>    Also, do you know of a utility that I can use to
>> ask ACHI what is has for me (give me a report)?
>>
>> Many thanks,
>> -T
> 
> If the device is in AHCI mode then the ata_piix driver won't load for it 
> - at least it won't in current kernels, I can't say for sure that it 
> won't in the CentOS 5 version.. You do need to get it using the ahci 
> driver instead of ata_piix or hotplug definitely won't work.
> 
> You can try changing the boot initrd to try to load the AHCI driver 
> instead by changing the scsi_hostadapter entry in /etc/modprobe.conf to 
> be ahci instead of ata_piix, then rebuilding the initrd or reinstalling 
> the kernel RPM. However, if the BIOS isn't set up properly for AHCI mode 
> to work, you'll have to either boot up in rescue mode and fix it, or 
> boot up from a different kernel entry in grub.
> 

Hi Robert,

I have

$ modprobe --dry-run -v ahci
insmod /lib/modules/2.6.18-92.1.22.el5/kernel/drivers/ata/ahci.ko

in my system.  Do I just use "modprobe" to install the module
and go edit /etc/modprobe.conf?

And, does the modprobe insertion stay permanent (survives a reboot)?

I am confused   :-[   Can you point me to a link that gives the
directions?

-T

Re: no hotplugging support (FIXME)

[Robert Hancock]

Todd and Margo Chester wrote:
> Robert Hancock wrote:
>> Todd and Margo Chester wrote:
>>> Robert Hancock wrote:
>>>> Todd and Margo Chester wrote:
>>>>> Hi Jeff,
>>>>>
>>>>> I am having a nasty problem with hot swapping a removable (not
>>>>> eSATA) drive I use for backup on several servers.  It is reported
>>>>> over on
>>>>> http://bugs.centos.org/view.php?id=3391
>>>>>
>>>>> Trying to help me find a work around to the problem at
>>>>> http://www.centos.org/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=18608&start=0#forumpost68783 
>>>>>
>>>>> Alan posted your ata_piix.c code at
>>>>> http://centos.toracat.org/ajb/tmp/toddandmargo/ata_piix.c
>>>>> He pointed out
>>>>>
>>>>> 1483 /* no hotplugging support (FIXME) */
>>>>> 1484 if (!in_module_init)
>>>>> 1485 return -ENODEV;
>>>>>
>>>>> What do you mean by the comment in line 1483?  Is there some
>>>>> know issue with hot swapping SATA drives?
>>>>
>>>> If you're using the ata_piix driver then it means your motherboard 
>>>> is not in AHCI mode, so hotplugging is not supported by either the 
>>>> driver or controller. You have to enable AHCI for SATA hotplug to 
>>>> work on Intel controllers.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Hi Robers,
>>>
>>>    As far as I can tell, ACHI is turned on on my motherboard.
>>> I have tried all variation in bios (one of them turns /dev/sdb
>>> into /dev/hda).   Does not mean ACHI is working right.
>>>
>>>    Do you know of any reason why my kernel
>>> (CentOS 5.2: 2.6.18-92.1.22.el5) would not support
>>> (bugs, etc.) hotplugging?
>>>
>>>    Also, do you know of a utility that I can use to
>>> ask ACHI what is has for me (give me a report)?
>>>
>>> Many thanks,
>>> -T
>>
>> If the device is in AHCI mode then the ata_piix driver won't load for 
>> it - at least it won't in current kernels, I can't say for sure that 
>> it won't in the CentOS 5 version.. You do need to get it using the 
>> ahci driver instead of ata_piix or hotplug definitely won't work.
>>
>> You can try changing the boot initrd to try to load the AHCI driver 
>> instead by changing the scsi_hostadapter entry in /etc/modprobe.conf 
>> to be ahci instead of ata_piix, then rebuilding the initrd or 
>> reinstalling the kernel RPM. However, if the BIOS isn't set up 
>> properly for AHCI mode to work, you'll have to either boot up in 
>> rescue mode and fix it, or boot up from a different kernel entry in grub.
>>
> 
> Hi Robert,
> 
> I have
> 
> $ modprobe --dry-run -v ahci
> insmod /lib/modules/2.6.18-92.1.22.el5/kernel/drivers/ata/ahci.ko
> 
> in my system.  Do I just use "modprobe" to install the module
> and go edit /etc/modprobe.conf?
> 
> And, does the modprobe insertion stay permanent (survives a reboot)?

Running modprobe only loads the module for the current session. You have 
to edit /etc/modprobe.conf to get it to be loaded on boot-up. Also, 
since this driver is needed to mount the root filesystem, you have to 
rebuild the initrd afterwards so that it will contain that driver - you 
should be able to do:

mkinird -f /boot/initrd-2.6.18-92.1.22.el5.img 2.6.18-92.1.22.el5

> 
> I am confused   :-[   Can you point me to a link that gives the
> directions?
> 
> -T